So, I personally haven't tried this out (YET) but is the combi of Dengar + Fearlessness worth it?
I mean, its possible of course, with 8 possible hits every round PROVIDED you are at range one, have P1 title and the enemy fires at dengar, and you shoot twice on the same ship.
But is it worth instead of PTL, VI, Lone Wolf, Predator or Expertise? (I mean Expertise is currently Dengars go-to EPT, but besides that)
The range 1 limit really hurts it. Not worth it.
Yea, really PTL or Expertise are so good on Dengar its hard to go in another direction.
Edited by bamhvacYeah, unless you have another way of getting double mods and/or repositioning to help guarantee those range 1 shots then Expertise , PtL, Lone Wolf and Predator all probably net you more total damage than Fearlessness would (and they should, seeing as how they all cost more points than fearlessness).
Now, Maul on Dengar, possibly with PtL... that sounds like a fun combo. I might have to try that.
PTL? What kind of Dengars are you flying?
With EU and the crew providing dice mods (like K4 or Maul), maybe. Otherwise, i’m not so sure the opportunity cost of Fearlessness is worth it.
Also, Fearlessness must have both attacker and defender in each other’s arc, meaning getting behind someone with a sloop sacrifices Fearlessness.
3 minutes ago, Herowannabe said:Now, Maul on Dengar, possibly with PtL... that sounds like a fun combo. I might have to try that.
Well Maul gives you stress, and PTL does so too... You can not do PTL for double mods and then Maul, since Maul requires you to be stressless...
Maybe on a cheap dengar, but he still needs a way to mod his dice.
Fearlessness works on Boba Fett because he can do it out both arcs and gets rerolls.
12 minutes ago, bamhvac said:Yea, really PTL or Expertise are so good on Dengar its hard to go in another direction.
That'll be that asymmetrical dial.
Edited by FTS GeckoI had a friend try it back in the Dengaroo days. It didn't work so well as Lone Wolf. I don't think it'll work so well as Lone Wolf does now (LW + Gonk + Experimental Interface is amazing).
However, I don't hate it. Going K4 Security Droid and Fearlessness would still provide a dice-modification action even when barrel rolling to get arc. The math backs it up, too, with really similar average hit numbers and chance of 4+ or 3+ hits, if you're able to trigger Fearlessness. On the other hand, if you're at range 2 or not arc-to-arc, you'll get nothing for the 1 point. Expertise and Lone Wolf don't care about such things. However, it's a really cheap upgrade, and cheapness can sometimes be better than power.
Alternately, Fearlessness might be good on Contracted Scouts. They've got wide front arcs, and adding a hit is going to go a lot further on a 2-dice attack than a 3-dice one. Meanwhile, you've also got the barrel roll to set up those shots, and the White S-Loop. With the lower PS 3, if someone is chasing you, you might have a pretty good chance to catch them flying into the teeth of something pretty nasty.
Anyhow, put it on a table. This seems like the kind of thing which, no matter how well it seems to compare on paper, will only be understood in the actual geometry of the table.
1 hour ago, Wookiee_Slayer said:Well Maul gives you stress, and PTL does so too... You can not do PTL for double mods and then Maul, since Maul requires you to be stressless...
Maul also clears stress.
24 minutes ago, Herowannabe said:Maul also clears stress.
So you are ignoring Maul's rerolls and just taking him for clearing stress?
If you only have the PtL stress and hit with your initial shot you could use Maul to clear that stress, freeing him up for the reroll on the revenge shot. Dial up a green and do it all again next turn.
it seems like majority of people use maul to clear stress rather than the reroll unless Ezra is around (since it also enables a crit mod)
1 hour ago, Herowannabe said:Maul also clears stress.
Yes, but only one stress at the time IF you actually land a hit...
4 minutes ago, thatdave said:If you only have the PtL stress and hit with your initial shot you could use Maul to clear that stress, freeing him up for the reroll on the revenge shot. Dial up a green and do it all again next turn.
Yes but then you get up to 3 stresses from Maul on the revenge shot, which then limits the use of PTL next round and therefore also the mods you can make with the first attack....
2 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:it seems like majority of people use maul to clear stress rather than the reroll unless Ezra is around (since it also enables a crit mod)
I just do not get why you wouldn't use something that is essentially Zuckuss for your own Attack Dice? I mean Zuckuss is cool right?
Edited by Wookiee_Slayer2 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:That'll be that asymmetrical dial.
Well played sir, well played!
27 minutes ago, Wookiee_Slayer said:Yes, but only one stress at the time IF you actually land a hit...
Yes but then you get up to 3 stresses from Maul on the revenge shot, which then limits the use of PTL next round and therefore also the mods you can make with the first attack....
I just do not get why you wouldn't use something that is essentially Zuckuss for your own Attack Dice? I mean Zuckuss is cool right?
You would, in theory, only have a single stress from the Push. If you come into the turn (or somehow manage to acquire multiple stress) then all bets are off. But if you do have the single Push stress you could (potentially) clear that on your first shot. On the second shot only reroll one die, if you even need to reroll any - they might all hit
32 minutes ago, SabineKey said:So you are ignoring Maul's rerolls and just taking him for clearing stress?
well you could clear on the first attack, and get rerolls on the revenge attack, reroll 2, clear one if it hits, and green maneuver to clear, rinse and repeat... but not that optimal, LW is consistently better on a maulgar tho
5 minutes ago, CMDR Ytterium said:well you could clear on the first attack, and get rerolls on the revenge attack, reroll 2, clear one if it hits, and green maneuver to clear, rinse and repeat... but not that optimal, LW is consistently better on a maulgar tho
Yeah, that’s some of the feed back i’m getting. I’m a bit dubious on how well it would preform, but i’ve been wrong about combos before.
3 hours ago, SabineKey said:So you are ignoring Maul's rerolls and just taking him for clearing stress?
what @thatdave said:
2 hours ago, thatdave said:If you only have the PtL stress and hit with your initial shot you could use Maul to clear that stress, freeing him up for the reroll on the revenge shot. Dial up a green and do it all again next turn.
In my experience, Maul's greatest strength is not the rerolls OR the stress clearing individually, but rather, his flexibility. You can use either or both abilities, as needed. Going up a stressbot or tactitian or Asajj list? Great, pick up targetlocks for the rerolls and use Maul and green maneuvers to clear 2-3 stress per round. Don't have any stress when you're making an attack? Use Maul to reroll that one blank you got and then clear the stress. And so on.
Granted, it may not be THE best crew for Dengar (PTL or no), but at the very least it should be fun.
It seems like the best EPT for him now. It's pretty easy to get Range 1 with his barrel roll and 4 straights
I really like fearlessness on Ketsu and Bossk. The big difference there is that ketsu with K4 and fearlessness is almost never not getting 4-5 hits and usually has a focus to spend too. On top of that, she has other synergy with range 1 that makes the fearlessness hurt even harder. On Bossk with Cluster missiles, fearlessness, dengar, k4, and chips you have 2 rerolls on each of the 2 attacks, chips on 1, focus on 1 and the fearlessness added twice, as well as Bossk splitting 1-2 crits into extra hits. I love fearlessness in both of those contexts.
The issue I see with Dengar (after nerfs) is that he likely doesnt have mods on more than 1 shot. With him shooting twice, potentially, but only having either a single focus or a single target lock and no other mods means that fearlessness probably nets the same or less damage as expertise would. Expertise is more points but also works every time you fire while unstressed and thus will trigger a lot more often than fearlessness.
On 3/13/2018 at 5:02 PM, Wookiee_Slayer said:So, I personally haven't tried this out (YET) but is the combi of Dengar + Fearlessness worth it?
I mean, its possible of course, with 8 possible hits every round PROVIDED you are at range one, have P1 title and the enemy fires at dengar, and you shoot twice on the same ship.
It is maximum 10 hits with p1 at r1, right?
(4 primary attacks + 1 hit )x2
Edited by westiebestieOn 3/13/2018 at 12:02 PM, Wookiee_Slayer said:So, I personally haven't tried this out (YET) but is the combi of Dengar + Fearlessness worth it?
I mean, its possible of course, with 8 possible hits every round PROVIDED you are at range one, have P1 title and the enemy fires at dengar, and you shoot twice on the same ship.
But is it worth instead of PTL, VI, Lone Wolf, Predator or Expertise? (I mean Expertise is currently Dengars go-to EPT, but besides that)
if you're playing dengar in the hopes of arc dodging or getting him to late game 1 on 1, its less than useless (arc-dodging negates fearlessness, and getting in range one early is a great way to die against many lists)
However if you're trying to psych your opponent out and bum-rush with dengar for max damage before he goes down, it could be great. you can probably rely on 2 damage each shot against 3 agility, more against low agility.... so you might expect to kill your average ace or fighter the first combat, or with focus fire you could maybe kill a large ship too. sooo
Dengar: title, Fearlessness, glitterstim
Concord dawn veteran: fearlessness, title and autothrusters
Concord dawn veteran: fearlessness, title and autothrusters
not saying it rules but it could trash someone on a successful joust