Just played a game at our local store.W played full 800 with Veers ATST Leia and snow/fleeet troopers. Objective based game was excellent. OMG the ATST rocks Snowspeeder stinks.. A lot of questions on cover for ATST and Snowspeeder because of their height Great time! Fun game.

I only say the speeder stinks in joke, cause i did not kill a full stormtrooper squad in 1 shoot. Bad rolls lol

24 minutes ago, cookluke5150 said:

I only say the speeder stinks in joke, cause i did not kill a full stormtrooper squad in 1 shoot. Bad rolls lol

Tell Wedge to aim better

Having not used it yet but my gut says that the speeder will be tricky to use. It's got great guns but having that auto move 3 and a fixed arc means you need to think ahead I reckon. Did you find that? I like the AT-ST just for its fat tank atributes.

I was able to move it no problem just upset it did not take 4 snow troopers out without cover in 1 shot lol Then the taste destroyed it

3 hours ago, cookluke5150 said:

Just played a game at our local store.W played full 800 with Veers ATST Leia and snow/fleeet troopers. Objective based game was excellent. OMG the ATST rocks Snowspeeder stinks.. A lot of questions on cover for ATST and Snowspeeder because of their height Great time! Fun game.

I sense a disturbance in the force, and it won't balance out until you share a battle report up in here.

What local store has Veers, Leia, Snow and Fleet Troopers?

1 hour ago, NukeMaster said:

What local store has Veers, Leia, Snow and Fleet Troopers?

Ones with a printer and so are IA models

Or just proxy

Yeah, but are all the upgrades spoiled?

Out of all the figures, these look the least appealing. Speed one is really bad. I played a game and DV was movimg and shaking his fist and then i reread the rules after thw game and realized that we played most of his rules wrong and he will have a difficult time getting into melee which really cuts his effectiveness down a bit. He is difficult to wound, much less kill, but he'll have a hard time making up 200 pts i think

8 hours ago, buckero0 said:

Out of all the figures, these look the least appealing. Spees one is really bad. I played a game and DV was movimg and shaking his fist and then i reread the rules after thw game and realized that we played most of his rules wrong and he will have a difficult time getting into melee which really cuts his effectiveness down a bit. He is difficult to wound, much less kill, but he'll have a hard time making up 200 pts i think

Staple saber throw on to him. 3 red dice is nothing to sneeze at, especially with pierce 3. And he can do it after moving for free, so move twice if you have to and still get in his attack.

7 hours ago, ScummyRebel said:

Staple saber throw on to him. 3 red dice is nothing to sneeze at, especially with pierce 3. And he can do it after moving for free, so move twice if you have to and still get in his attack.

No, I know about the saber throw, but that's all he's going to do unless the opponent wants to engage him for some reason. Force Choke and Push help the damage, but then you don't get Battle Meditation. Deflection can help, but then you almost just ignore 235pts of the opponent's list.

I think the Snow Troopers at least have Steady and Range 2 and are cheaper, but I'd probably just take Stormies unless I was out of points.

I was also curious how he played without the rest of a command deck or were Veers and Vader in the same army?

We will have to see Vader with all the different objectives. We played key positions. And Vader could not even lock down 1 piece of terrain cause I had 3 units on it by end of game. So he is going to be very dependent on the objective picked. It is going to be a learning curve with him for sure. But right... just stay away from him.

But that's my point his speed is a liability with objectives and just getting into melee. Of course, for all i know, they may introduce Impeeial Assault type officers that give him a free move or some other mechanic like force lightning.

Whatever he touches he kills though, so yeah don't let him close. Range 2 on his lightsaber throw is very deadly. Luke needs an aim token to make his remotely close to being as effective

3 hours ago, buckero0 said:

But that's my point his speed is a liability with objectives and just getting into melee. Of course, for all i know, they may introduce Impeeial Assault type officers that give him a free move or some other mechanic like force lightning.

Whatever he touches he kills though, so yeah don't let him close. Range 2 on his lightsaber throw is very deadly. Luke needs an aim token to make his remotely close to being as effective

I mean, clearly this is where you’re going with this, but why would you ever put lightsaber throw on Luke? His pistol does the same average damage and also has pierce. Only thing you’re getting out of those 10 points is some impact and the possibility of getting 3 hits.

You can't saber-throw with Vader's Relentless. Relentless lets you have a free attack action. Saber-throw is a card action, not an attack action.

We've settled pretty firmly on Reflexes (mandatory), Throw (mandatory) and Push (so stupidly good that I'd still say... mandatory).

Luke gets Reflexes and Push - which just compound's Vader's expensiveness (though, yeah, that saber is NUTS).

Note that Push is a FREE action, so you can do it with either Luke or Vader even *after* moving twice. It knocks an entire unit out of cover and into your guns. It is *so* sweet.

I think Vader will be much better with some armor to get him up the table. I mean, if he had even a rebel ATRT like Luke or Leia does, he'd do just fine. Otherwise, it comes down to how much cover he can get moving up, or whether (in a larger game) you're happy to move the ATST up further than it should probably be going.

In our starter-box battles Vader struggles a bit, and they are revolving around keeping Vader lurking in cover until the two armies have mostly exhausted themselves, and then sending him in to mop up what's left, burning his excellent self-buff command cards. Luke does similar but:

1. Luke has an ATRT to hide behind, which means he's almost always avoiding two hits *per volley* through the early game. Remember that a vehicle is light cover, dodge will give him a second hit-avoidance on the first volley, and then he'll have a point of suppression to bring his cover up to 2 for the rest of the turn. Vader by comparison, without a vehicle to hide behind, has dodge on the first shot and then... nuthin'. He doesn't even get the suppression cover, since Vaders don't duck (i.e. Vader has infinite courage, so doesn't get suppression tokens).
2. Luke's way faster so can use cover better through the mid-game (i.e. when the ATRT is dead), while still having an action left over to shoot.
3. I think Luke's command cards are better with small numbers (dodge on two troopers (i.e. ALL your infantry) is bloody amazing for a turn in the early-game, while Vader motivating two of his guys to death REALLY hurts in a small game).
4. Annnnnd finally, in a small game Luke's pathetic courage value doesn't get tested much. In a bigger game he can dodge all he likes, but he'll be suppressed really often.

I want to try a proxied 800 point game soon with Vader acting as the ATST's side-cannon, then avenging the **** out of it when it goes down. A bunch of his stuff only works up close (looking at his command cards, too). I'm starting to think of an imperial force that just burns itself out, put as much damage in there as possible, and then surprise Vader in the FACE. Could work.

TLDR: Vader will be better in larger battles.

Quote

I was also curious how he played without the rest of a command deck or were Veers and Vader in the same army?

Might have misunderstood, but: there are always 7 cards. With Vader, it's his 3 plus the 4 "basic" ones. With Veers it'd be Vader's 3 and Veers' 3, plus the one junk card 4-pip / 1-unit (which actually I've used as my first card a couple of times).

(That is, I'm 90% sure the commanders all come with three...? Is that right?)

The cards that a commander brings is a really important part of their value, and I'm really interested to see what we get going onwards. Even with only one card spoiled, I really like Leia *and* Luke in a Rebel 800 point force. That initial bombardment from Leia (1-pip, damage some enemies, then activate Leia) is teh hotness, and she already wants to go early and put dodge on the front-line troops (who can then double move forwards at their leisure). Then Luke can follow up next turn with two more dodge tokens from My Ally is the Force, which is a nice two-pip. Really sweet early infantry game.

On 11/03/2018 at 11:32 AM, buckero0 said:

Out of all the figures, these look the least appealing. Speed one is really bad. I played a game and DV was movimg and shaking his fist and then i reread the rules after thw game and realized that we played most of his rules wrong and he will have a difficult time getting into melee which really cuts his effectiveness down a bit. He is difficult to wound, much less kill, but he'll have a hard time making up 200 pts i think

Just get Vader to jump on the foot of your AT-ST and he can ride the chicken into battle

Honestly i see the roll of the atst very differently after playing a game or two. Atst should deploy with LOS across the board or covering an important obj. It's job is to cripple a unit with 2 suppression tokens and hit stuff at range4 until range3 and then finish units off with its firepower. It may pivot but rarely move

9 minutes ago, buckero0 said:

Honestly i see the roll of the atst very differently after playing a game or two. Atst should deploy with LOS across the board or covering an important obj. It's job is to cripple a unit with 2 suppression tokens and hit stuff at range4 until range3 and then finish units off with its firepower. It may pivot but rarely move

Yup thats how I see it too wihout playing at all, just sat there most games blasting away.

Needs more terrain to change that I reckon.

ATSTs should be stomping about, thats what they do in the films, thats what they should be doing in the game.

1 hour ago, VAYASAN said:

Yup thats how I see it too wihout playing at all, just sat there most games blasting away.

Needs more terrain to change that I reckon.

ATSTs should be stomping about, thats what they do in the films, thats what they should be doing in the game.

I agree thematically, but they also died notoriously to logs most often. There should b e a rule called awkward where if they do two move actions in a row, they may fall down and take damage.

10 hours ago, Weatsop said:

You can't saber-throw with Vader's Relentless. Relentless lets you have a free attack action. Saber-throw is a card action, not an attack action.

The last line of text on the Saber Throw card says "This is treated as an attack action."

28 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

The last line of text on the Saber Throw card says "This is treated as an attack action."

I'd like to see an official ruling on this. The card says this is treated as an attack action, meaning if you do it, you can't do another attack that round. Relentless says you get an attack action, but does that preclude you from using a card action (after using the card action, you get an attack action in Saber Throw but you have to activate it via card action it seems)? I can see arguments for both interpretations.

On taking a look I think that @Weatsop is correct that Vader cannot use Saber Throw as the free attack action granted by Relentless since it is a card action. The last line of text on Saber Throw is there so that you cannot use it (as a Card Action) and still use an Attack Action on the same turn.

I'm glad @Weatsop pointed this out, makes one rethink how to use Vader.