Dwarf-Grudge Deck

By Toberk, in Warhammer Invasion Deck Building

I have read lots of posts on how bad Dwarf Decks are and sure they don’t have all the cool tricks that other decks do, but they are still good if you accept the fact that you don’t have any surprises and what you see on the board is probably all you have. I made this deck to take advantage of the Dwarf Ranger's sniping ability which is triggered when one of your units dies. It is a pretty solid deck that holds its own against most other decks, and stomps the hell out of an orc rush.

Quest (2)
A Glorious Death (2) – This quest is great, kill 2 attackers for whatever guy I throw on there (usually a Dwarf Miner to heal my capitol). In all honesty, I have never completed this quest, but it is a great distraction. Makes my opponent change strategies just to kill that guy which buys me the time I need to set up everything. Just don’t put a Dwarf Ranger on it since he is already a big target as it is.

Support (14) – All of my supports (except Master Rune of Dismay) can be pulled out of my deck with Cannon Crew.
Grudge Thrower (3) – Key support which lets me activate the sniping ability of my Dwarf Rangers whenever I want. Plus, it lets me add a hammer or two when I defend or attack. There are three so if you don’t have one when you need it, the cannon crew could mine for it if you throw them down in your battlefield. Also, since it is a key support, if one gets destroyed or misplaced in your Kingdom, you have a backup and a backup’s backup.
Contested Village (3) – Low cost, 1 hammer for 1 resource. Warpstone is 0 but I don’t want to corrupt my units since they will probably be defending for the first couple of turns.
Keystone Forge (3) – Great ability and adds a hammer, I just wish the Dwarves had more supports like this one.
Church of Sigmar (2) – This one is not great, I will admit. However, this will have to be it until they come out with another Dwarf support that has 2 cost or less (so it is able to be mined with cannon crew). I am up for hearing ideas of what to change this one to but all other supports are either the same price and do less or don’t add a hammer. Just FYI, I don’t plan on playing developments so Armory is out.
Master Rune of Dismay (3) – Great early one to stall your opponent. Makes him play at least one more card in his kingdom to offset this effect.

Tactics (9)
Stand Your Ground (3 ) – Bring your favorite Dwarf unit back, in whatever zone you want.
Demolition! (3) – Destroy your opponents key supports (it’s your job to figure out what they are though).
Master Rune of Valaya (3) – Delay’s your opponent an entire turn, also makes him waste some tactics as well if you get lucky.

Units (25) – You want a lot of units so the Dwarf Rangers can have their ammo.
Defender of the Hold (2) – Great meat for the Grudge Thrower and for early attacking. Also lets you put something in your battlefield to defend against any 1 hp attackers early on.
Hammerer of Karak Azul (2) – Solid unit that is cheap.
Dwarf Miner (3) – Heal 2 damage for 2 resources…Oh, and it’s a unit.
Dwarf Cannon Crew (3) – One of the greatest cards to get your kingdom off to a running start in turn one.
Zhufbar Engineers (3) – Sac him with Grudge Thrower make your opponents discard a unit in that zone, plus hit him with Dwarf Rangers. Then, bring him back with Stand Your Ground to do it all over again.
Troll Slayers (2) – This is either a late game attacker or a mid game defender. I have no problems throwing him in any zone as I don’t usually have developments down making his battlefield power moot. But, if I do use him I will play developments to bring him up to full power for a final strike.
Dwarf Ranger (3) – KEY TO THIS DECK!!! I would have 10 of these guys if I could. Just make sure to have extra resources if you are playing against Empire so you can target their units (otherwise you have to target your own).
Gurni's Elite (2) – Once you are ready to go on the offensive, throw him down and get it done.
Mountain Brigade (3) – One of the most expensive units in this deck (at 4 resources). This heavy hitter will go down wherever I need to defend. He will probably survive until the end unless things go really bad.
King Kazador (2) – It’s good to be king, or at least have one on your side.

Total (50) – Cannot go above this so you can take full advantage of Cannon Crew. It always sucks to play Cannon Crew and find no supports on your first turn (or even worse, only find the Grudge Thrower and have to play it in your Kingdom).

Overall, I consider this deck to not be excellent at anything but above average at everything (speed, defense, offense, sniping, reacting). I use this as a standard deck which I compare my other decks to. You can definitely go in a completely opposite direction with the Dwarves but that is found in another post. The key to playing this deck is to change your strategy. Here is what I do when my opponents use a certain capitol:

Orc – It’s going to be an orc rush (why else would your opponent choose them?). Try to start off by playing a cannon crew in your kingdom on your first turn then play something in quest on your second. Keystone Forge and Dwarf Miners can repair any damaged sections to delay burning long enough to set up your Grudge Thrower – Dwarf Ranger combo. Once that is in place, just snipe his low hp units and go on the offensive. If you can survive until turn 6, you have him.

Chaos – So many ways these decks can go but there are 3 main ones (rush, snipe, corrupt). If it’s rush, just do the same you would do for orcs. If it is sniping or corrupt then you must be the aggressor and attack him early. Chaos units are expensive in comparison so use your demolition on major support cards in this kingdom.

Dwarf – Kill thy brothers! This deck is faster than any other Dwarf deck I have seen so use that speed to your advantage and hit him early on. Make sure to snipe any Dwarf Rangers, those buggers are annoying.

Empire – 90% of the Empire decks use Judgement, so this is when I start playing developments. Once the Empire is set up you will have a hard time killing him so go on the offensive (you might want to forget about setting up the Ranger-Thrower combo and just attack full force). Beware of counterstrike. If you do set up the combo, make sure to demolition their Church of Sigmars in order to hit their units without paying a surcharge.

Solid deck :) The cards that increase the cost are a good idea, but consider:

- Get rid of Church of Sigmar and replace with Scout Camp. Will assist your cannon dudes and costs 2.

- Tempting to add Empty the Hold, but really for its cost, it's only useful for a Miner or maybe a Slayer. But would work with scout camp.

- Substitute your quests with Reclaim the Hold. Will take car of your slayers and add hit point to capital

- i know you want your supports to be 2 or less, BUT possibly sub 2 for 2 Abandoned Mines so you can access those dwarfs that were put as developments by the quest above and start the cycle over with the grudge thrower

- Mountain Legion. i like better then defender of the hold because it has toughness, although cant get out on first turn, worth it to me. i'd have 3 of each though...pay 1 to put one down, sac with grudge thrower, reclaim the hold to development, begining of next turn do it over again. Extra damage if you have the Ranger out :)

But these are all BP cards which you may not have access to, i realize

In my own version of this strategy, I got rid of the Quests (I had 3 copies, to draw one early in the game, but never manage to play them efficiently). You should do the same (I never missed them), and bring in more Dwarf units.

Some other ideas :

  • "Runesmith" isn't impressive, but it fits nicely now that we have an Action Window before the Kingdom Phase. Convert those 2 resources you kept during your opponent's turn to play Major Rune of Valaya into either a 1 card draw or a 1-resource reimbursement (or +1 P to a unit on your battlefield).
  • "Dwarf Miner" is not so cool : to take advantage of its ability, you'll generally play it in a zone you don't really need him.
  • "Alliances" are support that cost 2 and provide 1 power. They may replace your Church of Sigmar, eventhough you do'nt care about the loyalty icons they are bringing.
  • I added "Warpstone Excavation" into my deck : they are free, and thanks to "Dwarf Cannon Crew" you have additional chances to put them in play early (and in numbers).
  • I play 2 copies of the 3-costed Dwarf Hero. 2/2 for 3 is always good, and it becomes a 4/2 when your opponent managed to burn one of your sections.
  • I can't think of opposing Support cards that could incapacitate this deck, so I got rid of the "Demolition". This may not be a wise move (anyone to give me examples of THE killing support card against this deck ? ), but it opens slots for some "Blessing of Valaya" (my favorite dwarf tactic).
  • I would replace a "Gurni's Elite" for a third "Troll Slayers". "Troll Slayers" are much more versatile than the Elite (as long as you have at least 2 developpements in your Battlefield)

My own deck relies on the following : sacrificing Dwarf Units to the Grudge Thrower to trigger the Rangers, just like yours. I don't know if you though of the following game-winning move :

  • sacrifice some Dwarf units to your Grudge Thrower
  • place the damages dealt by the "Dwarf Ranger(s)" onto your opponent Capital to finish of a damaged section.
  • attack another section with your Dwarf Units that are now boosted, thanks to Grudge Thrower.
  • demonio.gif

one of the guys in my group plays a pure dwarf deck and he's been struggling to get it working right, i gave him this list and his deck just became deadly, i know he's now tweaking it for his play style but even then it's an epic deck! Thanks a lot for this! now i hate dwarvs nearly as much as i hate judgment ;)

First, I want to thank you all for replying. The main reason I started this post was to show people a competitive Dwarf deck. Most feel the Dwarves are garbage, mainly because they cannot withstand a decent rush deck (I think this is true if you build a Dwarf deck around developments). It's always good to get constructive feedback and hopefully players can use this deck to give the dwarf users in their group a fighting chance.

Anyways, here are my thoughts on your suggestions:


Artemus Maximus:

I feel that Empty the Hold would be a good choice for decks with different factions so you can get around paying the extra loyalty costs if you are low on one type. Since I will not have to worry about loyalty after the second turn I would be paying 4 resources to get an unknown 3 resource unit out (granted the best out of the next 5 cards). Even if I had a Scout Camp or two in play, I still would be paying more for less and rather have a unit in this slot.

Speaking of Scout Camp, since Cannon Crew is the only one that would take advantage of its ability, the best I could hope for is to draw 2 or 3 more cards. I would never play Scout Camps from my hand as there will always be a better choice (either better support cards or units). In that respect, Church of Sigmar is best since it gives 1 hammer and really screws with other sniping decks. Normally, if I drew either I would use it as a development to up the Troll Slayer's power but when playing against a sniping deck, I sometimes play the Church out of my hand for 4 resources. I know the Church does not seem to fit this deck but it helps in certain situations which would normally be a big problem (I think sniping decks are the hardest opponent for this deck).

I think the Abandoned Mine and Reclaim the Hold idea is very good, just not for this deck. That is best used in the development dwarf decks (and might actually make them work). I really like A Glorious Death since it usually causes my opponent to become distracted. The real benefit of the quest is not actually completing it, but have my opponent focused on it enough to change his strategy. Players see the unit on this quest and get focused on killing it while the real danger lies with the Dwarf Rangers right next to him.

You are right though, I do not have access to the latest BP. When I get it I will modify my deck to add 3 Mountain Legions.


Martin_fr

Runesmith just doesn't do it for me because when I had him I hardly used his ability. I decided to replace him with Miners actually since they both are 1/1 for 2 resources. The fact is I used the miner's ability much more than Runesmith's and the Miner had an added bonus of slowing down any rush decks which helped tremendously. After you get the Miner down he is just meat for the Grudge Thrower anyways so I don't care where he goes.

Alliances only add a loyalty symbol and a hammer in whatever zone you played it. Since this is a mono Dwarf deck, I am not too worried about loyalty symbols which makes this just a 1 hammer support for 2 resources (still able to be mined with Cannon Crew). Again, I really like the instances where Church of Sigmar can be utilized to save me from sniping decks (or even worse, rush/sniping decks) so I'm still going to use the Church until a worthy Dwarf support can replace it.

I think Warpstone Excavation is a bad idea for this deck. I like getting a hammer without paying for it but the downside is it prevents setting up a solid defense. Warpstone Excavations should definitely be in rush decks but not much else since they create a huge hole for any that any rush deck will take advantage of.

Durgnar the Bold (the 2/2 hero that goes up to 4/2 when you have a burning zone) is nice but if you think about it, when you have a burning zone, you really want to lay down some high defense cards and that is not him. He only gets the increase if you are in serious trouble, so most of the time he is just a 2/2 for 3 resources. The fact is there are much better 3 resource cost cards than a 2/2 dwarf unit (which he is 90% of the time).

Demolition is great for giving you the option to take care of a key support card or development in your opponent's strategy. If you look closely, most decks have a key support card that will severely slow them down if it gets destroyed. Also, being able to kill of a development is also cool if a judgment card is played and your opponent only has 1 development in a zone. Support cards I would use demolition on are: Banna of da Red Sunz, Repeater Bolt Thrower, Reaper Bolt Thrower, Church of Sigmar, and an opponent's Grudge Thrower.

You are right about Troll Slayers, I will change my deck accordingly. I was so caught up in not playing developments that devalued them but they are more versatile and I will have enough cards in my hand to have decent development options by the time I ramp up for a major attack.

Your final play is a great strategy. I tend to forget that the rangers can target the capital since most of the time they are sniping my opponent's units.


deviant-dj:

I'm really glad this has helped someone. Let me know what tweaks he did to it as I am always open to making my decks better.

Martin_fr said:

  • I can't think of opposing Support cards that could incapacitate this deck, so I got rid of the "Demolition". This may not be a wise move (anyone to give me examples of THE killing support card against this deck ? ), but it opens slots for some "Blessing of Valaya" (my favorite dwarf tactic).



Toberk said:


deviant-dj:

I'm really glad this has helped someone. Let me know what tweaks he did to it as I am always open to making my decks better.

No problem :) i think he's debating putting some repeater bolt throwers in just for some more disruption. I'll let you know when he finalises the list

i see what you mean about the Churches now. Definitely worth keeping in there vs. avail. options. I've ben trying to run grudge/devel. with & without Repeater and it's just been falling short. The all-grudge focus definitely works better. Annihilated chaos/DE sniping everytime (the Reaper Bolt Thrower is made a joke by having just 2 units with toughness), about 60% win with Empire Judment Jumping Jacks & CS, 50% with Orc ... 'get bigga deck' lol for lack of better word. Lost every game (5) the other day to Skaven/Chaos, but most were close enough for wins to be possible. So much improvement compared to what i had. Thanks!

Added Mr. Durgnar though, put into KZ to help defend - quest usually gets burned quick as there are just the Rangers there and i don't defend with them. Or throw him in QZ if it's already burned when i get him to help get what i need faster so i can try to stay ahead & have lots of thrower fodder. I like King in KZ then to draw attention & resources from opponent, to take attention off my littler little people.

Toberk said:

I feel that Empty the Hold would be a good choice for decks with different factions so you can get around paying the extra loyalty costs if you are low on one type. Since I will not have to worry about loyalty after the second turn I would be paying 4 resources to get an unknown 3 resource unit out (granted the best out of the next 5 cards). Even if I had a Scout Camp or two in play, I still would be paying more for less and rather have a unit in this slot.

You see only the first utility of "Empty the Hold" : using it to decrease the cost of a card to put into play. And I agree this part is very situational, as it will be effective only on 3-cost units with 3+ loyalty icons (preferably from another faction).

But the true power of this card isn't that. It's true power is to allow you to play a unit directly from your deck ! So, if your beloved Dwarf Ranger is within the top 5 cards of your deck, you'll be able to have them in play (even better if you already managed to have one in play...). Moreover, the best Dwarf units are 3-costed ones (IMO) : Engineers, Troll Slayers and Rangers, all those are able to cause serious trouble to your opponent. Last, this tactic allows you to play a unit outside your Capital Phase (in an Empire deck, one could use it to play some Counterattack units within the attacked zone).

Personnaly, I'll put this card in my deck to dig out my deck in search of copies of the Rangers. And the Scout Camp may be useful for this.

Martin_fr said:

But the true power of this card isn't that. It's true power is to allow you to play a unit directly from your deck ! So, if your beloved Dwarf Ranger is within the top 5 cards of your deck, you'll be able to have them in play (even better if you already managed to have one in play...). Moreover, the best Dwarf units are 3-costed ones (IMO) : Engineers, Troll Slayers and Rangers, all those are able to cause serious trouble to your opponent. Last, this tactic allows you to play a unit outside your Capital Phase (in an Empire deck, one could use it to play some Counterattack units within the attacked zone).

You make a very good point Martin_fr and I will definately be using them when I construct a dwarf/empire deck. However, right now I do not have deathmaster's dance (with it, Empty the Hold and Mountain Legion) so I cannot test them with my deck. Once I get them, I will try them out (in possible combination with Scout Camp) and see if I like them.

Reclaim the Hold, Abandoned Mine, Grudge Thrower allows you a unit to play and throw every turn. Units with 'enters play' or 'leaves play' effects are very good with this. Dwarf Miner to heal 2 a turn is a pretty good tool for stabalizing your board. Zhufbar Engineers can also cripple the opponent if he is running out of steam.

I do run a minor development theme in my deck though. Later in the game when everything is so locked up, I just use my 14 resources or so to activate my Grudge Thrower several times with 2 or 3 Dwarf Rangers in play to just pick off the opponents capital. If that isn't enough to get through, the attack with my units at +3 or +4 power will be.

My biggest problem now is surviving against my orc rush deck. I have a zone burned quick before I can stabalize, then the orc player just slows down a bit and takes a small chunck here and there until I die. I need something that is a little quicker to defend myself.

Also, Skaven are becoming so powerful and common that I find Zealot Hunter to be a good option. It also lets you choose the target. This will add a power to whatever zone you need it to and let you kill the Deathmaster or Clan Moulder's Elite in one shot.

darkdeal said:

Also, Skaven are becoming so powerful and common that I find Zealot Hunter to be a good option. It also lets you choose the target. This will add a power to whatever zone you need it to and let you kill the Deathmaster or Clan Moulder's Elite in one shot.

and you have a useless unit if you can't use its power.

Sure, the Zealot Hunter is useless if the opponent is strictly one race (Dwarves being the most likely suspect). But you're probably playing developments anyway, so now you know which card in you hand you are developing. :)

In most matchups it's useful and the Hunter is essential to have any kind of chance against Skaven.

Clamatius said:

In most matchups it's useful and the Hunter is essential to have any kind of chance against Skaven.

And that's a real problem !

you have to meta against Skaven to stand a chance. This is stupid.

Hi,

a short question about the grudge thrower: with 3 rangers in play, is it possible to sacrifice more than one unit during one action phase? that would make it possible to sacrifice all dwarf units except the rangers and deal all that massive damage to his capital to finish. that should be possible, right?

Kako K. said:

a short question about the grudge thrower: with 3 rangers in play, is it possible to sacrifice more than one unit during one action phase? that would make it possible to sacrifice all dwarf units except the rangers and deal all that massive damage to his capital to finish. that should be possible, right?

Sure. And all your attacking/defending units will gain +1 power for each unit you sacrified gran_risa.gif . That's definately a great way to finish up your opponent.

Kako K. said:

Hi,

a short question about the grudge thrower: with 3 rangers in play, is it possible to sacrifice more than one unit during one action phase? that would make it possible to sacrifice all dwarf units except the rangers and deal all that massive damage to his capital to finish. that should be possible, right?

Assuming you have the resources and units to sacrifice yes it would.

I like the deck and the strategy behind it. I'll give it a try.

I was going to suggest Veteran Sellswords (free cannon fodder for the Grudge Thrower) but then I realized they wouldn't combo with the Dwarf Ranger.

As usual, people are FAR too worried/concerned with matching the arbitrarily determined 50-card limits. :( Cool deck otherwise, I think. :)

Wow I leave for two days and so many responces, thx all for the interest.

darkdeal said:

Reclaim the Hold, Abandoned Mine, Grudge Thrower allows you a unit to play and throw every turn. Units with 'enters play' or 'leaves play' effects are very good with this. Dwarf Miner to heal 2 a turn is a pretty good tool for stabalizing your board. Zhufbar Engineers can also cripple the opponent if he is running out of steam.

I do run a minor development theme in my deck though. Later in the game when everything is so locked up, I just use my 14 resources or so to activate my Grudge Thrower several times with 2 or 3 Dwarf Rangers in play to just pick off the opponents capital. If that isn't enough to get through, the attack with my units at +3 or +4 power will be.

My biggest problem now is surviving against my orc rush deck. I have a zone burned quick before I can stabalize, then the orc player just slows down a bit and takes a small chunck here and there until I die. I need something that is a little quicker to defend myself.

That is a good combo but I think it takes too long to set up with this deck. I sometimes have trouble getting Grudge Thrower/Dwarf Rangers set up in time against a rush deck so this would happen even less for me. I really like the combo though (you've got me thinking of a way to make a deck that this would work with).

As for developments, I think there are two ways you can take dwarves and this is just one (no developments). Not planning on developments speeds up this deck considerably which will also help against rush decks. Besides getting rid of all the development cards (like Abandoned Mine, Wake the Mountain, ect.), playing no developments lets you draw less cards since you don't have to waste them as developments.

It is important to note I made this deck without Deathmaster's Dance expansions. I've been working on an update with the new cards and will either post it in this thread or create a new one. The main reason for the change is now skavens are deadly. Their rush is insane and now has Deathmaster Sniktch gives them a huge advantage. This deck can withstand a sniping deck by rushing it and a rushing deck by sniping it but a snipe/rush deck will beat this one 9 out of 10 times (the 10th being due to a bad card draw on their part). In short, yes I am probably putting Zealot Hunters in the updated version.

Wytefang said:

As usual, people are FAR too worried/concerned with matching the arbitrarily determined 50-card limits. :( Cool deck otherwise, I think. :)

I have read alot of your posts Wytefang and respect your feelings about the 50-card decks. So, I understand your initial reaction. However, the 50-card limit is necessary for this deck and here are my reasons:

1) Dwarf Cannon Crew - There are 8 support cards in the deck that I want to pull out on my first turn by playing these guys in my Kingdom Zone. If your starting hand does not have any of these support cards then you have roughly a 66% chance of pulling one out. The more cards I add, the more supports I have to add as well to get this ratio. This would be fine if the dwarves had good 2 cost supports, but Keystone Forge is the only one. I even put Church of Sigmar in there because I think its the third best choice for supports that fits this category (Contested Village being second).

2) You shouldn't get anywhere close to running out of cards with this deck. It is fast compared to other decks and very fast compared to other dwarf decks. In fact, I consider this to be the dwarves version of a rush deck and do not think a rush deck should ever have more than 50 cards.

3) There is nothing I need to add to the deck. If I could have 20 dwarf rangers, 10 Cannon Crew, 10 Keystone Forge, and 10 misc. cards I would be very happy. The other cards are there because they are the best of what is left but I really dont have to have any of them. If I add more cards I'm just putting them between the ones I really want and my hand.

While normally I do agree with you about the 50-card limit being overemphasized by players, I think it is essential in this deck. I guess my big question is what cards would you add to this deck?

Toberk said:

Wow I leave for two days and so many responces, thx all for the interest.

darkdeal said:

Reclaim the Hold, Abandoned Mine, Grudge Thrower allows you a unit to play and throw every turn. Units with 'enters play' or 'leaves play' effects are very good with this. Dwarf Miner to heal 2 a turn is a pretty good tool for stabalizing your board. Zhufbar Engineers can also cripple the opponent if he is running out of steam.

I do run a minor development theme in my deck though. Later in the game when everything is so locked up, I just use my 14 resources or so to activate my Grudge Thrower several times with 2 or 3 Dwarf Rangers in play to just pick off the opponents capital. If that isn't enough to get through, the attack with my units at +3 or +4 power will be.

My biggest problem now is surviving against my orc rush deck. I have a zone burned quick before I can stabalize, then the orc player just slows down a bit and takes a small chunck here and there until I die. I need something that is a little quicker to defend myself.

That is a good combo but I think it takes too long to set up with this deck. I sometimes have trouble getting Grudge Thrower/Dwarf Rangers set up in time against a rush deck so this would happen even less for me. I really like the combo though (you've got me thinking of a way to make a deck that this would work with).

As for developments, I think there are two ways you can take dwarves and this is just one (no developments). Not planning on developments speeds up this deck considerably which will also help against rush decks. Besides getting rid of all the development cards (like Abandoned Mine, Wake the Mountain, ect.), playing no developments lets you draw less cards since you don't have to waste them as developments.

It is important to note I made this deck without Deathmaster's Dance expansions. I've been working on an update with the new cards and will either post it in this thread or create a new one. The main reason for the change is now skavens are deadly. Their rush is insane and now has Deathmaster Sniktch gives them a huge advantage. This deck can withstand a sniping deck by rushing it and a rushing deck by sniping it but a snipe/rush deck will beat this one 9 out of 10 times (the 10th being due to a bad card draw on their part). In short, yes I am probably putting Zealot Hunters in the updated version.

I ran a version of this the other night for about 7 games. I will probably do a separate post tonight that goes through the 'evolution" of the deck. To summarize the deck was built around the idea of recursion relying on: Grudge Thrower, Dwarf Ranger, Reclaim The Hold and Abandoned Mine. I accented the deck with City Gates, Shrine to Taal, Dwarf Cannon Crew and Ironbreakers. It actually did okay with Skaven-Chaos rush but struggled against Orc Control (gasp! somebody plays Orcs non-rush!).

I know OP specifically was going the non-development route with this deck, so maybe I will do a separate thread later tonight.

Toberk said:

Wytefang said:

As usual, people are FAR too worried/concerned with matching the arbitrarily determined 50-card limits. :( Cool deck otherwise, I think. :)

I have read alot of your posts Wytefang and respect your feelings about the 50-card decks. So, I understand your initial reaction. However, the 50-card limit is necessary for this deck and here are my reasons:

1) Dwarf Cannon Crew - There are 8 support cards in the deck that I want to pull out on my first turn by playing these guys in my Kingdom Zone. If your starting hand does not have any of these support cards then you have roughly a 66% chance of pulling one out. The more cards I add, the more supports I have to add as well to get this ratio. This would be fine if the dwarves had good 2 cost supports, but Keystone Forge is the only one. I even put Church of Sigmar in there because I think its the third best choice for supports that fits this category (Contested Village being second).

2) You shouldn't get anywhere close to running out of cards with this deck. It is fast compared to other decks and very fast compared to other dwarf decks. In fact, I consider this to be the dwarves version of a rush deck and do not think a rush deck should ever have more than 50 cards.

3) There is nothing I need to add to the deck. If I could have 20 dwarf rangers, 10 Cannon Crew, 10 Keystone Forge, and 10 misc. cards I would be very happy. The other cards are there because they are the best of what is left but I really dont have to have any of them. If I add more cards I'm just putting them between the ones I really want and my hand.

While normally I do agree with you about the 50-card limit being overemphasized by players, I think it is essential in this deck. I guess my big question is what cards would you add to this deck?

Thanks for the clarification - sorry if I came across the wrong way. I can see that in your interesting deck's case, the smaller size is VERY warranted. :)

i always try to keep my decks between 50-60 cards as i feel anymore than that the deck just becomes to slow, but for me i think it's more just a personal preferance thing. I used to play raw deal alot where your deck always had to be exactly 60 cards.