I'd like some critique on the following two talents. My design goal is to represent a quick summon where the spellcaster can take another action after conjuring something. And to be able to concentrate on that summon as an incidental.

My main idea behind this is a character who summons a weapon to use and attacks in the same round. Using the conjure spell as a stand-in for drawing a weapon. But it could easily be a summoner who fights alongside their conjured pet.

Tireless Summons
Tier: 2
Activation: Active (Incidental)
Ranked: No

Once per round on your turn, your character may use this talent to perform the concentrate manoeuvre on a conjure spell.

Quick Summoner
Tier: 2
Activation: Active (Incidental)
Ranked: No

Your character may spend one story point to cast the conjure spell as a manoeuvre with a net result of . If you do so, you suffer a number of strain equal to the difficulty of the spell, in addition to the 2 strain suffered due to casting a spell. This number may not exceed your ranks in your spellcasting skill.

I had a player with a fresh out of the box (as in base XP) magic caster character summon a friendly (allied) silhouette three dragon. I think the conjuration action is fairly powerful as it is. Allowing a caster to maintain a conjuration/summoning with an incidental for a single 10 XP expenditure might be a bit much. Making Tireless Summons a ranked talent that allows the caster to use it a number of times per encounter equal to their ranks in the talent might be a bit more balanced.

5 hours ago, c__beck said:

Tireless Summons
Tier: 2
Activation: Active (Incidental)
Ranked: No

Once per round on your turn, your character may use this talent to perform the concentrate manoeuvre on a conjure spell.

This seems a bit powerful for T2. Basically eliminates the need to concentrate ever on a Summon. Maybe limit it to once per session?

Once per session, a creature the character summons remains until the end of the encounter.

Then you can have an improved version that improves it until the end of the session.

My two cents.

1 hour ago, ESP77 said:

This seems a bit powerful for T2. Basically eliminates the need to concentrate ever on a Summon. Maybe limit it to once per session?

Once per session, a creature the character summons remains until the end of the encounter.

Then you can have an improved version that improves it until the end of the session.

My two cents.

I agree, a T2 Talent is not the equivalent of the Druidic Circlet. Should it be possible? Sure, but not for that little a cost at that low level. An item can be lost, it has Encumbrance, etc. probably needs to be a T4 talent.

Quick Summoner is far worse though, it literally lets you spend a Story Point (fairly accessible), a manoeuvre (a cheap commodity) and suffer 5 Strain (so less than half of their Strain Threshold) to successfully summon a difficulty 5 thing... at tier 2... that’s two Silhouette 3 Friends ? It’s almost the most broken talent I have ever seen!!!

It needs a Silhouette limit, a difficulty limit, or a once per session limit. Then make it t3

Quick summons has a difficulty limit already, the difficulty can't exceed your ranks in your spellcasting skill. But I think it could be better done as a ranked talent with a difficulty limit of your ranks. Would that be ok for a rank 2? Or rank 3? I can see this being a once-per-encounter thing, though, yeah.

As for tireless summons, again I point to my design goal: one who summons the gear they normally fight with to allow them to have the full range of manoeuvres (specifically melee weapons since you want both manoeuvres to move and/or aim). I worded it as it is—as opposed to how the druid circlet requires no action/manoeuvre on behalf of the caster—so the GM can still spend to lose the benefits of one manoeuvre (and thus breaking concentration).

Would it be better to limit it to conjured items instead of any conjuration?

T2 for ranked Quick Summon should be fine, it’s much less potent with a difficulty limit of 1 or 2. Then by T4 it’s competing against other really powerful talents for players xp.

Conjured items would be a great way to limit tireless summon

How's this for a rework?

Quick Summoner
Tier: 2
Activation: Active (Incidental)
Ranked: Yes
Your character may spend a Story Point to cast the conjure spell as maneuver instead of an action, with a net result of . You suffer a number of strain equal to the Difficulty of the spell, which cannot exceed your ranks in Quick Summoner.

I'm still not sold on the verbiage, however. I want to make sure it's apparent that you don't roll, it just "happens" and succeeds with one uncancelled success.

And a rework of tireless summoner.

Lasting Conjuration
Tier: 3
Activation: Active (Incidental)
Ranked: No
When you cast the Conjure spell to summon an item, you may suffer one additional strain. If you do so, concentrating on that Conjure spell is an incidental, instead of a manoeuvre, for the rest of the scene.

5 hours ago, c__beck said:

I'm still not sold on the verbiage, however. I want to make sure it's apparent that you don't roll, it just "happens" and succeeds with one uncancelled success.

Quick Summoner
Tier: 2
Activation: Active (Incidental)
Ranked: Yes
Your character may spend a Story Point to cast the conjure spell as maneuver instead of an action. First determine the Difficulty of the spell, you suffer a number of strain equal to the Difficulty in addition to the normal two Strain for casting the spell. The spell is automatically cast as if you rolled a single Success. The difficulty of the spell cannot exceed your ranks in Quick Summoner.

better?