Got beat in a wicked close game (exact lethal in a "time expired" attack), and a major factor in my opponent's eventual 3-0 run for the day was M9-G8 and Weapons Engineer on AP-5 (for cheapness). To a certain extent, it's almost like a Sensor Jammer, and we all know how good Sensor Jammer can be with Fenn Rau. While I know some folks have flown Fenn with the M9/WE combo, it also fits on an ARC-170.

So, let's start with the "standard" VI/Hotshot Copilot/[R2 or Flight Assist] Astromech build for Fenn Fenn Rau. We'll add some sort of ARC with M9-G8 and Weapons Engineer. The price would range between 31 for Braylen Stramm, 32 for Thane Kyrell (free actions are nice, 34 to add Vectored Thrusters), or 34 for Shara Bey without an Elite (or with a 0-point one... I like Trick Shot, unless there's a specific reason to get PS 7 from Adaptability).

So who's the 3rd ship?

Poe has to be an obvious first option to consider. A standard 43 point VI/Black One/R2-D2/Advanced Optics/Autothrusters PS9 Poe would fit alongside Fenn and Braylen. To get Shara Bey VT Thane, you'd need to run a cheaper Poe. Going to a 41 point PS 8 version, and either losing FAA from Fenn or dropping to PS 10 from Adaptability would be the points to get her. However, if you're using Shara's ability to give Poe a TL at his high PS, then you're probably losing the M9-G8 ability before your opponent attacks. Thane seems more likely to be able to use M9-G8 defensively then spend a TL offensively, and between Fenn's Coordinate and his Pilot Ability, he ought to have action efficiency enough to keep high uptime on TLs and have focus to spend too.

Another 3rd ship would be Norra Wexley. A fairly standard R2-D2/Push the Limit/[crew] option can fit in for 38-39 points, depending if you want Rey, Recon Specialist, Kyle Katarn, or C-3PO. Norra seems like she might be more of a hitter than Poe, and have pretty strong survivability when supported by two ships reducing incoming damage. If you only really have one threat, particularly one higher PS threat to worry about, having Shara lock that target and Norra would give a lot of hitting power, as well as allow Norra to spend her TL defensively. This speaks towards some multiple-focus crew for Norra. A Norra/Shara/Fenn build would also have room for a non-zero Elite upgrade for Shara (if you pass up the same-PS flexibility of Adaptability). Draw Their Fire seems nice against Kylo. Lone Wolf seems like a thought-provoking choice, for times when your opponent intends to save her for last. Or just stick with a 0-point Elite and put Vectored Thrusters on Norra...

Any other likely 3rd ships?

A fairly skinny Miranda could work, with TLT and one other major upgrade... Rey or Jan Ors for 37, Bomblets or C-3PO for 38, 39 for Harpoon/LRS, 40 adds Sabine to Bomblets or Vectored Thrusters to C-3PO. M9-G8 rerolls on TLT shots is nice.

A chunky Wulffwarro would fit. Ezra/Maul allows him to reinforce every turn with solid red dice mods, and brings him to 36. Add some sort of Elite on top of that (Wired?), or maybe even Engine Upgrade, to turn that 180-arc around.

Oh god. SuperCassian would fit at 39 points. Expert Handling, Advanced Sensors, Inspiring Recruit, Kyle Katarn, title, Experimental Interface. However, there wouldn't be any Kanan Jarrus in the list, and Cassian can get a lot of benefit from a clutch hard-2 instead of a bank, even if it doesn't trigger his 2x focus from Kyle.

//

I've rambled long enough. Anyone else have thoughts?

I saw your post earlier where you mentioned that support AP-5. I'd been mulling over whether I could get it into my silly Ibtisam list that I've been dorking with for a while. I think it comes out a little too expensive for my specific list (in the sense that I'd end up with too few points for a useful 4th ship) but I can see the potential. This is actually a good reminder that WG+M9-G8 fits on an ARC as well, and the ARC is a pretty useful chassis...

Anyway, of the options you listed, I think Norra/Shara/Fenn sounds pretty coherent, what with Norra/Shara already being a thing. Plus then they all have front and back arcs, which makes them all literal pains in the rear.

I think 21 points of AP-5 with Weapons Engineer and M9-G8 is a great build. Add that M9-G8 is a massive multiplier on 3 attack dice ships ... and even more so on TLT.

I've been playing around with AP-5 & Miranda, trying to make a good list there ... maybe trimming the cloth on Miranda to drop an ARC-170 in might be the answer.

3 hours ago, Dreadai said:

I think 21 points of AP-5 with Weapons Engineer and M9-G8 is a great build. Add that M9-G8 is a massive multiplier on 3 attack dice ships ... and even more so on TLT.

I've been playing around with AP-5 & Miranda, trying to make a good list there ... maybe trimming the cloth on Miranda to drop an ARC-170 in might be the answer.

My only issue with WE/M9 AP-5, a great value at 21 points, is that if you're pairing them with Fenn Rau, that's a now two fairly slight ships with anemic offense. My opponent was flying it with Jake, a PS1 Wookiee with C-3PO, and Bodhi Rook of all things. It allowed him to keep AP-5 kind of out of the fight for a while, and still get the TLs he needed for M9-G8.

I really struggle to put AP-5 and Fenn into a list together ... I've tried a few things, but nothing has clicked for me ... I guess that third ship just has to pull too much weight in covering the lacking offense from the shuttles.

I looked at Bodhi rook as an enabler for defensive M9-G8 before ... seems kind of fun to have AP-5 turning circles in the corner and leveraging Bodhi crew on Lowhhrick to switch TL onto the biggest offensive threat. Forcing opponents to reroll their crit is one of my biggest x-wing joys,

He didn't quite stay in the corner, just kind of at a distance where he could still coordinate, but that it'd be hard to get good shots at him. And Crew Bodhi, alas, won't work that way. He only allows the ship he's on to get the target locks out of normal range.

I've also seen Bodhi Rook used moderately effectively in a list with Nym. My opponent had Sabine, Proton Bomb, Extra Munitions, and Minefield Mapper. He could put that Bomb anywhere, hold it with Nym's ability. Also, he was able to have his 3rd ship... I think it was Captain Rex, get a lead, and thus allow Nym to get a TL on my Thweek when nominally out-of-range, so that I just barely slipped into R3 of his Nym for Harpoons.

I like the standard Fenn and Thane as the M9/WE carrier. Now, I would then go with Poe (but with BB-8, not R2-D2), because I love Poe, and he's really strong these days.

After Poe, despite my love for Norra, I would choose Wulfy. His sheer versatility is remarkable.

So I put it on the table earlier today, and only lost 1 shield.

I flew:
Mostly Standard Fenn Rau (VI, Hotshot Copilot, Flight Assist Astomech) with Pulsed Ray Shield.

Braylen Stram (M9-G8, Weapons Engineer, title)

Wullffwarro (VI, Maul, Ezra, Engine Upgrade)

I flew against a Kylo/Soontir/Nightbeast list. Between Fenn's ability and Hotshot, rerolling dice, I only lost a single shield on Wullffwarro, but my opponent had pretty bad red dice luck. I mean, the list makes people's dice bad, but there's only so much it could do if someone rolls three natural hits. When someone rolls only one natural hit on 4 dice, after having Fenn strip their focus token, and you've got M9 on them, well, that's just a gutpunch.

Still, I feel like the basic architecture has legs. It works on the same principle as a Sensor Jammer Ghost, if not as well. I feel like Pulsed Ray Shield is probably not right on Fenn Rau, and could easily be Vectored Thrusters on someone. It'd be sweet on Fenn Rau, but possibly also strong on the ARC. That'd give every ship a chance at PS 11 reposition (although FAA isn't the most reliable), and while PS 9 is in theory nice, going to Adaptability or Trick Shot would open points for Thane Kyrell, and I think his ability would potentially add a lot of offense. Or maybe it makes him a target, where perhaps it seems OK to ignore Braylen...

One thing which is nice: it doesn't really "fly together" like a Lowhhrick list would have to. It's good to be fairly close, but there's a lot of wiggle room. I also found myself boosting a lot with Wullffwarro as his primary action. 2-hard into a boost is really nice with that 180-degree arc. But then again, this was a matchup where my opponent mostly tried to flee with Soontir/Nightbeast, and never really had too much to fear from people attacking Wullff.

I agree that PRS probably isn't worth it on Fenn as you have him otherwise. To run PRS, I think the best combo is then Nien and FAA, because then he has stress clearing and a bit of maneuverability anyway. But then you lose the HotCop utility, which is nice.

Braylen and Wulfy seem good! Though I would rather have VT than EU

11 hours ago, Greebwahn said:

I agree that PRS probably isn't worth it on Fenn as you have him otherwise. To run PRS, I think the best combo is then Nien and FAA, because then he has stress clearing and a bit of maneuverability anyway. But then you lose the HotCop utility, which is nice.

Braylen and Wulfy seem good! Though I would rather have VT than EU

If I went Vectored on Wullff, I could put VT on all three ships. That'd be pretty nice, even if the boosting Wookiee was pretty sweet. Then it's just decide if I want VI on Wullffwarro, or Trick Shot and use the point to get Thane Kyrell. He should be more of a threat, but that might be a bad thing.

PRS was partly because I found there was a lot of time flying Ghost/Fenn last weekend at a 4-round tournament is that there was a lot of time when I didn't use his ability and wouldn't be stressed; I might have only had one ship in arc, and was able to HotShot it away. Regen is always going to be nice when there is very little damage incoming, which is where my first thoughts for the list came about--getting regen Poe with both HSCP Fenn and the M9-WE combo on another ship. That said, I think Wullff might be worthwhile these days. Anyhow, PRS was mostly an afterthought filler.

I'm certainly trying a variant or two of this again tomorrow at casual night.

Flew casual night, won with Poe/Braylen/Fenn vs. an oddball mixed rebels. Played Wullf/Thane/Fenn (all with Vectored Thrusters) against a Kylo/Stridan with major stress control. There wasn't a clock per se, but I had both his ships down to like 1 or 2 HP (Kylo had Direct Hit and Damaged Engine), but it was getting late.

Flew the Poe/Braylen/Fenn version in a small 5-person tournament today, went 3-0, against Oicunn and Vessery Ion/D, against Fenn/Dash/Biggs (where his trick shot Dash rolled natural 5 hits against Poe... and M9 rerolled into another hit), and against RacLo/Quickdraw (where both Poe and Fenn got PS-0'd in pretty quick order). Never lost more than one ship (Usually Braylen, but Fenn against QD).

I feel like this list has legs. Poe/Fenn was an established archetype, usually with Wedge or like Lowhhrick, but M9-G8 and Weapons Engineer on an ARC is really strong. Basically, it does something a lot like what the Sensor Jammer on a Ghost does, not as reliably, but against any target, and it can be used offensively. Compared to a Lowhhrick, such an ARC doesn't have a formation requirement. I can split up my ships as needed, and still have M9 rerolling dice. Frankly, I wouldn't mind if M9-G8 had a range 1-3 restriction on the rerolls.

But still, it overall feels a little less unfair than a Ghost (not a very high bar, I know). Poe invests in a personal PS 11, rather than getting a large-base boost from Fenn Rau. All the ships have actual firing arcs and not turrets. Regen is still kinda dirty when messing with your opponent's dice, but yard work dirty instead of sewer work dirty.