The idea of getting to shoot at the end of the attack phase with a turret equipped on the Phantom makes perfect sense. You get to shoot out the rear arc because the phantom is facing that way (should be 3 die out the rear though) so it makes sense that the phantom is making the extra attack.

For those saying get good against the Ghost, well yeah it has 0 agility, but Fenn strips one ships focus, and can prevent another from spending. Combined with sensor jammer and an evade token, that is 3 auto(unless expertise) evades a round. While pushing out 4+damage a round, it's easy to see how it's hard to counter.

As for TLT in general, giving defensive range 3 bonus against all turrets is an easy fix, and it will only impact TLTs at the moment.

I think making Miranda's ability primary only is too heavy handed. Can she be FAQ'd to have her ability impact both shots of the TLT? I'm not sure if this specifically is against the timing chart, but it would make her way less reliable when regenerating. You would also have to declare her ability before rolling the first attack. Combine that with the TLT range bonus, this should make Miranda a little easier to deal with. (she's already not as bad since the advanced slam fix).

Can we nerf all the nerf requests? The game is great. It was greater before the JM5K and Biggs nerf. It was better before the advanced slam nerf.

If you are still struggling against the Ghost, you are not building your list correctly. Passive mods make Fenn into a Z-95, and specifically Expertise/Glitterstim are tearing Ghosts apart right now. If you're not packing passive mods then you need to have autothrusters.

Rest assured FFG is going to step in eventually, but the tournament results are showing that Ghost/Fenn is strong but not completely unstoppable the way Nym/Miranda were, so you might have to wait a while if you're going to wait for FFG to rescue you from the boogeyman instead of doing some research yourself on what lists are beating the Ghost.

So many cries for nerfing. Some are valid complaints, even though nerfing would be overkill. Others are best answered with 'get good'. Like the cries about Nym, a 1 green die target...

How about nerfing everything I lose against. Lately, that wouldn't leave much in the game

I overall think the TLT isn't bad for the game. Though range bonuses may be a small but effective change, I think that the Ghost and Miranda should be adjusted long before TLT is given a serious nerf.

The issue comes with Y Wings (title and no title), HWKs, generic Scurrgs, and Agressors greatly benefit from the TLT without being game breaking. Even when the TLT was new and 4 Gold+TLT+R2 or the classic Thug Life list were around, it wasn't game breaking, though it might have been a bit boring.

For some reason, Ghost+TLT is breaking the meta now. Should it be nerfed? maybe. Should TLT be nerfed? Probably not.

On 2/22/2018 at 11:40 AM, rhs2042 said:

If you can't figure out how to beat a list with a huge 0 Agi target, you may need to rethink your strategy. A list like Kanan/Fenn is essentially on a timer: it deals a consistent amount of (un-aimed) damage every turn, true; however, both of its components are fairly trivial to destroy with focused fire.

The game was fine before the Sheathapede showed up, and eventually it will no longer be the flavor-of-the-month, regardless of whether it is nerfed.

If you go into the game thinking it's the ghost list on a timer, and not you, you're doing it wrong.

Really?

As a frequent Ghost player, it is quite obvious to me that a VCX without a regen upgrade can mitigate no more than 2 damage per turn-- and that's if your opponent is nice and shoots through a rock or at Range 3. One evade token per turn is pretty pathetic.

Let me reiterate: If a player's list can't get damage through on a 0 Agi target, that player needs to rethink his or her strategy, tactics, or hobby. Maybe competitive wargames with semi-random outcomes are not appropriate for a person who isn't aware that sometimes (frequently!) defeat is very bitter, and victory but a fleeting dream.

On 23/02/2018 at 1:59 AM, GrimmyV said:

FAQ

TLT: range 1-2

Christ no. The R1 hole is one of the few counters against TLTs; particularly since most of the carriers aren’t that fast or manoiverable. R1 TLTs would actually work in most ships’ favour; not against them. 4 TLT Y-Wings would love not having to keep their distance. Watch them close and surround a target, have one block and then the other three pummel it.

4 hours ago, Dr Zoidberg said:

Christ no. The R1 hole is one of the few counters against TLTs; particularly since most of the carriers aren’t that fast or manoiverable. R1 TLTs would actually work in most ships’ favour; not against them. 4 TLT Y-Wings would love not having to keep their distance. Watch them close and surround a target, have one block and then the other three pummel it.

To hear all the moaning and groaning you would think the range one hole was an impossible thing to hit. I figured cutting down the range would make all those grumpsters happy.

I have an idea.

Keep epic mechanics in epic.

17 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

I have an idea.

Keep epic mechanics in epic.

What? But wouldn’t it have been awesome to use Energy mechanics on Large ships! The Falcon with Recover would have been insane! And totally irresponsible, but hey! Fun!

Alright, my fix for the TLT ghost and all other TLT carriers: TLT does not allow you to modify dice, sort of like unguided rockets. Keeps it good against low or no agility ships because one or two hits regularly will still be good. Doesn't hurt cheap TLT carriers that much, because they don't stack mods very much. Hammers Maul Ezra and actually might make synced turret look decent in comparison.

The game doesn't need TLT's anymore and the upgrades existence is painting the designers into a corner. The things it was originally designed to fight are no longer overpowered because of other changes added to the game afterwards and the TLT suppresses the use of a great deal of pilots and ships that could see play or could be added in the future except that they would be wiped off the board by TLT's.

Honestly, Ghost/Fenn is nice with a FCS/Synced Turret, but not a overpowered. Would it be anywhere near as broken with its canonical Dorsal Turret instead of TLT? Of course not.

While it was **** silly of FFG to add a PS 11 Coordinate on a very cheap ship, the big problem is the TLT.

Kill that.

On 2/22/2018 at 9:30 AM, Stinger07 said:

I've been thinking quite a bit on the issue of 4 TLT shots coming from the Ghost with Phantom docked and I think there is a very simple fix.

What if instead of allowing the ghost to fire with it's equipped turret, it must fire with a turret that is equipped to the Phantom?

Essentially, if someone wants to make 4 fully modded TLT shots, they'll have to pay for a second TLT on the Phantom in addition to one on the Ghost.

Thoughts?

Edit: Formatting

Dah! I've been saying this for almost a year now. People don't like it, but I'm with you 100%.

Just state "The end of turn shot comes from the Turret equipped on the phantom ." simple and fixed.

.

41 minutes ago, eagletsi111 said:

Dah! I've been saying this for almost a year now. People don't like it, but I'm with you 100%.

Just state "The end of turn shot comes from the Turret equipped on the phantom ." simple and fixed.

Heck, it's barely a Nerf given that the phantom will be able use said turret. It brings about a different strategy but isn't a waste of points...

36 minutes ago, Stinger07 said:

.

Heck, it's barely a Nerf given that the phantom will be able use said turret. It brings about a different strategy but isn't a waste of points...

It's a six point tax. That's pretty big.

Personally I like 'perform this attack twice if the target is locked or in your firing arc'.

8 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

It's a six point tax. That's pretty big.

Personally I like 'perform this attack twice if the target is locked or in your firing arc'.

You have to pay more points for your second tlt, but it's not wasted in that the phantom can now make the extra attacks. It costs more, but it may pay off when the ghost is destroyed. Yeah, you are paying 6 points, but it has uses beyond the the current implementation.

It only pays off if the ghost is destroyed.

There's a reason the phantom in these builds is run naked...

On ‎2‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 11:22 AM, Khyros said:

The ghost has been out for 2+ years now. It really hasn't been a problem for most of that time (and really isn't a problem today either imo). Heck, half way through its life it got a buff to the docked phantom, and it still wasn't a problem. Kanan/Biggs was a thing, and I made sure to play the **** out of it, but it wasn't a top tier list (even if I believed it was the best list out there for the meta at the time). And now Kanan/Fenn is a thing (which kinda pisses me off because its the natural evolution of my list, but I'm never one to play mainstream meta things, so I'm torn, but that's a personal problem =P). But it's far from the only dominant list out there.

If its showing up all over for you and wrecking face, then I suggest taking some steps to beat it, starting with list building. Anything with Autothrusters wrecks it, especially if you can get it into end game. Even good old x7 defenders does it in rather well. If the concern is Fenn to begin with, then I'm going to point out that he's a worse Biggs. If he's using his action to coordinate, that means he has 0 defensive stuff, 1 fewer shields (via lack of IA), and a more restrictive dial (via greens only). Biggs dies in 2 rounds, Fenn should die in 1.5. Then your auto thrusting barrel roll boosting menaces will just laugh at the Ghost as it stays in the donut hole the entire time. Or take Kylo for the easy blinding for 2 rounds. Sure, you still get the end of combat TLT shot, but without the first shot (which really wants to be the primary weapon shot), the end phase one is pathetic - you haven't been able to strip tokens yet to make it do anything. And even if it's going against the 1agi things out there and doing 2 damage... you have 70+ points doing 2 damage a turn, that's AWFUL.

Pretty much don't take Miranda/Nym and expect to beat the Ghost. You won't. It has more health and firepower than you do, so it will outlast you. It's almost like it's the rock to your scissor, but no one wants to play those paper arc dodgers because Miranda/Nym cuts them up with those bombs. Huh... Who'da thunk?

yep agree 100% instead of crying about it find a better way to beat, your go to list doesn't work against, build another list.... just saying!!!!!!

Thing that really bugs me about this: FFG *really* should have seen it coming. Because Herahsoka was making big waves this time least year, and that's functionality a very similar list, just with a tougher support ship with better range and more functionality. It really should have been very obvious how painful this list would be to fly against.

Sigh.

On 2/24/2018 at 5:19 PM, thespaceinvader said:

It only pays off if the ghost is destroyed.

There's a reason the phantom in these builds is run naked...

It just seems un-intuitive that the phantom is just docked the entire time. Seems against the spirit of the mechanic. And yes, I realize the spirit of the mechanic is nothing to be held to, but given the phantom is docked and nearly unused at all times just seems like an 18 point upgrade to a list rather than a new ship.

2 minutes ago, Stinger07 said:

It just seems un-intuitive that the phantom is just docked the entire time. Seems against the spirit of the mechanic. And yes, I realize the spirit of the mechanic is nothing to be held to, but given the phantom is docked and nearly unused at all times just seems like an 18 point upgrade to a list rather than a new ship.

It's not a new ship. The phantom 1 is docked. And how it seems to you is irrelevant.

The fact is that this list never wants to undock the phantom. If it's forced to it's probably lost.

People would just tweak the list to have TLT on both the ghost and the phantom.

TLT is a big enough issue where IT needs to be reworked, not the ships using it.

Still say the best fix is reduce its cost by 1, but give it the Gunner effect (If this attack misses, perform it again. You may not attack again this round). Now its more or less just about guaranteeing 1 damage and/or stripping defenses, not piling on tons of damage between 2-3 turrets.

That's a six point tax though, it's not a simple 'just'. Six point is enough to cost you any two of the big upgrades that make it work, maul, ezra, engine, hotshot, sensor jammer, kanan over lothal, etc.

It may not be much, but it might be enough.

I'd still prefer to see TLT fixed, but I am pretty convinced it's not on the cards.

On 2/22/2018 at 7:30 AM, Stinger07 said:

I've been thinking quite a bit on the issue of 4 TLT shots coming from the Ghost with Phantom docked and I think there is a very simple fix.

What if instead of allowing the ghost to fire with it's equipped turret, it must fire with a turret that is equipped to the Phantom ?

Essentially, if someone wants to make 4 fully modded TLT shots, they'll have to pay for a second TLT on the Phantom in addition to one on the Ghost .

Thoughts?

Edit: Formatting

My thoughts would be that I would put an autoblaster on the ghost and a TLT on Zeb. I'm still trying to get a primary+TLT. If you get into the TLT donut, you get autoblasted. Once Zeb gets launched, he will do a lot better with a TLT on board. This is a change, but I'm not sure it's actually a nerf.