This happened last night and we ruled you could not.

Guy has Extra Munitions on a Gunboat and fire his first Missile, he was out of combat and advanced slam and wanted to reload his extra munitions token. Can it be done?

Thanks,

No, why should it?

Do what the card says. Where‘s the token coming from, and what does reload do?

No. Reloading lets you "choose any number of the ship's equipped, discarded Torpedo or Missile Upgrade cards and flip them face-up".

The Extra Munitions Token is not an upgrade card, so cannot be replaced with a reload action.

There is a possible argument that reloading the Extra Munitions card itself might let you place a new set of munitions tokens, but I'd say no because:

• Extra Munitions places tokens when you 'equip' it. 'Flip face-up' is essentially un-discard which to my understanding =/= 'Equip' without specific confirmation in an FAQ
• It would require Extra Munitions to be face-down, and there are few reasons for this to be the case since the Extra Munitions card is not discarded.

As an observation: If you just discarded the extra munitions card instead of the missile or torpedo, it would work - reload would flip face-up the missile and extra munitions cards, but having the token in the chain of events breaks that logic.

Another point that noone ever seems to bring up int these situations about Extra Munitions, the card itself, is never flipped face down or discarded.

The last sentence on the card reads "When you are instructed to discard an upgrade card, you may discard 1 ordnance token on hat card instead"

So even after all of the tokens are spent the card will still be sitting there faceup and smiling at you.

On 3/9/2018 at 7:06 AM, Lonestar83 said:

Another point that noone ever seems to bring up int these situations about Extra Munitions, the card itself, is never flipped face down or discarded.

The last sentence on the card reads "When you are instructed to discard an upgrade card, you may discard 1 ordnance token on hat card instead"

So even after all of the tokens are spent the card will still be sitting there faceup and smiling at you.

If you are playing with the Original Damage deck and get a Munitions Failure, you can discard the Extra Munitions card. Now, the EM card itself gets a EM token, meaning you would have to discard it twice, either by both Munitions Failure criticals, or your opponent having a meltdown and using Boba Fett (crew) on it.

PS Ban the original damage deck already

1 hour ago, kris40k said:

If you are playing with the Original Damage deck and get a Munitions Failure, you can discard the Extra Munitions card. Now, the EM card itself gets a EM token, meaning you would have to discard it twice, either by both Munitions Failure criticals, or your opponent having a meltdown and using Boba Fett (crew) on it.

PS Ban the original damage deck already

But Extra Munitions, while a torpedo upgrade, isn't a secondary weapon. Likewise, Snap Shot is a secondary weapon, despite being an Elite upgrade. You can discard the ordnance tokens instead of attached secondary weapons, but EM itself doesn't qualify.

//

The above are all correct that reload doesn't "do" anything with regards to munitions tokens.

To me, the only somewhat-open question is this: whether a ship could chose not to use it's ordnance token initially, discard the upgrade, then reload and have the never-spent ordnance token still there. My inclination is "yes" although it's hard to see a real benefit. It would allow a ship to have a bit more flexibility (knowing they'll want to move in and block on a reload turn, for example), and save their two-in-a-row for a later point in the game. I personally think it's legal, but it's such an edge case and of so dubious value.

But again, spent ordnance tokens, by any just reading I can think of, won't come back.

12 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

But Extra Munitions, while a torpedo upgrade, isn't a secondary weapon.

Oh yeah, you are right, its missing the Attack: header needed for secondary weapons so Munitions Failure could not be used to discard it. My bad.

On 3/9/2018 at 6:56 AM, Magnus Grendel said:

No. Reloading lets you "choose any number of the ship's equipped, discarded Torpedo or Missile Upgrade cards and flip them face-up".

The Extra Munitions Token is not an upgrade card, so cannot be replaced with a reload action.

There is a possible argument that reloading the Extra Munitions card itself might let you place a new set of munitions tokens, but I'd say no because:

• Extra Munitions places tokens when you 'equip' it. 'Flip face-up' is essentially un-discard which to my understanding =/= 'Equip' without specific confirmation in an FAQ
• It would require Extra Munitions to be face-down, and there are few reasons for this to be the case since the Extra Munitions card is not discarded.

As an observation: If you just discarded the extra munitions card instead of the missile or torpedo, it would work - reload would flip face-up the missile and extra munitions cards, but having the token in the chain of events breaks that logic.

So if I’m running the old damage deck and I am assigned the crit that forces me discard a secondary weapon upgrade card, in theory I could discard EM and then reload it the next round?

20 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:

So if I’m running the old damage deck and I am assigned the crit that forces me discard a secondary weapon upgrade card, in theory I could discard EM and then reload it the next round?

Is it a secondary weapon?

No it's not, therefore no you can't

So basically, if you're playing a free-for-all and 2 of your opponents have Boba crew and both trigger it (without killing you) to remove EM (one token, then the card), then you could reload it.

So in a crazy, never gonna happen scenario, you would have an opportunity to reload EM.

And then it wouldn't do anything because you only get the tokens when you equip it during turn 0.

25 minutes ago, RufusDaMan said:

Is it a secondary weapon?

No it's not, therefore no you can't

Hmm, but it doesn't say "discarded secondary weapons" it says "discarded Torpedo or Missile Upgrade cards" and in this super specific scenario it IS exactly that, even if it doesn't matter for much.

4 minutes ago, HammerGibbens said:

Hmm, but it doesn't say "discarded secondary weapons" it says "discarded Torpedo or Missile Upgrade cards" and in this super specific scenario it IS exactly that, even if it doesn't matter for much.

Right, but the crit from the original damage deck says, “discard a secondary weapon.” Thus, you cannot possibly discard Extra Munitions with a ship that has Reload, except if you get hit by two Boba Fetts.

If you think about it, it makes sense that reload would not work mechanically with extra munitions. Reloading extras would take too long, much longer than one action. Besides EM is just a precaution in case you can’t reload for some reason.