Supression is definitely per unit. As in 1 point supressed. Two points panicked. It’s what makes leaders so important.

Yes your stuff will be supressed a lot but you can clear it with that dice roll when they activate. Otherwise it will be about carefully deciding who to go where. It also balances the value of super cheap infantry against quite expensive vehicles who most of the time can’t claim objectives.

The suppression mechanics is very similar to Bolt Action's pins. It definitely makes keeping your commander in order range of your troopers even more important.

I got to play my first (and probably only before release) demo game today. I was surprised at how small the minis are. Also it seemed like I couldn't keep suppression tokens on his guys, but I didn't focus fire that well either.

28 minutes ago, NukeMaster said:

I was surprised at how small the minis are.

Wow, really? What were you going in expecting, lol

5 hours ago, guest450670 said:

Wow, really? What were you going in expecting, lol

Someone early on quoted ffg as the models being 32-34mm scale. The models aren't this scale, they're 32-34mm tall which makes them 28mm scale. Scale is measured from eye level to feet in models.

11 hours ago, beefcake4000 said:

Supression is definitely per unit. As in 1 point supressed. Two points panicked. It’s what makes leaders so important.

Yes your stuff will be supressed a lot but you can clear it with that dice roll when they activate. Otherwise it will be about carefully deciding who to go where. It also balances the value of super cheap infantry against quite expensive vehicles who most of the time can’t claim objectives.

That's a one in three chance to clear each point of suppression (plus one at the end of the round). Meaning if you activate with one point, you are likely (2 in 3) to be suppressed. If you activate with 2 you have a fair chance (44%) of running straight back out of the map, and a 89% chance of being suppressed. If you activate with three you'll panic 90% of the time, and be suppressed 97% of the time.

Remember that panic is a full move (usually) backwards. If you recover you're suppressed (remember a mortar can add 2 points pretty much whenever it likes). So at best you can get back to the spot you started and do nothing else, or you can recover and clear your suppression, and then the next turn get back to where you started with an action to spend.

That's bloody miserable.

Erm, just to clarify, the mortar on the ATST has a one in three chance of wiping out a Rebel unit on the first turn. For 10 points. The unit will run off the table never having fired a shot.

Every turn, that's 2 suppression, as a secondary attack, almost anywhere on the table. Once a unit breaks, it's likely to stay broken.

15 minutes ago, Weatsop said:

Erm, just to clarify, the mortar on the ATST has a one in three chance of wiping out a Rebel unit on the first turn. For 10 points. The unit will run off the table never having fired a shot.

That assumes you've deployed within Line of Sight, and within a full move of the table edge. Sometimes that'll be the case, depending on terrain/deployment card, but it shouldn't usually be.

I don't think you can not be within one move of the edge? And LOS to ANY squad? Please.

In any case, you're likely to have Luke. My point is simply that there's way too much suppression on the table for infantry to do a **** thing. Vehicle will rule.

10 minutes ago, Weatsop said:

I don't think you can not be within one move of the edge?

I think of the 4 cards I've seen for setup, two limit you to range 1 when you set up and two let you go further in (although they don't require it), so I'm going to assume that'd work on about half the fields. At least 1 would show up during the "Define the Battlefield" step.

If you deploy within LoS of a Mortar AT-ST and out of range of your commander you deserve to be run off the edge.

Yeah, it’s powerful. But analyzing suppression rules in a vacuum makes them seem more powerful than they are.

7 minutes ago, HadeusHawkyns said:

I think of the 4 cards I've seen for setup, two limit you to range 1 when you set up and two let you go further in (although they don't require it), so I'm going to assume that'd work on about half the fields. At least 1 would show up during the "Define the Battlefield" step.

Is Range 1= speed 1?

Just now, bageldrone said:

Is Range 1= speed 1?

No. Assuming each range is the same length, I think Range 1 is 6 inches. That said, I think they have to move their full speed away, and your basic corp units are Speed 2. I think I was reading someone else say that's somewhere around Range 1 either way.

1 hour ago, Weatsop said:

That's bloody miserable.

Erm, just to clarify, the mortar on the ATST has a one in three chance of wiping out a Rebel unit on the first turn. For 10 points. The unit will run off the table never having fired a shot.

Every turn, that's 2 suppression, as a secondary attack, almost anywhere on the table. Once a unit breaks, it's likely to stay broken.

IF the unit is out of range of a commander, yes. As long as you stay within 18" of a commander, you use their morale value for determining if you panic. So Leia and Veers will keep your units from panicking until they have 4 supression tokens (and they both can remove some each turn), Luke will keep them form panicking until they have 6, and being near Vader is scarier than anything the enemy can throw at Imperial Soldiers. And when you have more tokens, that means a higher chance or Rally to remove one or more of them- To reliably panic a unit in Luke's bubble, you need it to have 9 supression tokens.

2 hours ago, Weatsop said:

Erm, just to clarify, the mortar on the ATST has a one in three chance of wiping out a Rebel unit on the first turn. For 10 points. The unit will run off the table never having fired a shot.

Besides your math being incorrect (working out the math for at least one hit on three white dice is roughly 33%, then as the Rebel unit checks for dropping Suppression tokens prior to activating, so about a 55% chance of rolling at least one hit or crit on a white die, removing a Suppression token and removing Panic.... unless I messed something up), I disagree with your points evaluation. You have to include the cost of the AT-ST, as that is part of the cost in order to get a Mortar, so the cost of having a mortar on the board is 205 points.

1 hour ago, HadeusHawkyns said:

No. Assuming each range is the same length, I think Range 1 is 6 inches. That said, I think they have to move their full speed away, and your basic corp units are Speed 2. I think I was reading someone else say that's somewhere around Range 1 either way.

Base size| Speed 1| Speed 2 |Speed 3

27mm | 4.06 | 6.16 | 8.36

50mm | 4.97 | 7.07 | 9.27

70mm | 5.76 | 7.86 | 10.06

100mm | 6.94 | 9.04 | 11.24

All movements worked out in inches using measurements found on the forum

Ranges are multiples of 6 inches according to what I have seen from openings/postings on here. So Range 1 = 6", Range 2 = 12" etc.

15 hours ago, Weatsop said:

(Also, well, the meaning of the word impassible is sort of conflicting with the "ignores terrain" part, but I guess they'll have to clarify that).

Not really. Special rule overrides base rule. It's easy to forget that Speeder is a special rule because currently there aren't any repulsor vehicles without it. As soon as we get the Occupier tank from Rogue One will have a model that doesn't have a rule that lets it ignore terrain that is otherwise impassible to it.

What I took away from the demo was that suppression is the game's secret sauce. It makes activation order more interesting than the usual "which model do I think I'll lose if I don't activate it first" and makes you consider your options a little more evenly as you have to consider that a "safe" unit might still find themselves suppressed if you don't take the opportunity to activate them early. It also has an interesting influence on the game in the way it limits the value of focused fire. It's often better to spread damage around and reduce enemy numbers and actions rather than wiping them to the man both because they lose effectiveness and because its harder to kill a suppressed unit, which is more interesting than the way game's generally reward target priority. It also does create something of an assassination mechanic, where taking out the enemy commander can trigger flight in units fairly easily.

Ultimately, when I read the rules I thought they felt like someone played a bunch of 40k and implemented all the things they thought would "fix" it. When I played, the suppression mechanic was really the thing that stood out as something more inspired and innovative. Nothing about the suppression mechanic itself is super unique, mind you, but the way it interacts with other rules in the system makes it the most important rule in the book for me.

3 hours ago, Weatsop said:

Erm, just to clarify, the mortar on the ATST has a one in three chance of wiping out a Rebel unit on the first turn. For 10 points. The unit will run off the table never having fired a shot.

Every turn, that's 2 suppression, as a secondary attack, almost anywhere on the table. Once a unit breaks, it's likely to stay broken.

The probability and points cost here were addressed already, but I just wanted to add: if this is happening on every turn, you are likely playing on a table without enough terrain to make for an interesting game.

And if it happens on the first turn, well... shame on you.

20 minutes ago, nashjaee said:

And if it happens on the first turn, well... shame on you.

It does have an 18" minimum range. If its not shooting first turn its probably not getting shot. Combined with a battlefield condition that makes it actually impossible to shoot until Turn 3 and I don't think the Mortar will be very popular in the long run.

19 hours ago, Weatsop said:

Yeah, as Nuke says: if you spend a pivot at the end of your turn, you probably wont crash. But then when are you shooting? You'll only have your compulsory maximum move to aim up a shot. Then shoot, then pivot.

More importantly, you're restricting your tactical options for the next round. You have to give it to a direction where you won't run into anything, and then you have to do your compulsory move at full speed in that direction. Does that point you in a useful direction? Are you going to end up in a position where you can shoot, even if you pivot with your first action? If you pivot and then shoot, you are not repositioning at all on that turn. It's not only about not running into terrain, it's about not wasting a units actions or having it not do anything useful for the entire game!

1 hour ago, LunarSol said:

It does have an 18" minimum range. If its not shooting first turn its probably not getting shot. Combined with a battlefield condition that makes it actually impossible to shoot until Turn 3 and I don't think the Mortar will be very popular in the long run.

You're probably right on that last point. It will be difficult to use, I think, because much of its utility will come from the *threat* of shooting rather than actually shooting. I imagine a situation where the mortar is locking down a long alley, and then a speeder is sent up the flank to flush them out. Or send Vader and force them to pick their poison. It's going to be very terrain-dependent and adapting on-the-fly will be key.

Just... 1... more... week!

Has anyone here used the mortar in demo games yet and can offer some insight?

7 hours ago, Weatsop said:

Erm, just to clarify, the mortar on the ATST has a one in three chance of wiping out a Rebel unit on the first turn. For 10 points. The unit will run off the table never having fired a shot.

Assuming the AT-ST has aimed, it's actually closer to one in four. The AT-ST is only handing out a second suppression token if it rolls a hit.

Edit: I can’t math. See below.

22 minutes ago, WAC47 said:

Assuming the AT-ST has aimed, it's actually closer to one in four. The AT-ST is only handing out a second suppression token if it rolls a hit.

At least one hit on 5 white attack dice due to Aiming re-roll (this kind of rough math should be sufficient for our purposes) is roughly 48% (1-(7/8)^5). The targeted unit retains the 55% chance of dropping at least one of the two Suppression token during the Rally step of its activation. However, at the beginning of the game the Commander is likely within range of the targeted Trooper unit, and therefore is using their Courage value for Panicking.

Edit: apparently I can't math.

Whoops, I meant "hit" colloquially... should've said hit or crit, as either will provide a suppression token.

Probability of at least one hit/crit on attack AND probability of two blanks on rally roll

(1 - (6/8)^5) x ((2/3)^2)

.76 x .44 = .34

And yeah, this is assuming that the commander is out of range and the AT-ST has line of sight and the condition card isn't Limited Visibility and the unit was deployed within a full move of the board edge, etc.

Whoops, sorry I missed your earlier comment @Caimheul1313. You're right, I messed up the math on the chance to remove the suppression token. Edited.

@WAC47 and I forgot Crits were a possible result .