One of the first ideas I had for making a Genesys game of my own was a mecha game - an old Gundam PbP I was a part of had even fiddled around with the idea of using the dice back when Edge was the only thing out - and I'm finally getting started on it and writing about it over at the site.

I could probably club the whole thing together inside of a few weeks but, well, we've had an addition to the family, so free time is limited. This first post is the outline of what I think needs to be done - alter the vehicle rules, new critical hit table, Advantage/Threat/Triumph/Despair usage, create gear and the mecha that will use them - and some of how I'm going to go about it. The rest of it will be a slow burn project, which I'm really looking forward to.

So, what do you think of the Genesys Mecha Design Goals? And hey, while I'm here, anyone else trying to get giant robots into Genesys? What're you doing to make the system fit the genre?

It's definitely something I want to do as well, but you've definitely put pen to paper on it much more than me.

I think if you want to do Mecha Characteristics, I would only do Brawn. Leave Agility to the skill of the pilot, the Speed rating, the Handling rating, and ranks in Accurate/Inaccurate.

I don't really like Characteristic caps. I get what it's going for, but to me it kind of feels backwards. In Gundam (from what I've seen) a newtype (or whatever they're calling them in that particular series) can jump into a Zaku and make it sing but a normal human will jump into a Gundam and freeze. I would sooner do something like give better models Unwieldy ratings (or something similar for Cunning if you want it be more about information overload than reaction speeds) to represent that the more powerful models are more difficult to use.

If I were piloting a rusted out Mech with negative Handling, low Armor, ranks of Innacurate, and a pea-shooter against bleeding edge prototypes, I'd feel the pressure. The only thing I have to rely on there is my characters skills, so I feel uneasy taking those away too.

I'd run mechas like vehicles also. Maybe using the body as the vehicle and the rest of the body like customizations. Like Star Wars vehicles, that you can change a space ship in a few ways, maybe you want yours to hold cargo or to be a spacial fortress.

The body would work as the back bone. You can create different models here. Some could be bigger or stronger than others.

2 arms, 2 legs, head and one more slot maybe. So each part could have abonus to hull, weapons, special qualities, mass...

29 minutes ago, Colyer said:

It's definitely something I want to do as well, but you've definitely put pen to paper on it much more than me.

I think if you want to do Mecha Characteristics, I would only do Brawn. Leave Agility to the skill of the pilot, the Speed rating, the Handling rating, and ranks in Accurate/Inaccurate.

I don't really like Characteristic caps. I get what it's going for, but to me it kind of feels backwards. In Gundam (from what I've seen) a newtype (or whatever they're calling them in that particular series) can jump into a Zaku and make it sing but a normal human will jump into a Gundam and freeze. I would sooner do something like give better models Unwieldy ratings (or something similar for Cunning if you want it be more about information overload than reaction speeds) to represent that the more powerful models are more difficult to use.

If I were piloting a rusted out Mech with negative Handling, low Armor, ranks of Innacurate, and a pea-shooter against bleeding edge prototypes, I'd feel the pressure. The only thing I have to rely on there is my characters skills, so I feel uneasy taking those away too.

Little light bulb went off in my head when you mentioned Unwieldy. That . . . that definitely conveys the difficulty of using the machines, and it takes advantage of an existing rule.

I didn't have Cunning on the mind, but that could be worth a look too. Or maybe port in some of the change-Lightsaber's-characteristic Talents . . .

Anyway, food for thought. Thanks!

5 minutes ago, Bellyon said:

I'd run mechas like vehicles also. Maybe using the body as the vehicle and the rest of the body like customizations. Like Star Wars vehicles, that you can change a space ship in a few ways, maybe you want yours to hold cargo or to be a spacial fortress.

2 arms, 2 legs, head and one more slot maybe. So each part could have abonus to hull, weapons, special qualities, mass...

A lot of the hard points are going to be in the extremities, yeah! I'm not thinking a hard and fast rule for it at the moment, but as I'm tinkering on the modular mecha I'd like to lead off with, the load-outs are being designed with the arms, the head, the back, etc, being considered. A couple points might be kept for 'internal' modifications like better sensors, better computers, that sort of thing.

When I get around to creating machines that are more unique, that's where some special qualities and such will be inherent in the machine, as opposed to gear, but even they will have some room for customization. Probably.

Yeah, for Cunning I had Kira from Gundam Seed in mind as they talk about him being able to pilot the Strike more because he could handle all of the information that it was funnelling at him and make sense of the prototype's non-intuitive controls more than just a higher reaction speed. Not sure how original Gundam handled that, and I'm pretty sure Wing was super-soldiers. So it all depends on what you want to model for that particular Mech. Is it hard to pilot because it's arcane? Cunning. Is it hard to pilot because of the precise controls or reaction times? Agility. Is the power steering out? Brawn (I kid).

For changing characteristics, I could see gear being able to do a lot of that. If you want to have a low Agility pilot, maybe offer him some advanced targeting system that works off of intelligence.

I am aware of one person who is about to be in the Playtesting phase of a Macross/Robotech theme for Genesys; and they've contributed to a few SW books...

32 minutes ago, DarthGM said:

I am aware of one person who is about to be in the Playtesting phase of a Macross/Robotech theme for Genesys; and they've contributed to a few SW books...

Darn, I would have loved to have gotten in on that since Robotech (in all its forms were my first exposure to Mecha and it's left a lasting impression... )

The biggest problem with vehicles was always being able to last, at least in Star Wars. I think now the vehicle rules are mostly workable, you just have to design the mecha in a way that makes prolonged encounters with them feasible. Higher hull and system strain than what was average for Star Wars, and possibly slightly weaker weapons. Less Breach and Linked for sure.

Most mecha I've seen has very modular weapon kits. I'm thinking having the HP represent how much equipment each vehicle can operate at a given time, and allow for them to swap 'gear' out in between missions without checks, just a time investment and a the proper machinery.

Another thing is characters. You'd need to introduce some talents that differentiate one mecha pilot from another. There are some in Star Wars already, but adding a few more is always a good idea.

I would do this:

Make the pilot as a regular character

Mechs have Silhouette, Speed, Defense, HT, SS and Armour just like vehicles. Additionally each mech provides a modifier to all 6 of a pilots characteristics, potentially also boosting or reducing skills as well.

Then when in the cockpit the pilot uses more skills than just the normal Operate/Pilot and Combat skills.

Lets say your character is trying to stealth through a canyon to get close to an enemy, if you’re in a smaller mech with steal tech then it’s probably boosting at least your stealth skill, but perhaps also your Cunning.

What if your extremely Agile (4) but in a slow heavy mech(-2)? well you’re getting a penalty to your Agility but it’s still going to be better than other characters who are naturally less agile. Your able to think and move more fluidly than them, compensating for the Vehicle deficiency’s.

There would be room for mech customisation, with attachments or modifications.

There is also room for pc talents to handle mechs better, getting more from the Vehicle.

4 hours ago, Cannibal Halfling said:

A lot of the hard points are going to be in the extremities, yeah! I'm not thinking a hard and fast rule for it at the moment, but as I'm tinkering on the modular mecha I'd like to lead off with, the load-outs are being designed with the arms, the head, the back, etc, being considered. A couple points might be kept for 'internal' modifications like better sensors, better computers, that sort of thing.

When I get around to creating machines that are more unique, that's where some special qualities and such will be inherent in the machine, as opposed to gear, but even they will have some room for customization. Probably.

Yep. So, basically, the chasis (body) woudl have a lot of Hard Points. Much more than a regular vehicle. Create few models. Explain the design and the specifications. Stats and what it's possible to attach and what can't.

(I don't know much about games or whatever that have mechas, so I'd use the Iron Kingdoms as a starting point to do anything)

With this done, it's time to create the other parts of the mechas, like you said. Left arm, right arm, legs, head, back, sensors, system, etc. (but I think the base chasis must have at least a base stuff).

Here I assume that a lot of these parts would cost 1 or 2 Hard Points, no more than that. But the chasis have a limit. You can create subtypes of each one, like: light arms, heavy arms, nuclear core/reator, diesel core/reator, etc.

So... the chasis should have at least 5 points? 2 to arms, 1 to legs, 1 to head and 1 to the body. But I think they must have a little more, or maybe better models have more.

Just trying to illustrate:

The player wants the chasis A:

Silhouette: 4. Speed: +0. Handling: +0. Def. Fore 0 / Port - / Starboard - / Aft. 0. Armor: 2. Hull: 12. Stress: 12. Type/Model: The Brave Heart. Manufacturer: Galato Corp. Sensor Range: -. Crew: 1. Encumbrance Capacity: 40. Passenger Capacity: 0. Consumables: 1 month. Cost/Rarity: 2,000,000 credits/4. Customization Hard Points: 7. Weapons: none.

Arm 1:

Silhouette: +0. Speed: +0. Handling: +0. Def. Fore - / Port 0 / Starboard 0 / Aft. -. Armor: +0. Hull: +3. Stress: -. Type/Model: Shooting Star n.3. Manufacturer: Hitachi Kamigawa. Sensor Range: -. Crew: -. Encumbrance: 3. Passenger Capacity: -. Consumables: -. Cost/Rarity: 350,000 credits/2. Customization Hard Points: -. Weapons: Ion Cannon (Light). Range: Close. Damage: 5. Critical: 4. Qualities: Ion. The cannon is attached to the arm in that way which is possible to use the hand. Light Hand: Range: Engaged. Damage: 3. Critical: 5. Encumbrance: 0. Qualities: Disorient 1, Knockdown.

Arm 2:

Silhouette: +0. Speed: +0. Handling: +0. Def. Fore - / Port 0 / Starboard 0 / Aft. -. Armor: +0. Hull: +3. Stress: -. Type/Model: Worm Chopper. Manufacturer: Stark Industries. Sensor Range: -. Crew: -. Encumbrance: 4. Passenger Capacity: -. Consumables: -. Cost/Rarity: 425,000 credits/3. Customization Hard Points: -. Weapons: Vibro-Axe. Range: Engaged. Damage: 6. Critical: 2. Qualities: Pierce 2, Sunder, Vicious 3.

Legs:

Silhouette: +0. Speed: 2. Handling: 0. Def. Fore 0 / Port - / Starboard - / Aft. 0. Armor: +0. Hull: +4. Stress: -. Type/Model: Basic Legs. Manufacturer: Galato Corp. Sensor Range: -. Crew: -. Encumbrance: 8. Passenger Capacity: -. Consumables: -. Cost/Rarity: 600,000 credits/3. Customization Hard Points: -. Weapons: Mechanical Legs: Range: Engaged. Damage: 3. Critical: 5. Encumbrance: 0. Qualities: Disorient 1, Knockdown.

Head

Silhouette: -. Speed: -. Handling: -. Def. Fore - / Port - / Starboard - / Aft. -. Armor: +0. Hull: +2. Stress: -. Type/Model: Evil Brain. Manufacturer: Galato Corp. Sensor Range: Med. Crew: -. Encumbrance: 2. Passenger Capacity: -. Consumables: -. Cost/Rarity: 250,000 credits/2. Customization Hard Points: -. Weapons: none. Have a communicating system that can reach across a planet and to ships in high orbit. Remove up to 1 setback imposed due to long range or poor ligh. Has life form tracking, motion sensing, metal detection, and the ability to intercept standard frequency comlink transmissions.

OBS.: The body/chasis could have the stat "Potency" (the standard should be 3 to 5 I think), which could work as the Brawn. The other stats and skills could be the pilot instead.

17 hours ago, Swordbreaker said:

The biggest problem with vehicles was always being able to last, at least in Star Wars. I think now the vehicle rules are mostly workable, you just have to design the mecha in a way that makes prolonged encounters with them feasible. Higher hull and system strain than what was average for Star Wars, and possibly slightly weaker weapons. Less Breach and Linked for sure.

Most mecha I've seen has very modular weapon kits. I'm thinking having the HP represent how much equipment each vehicle can operate at a given time, and allow for them to swap 'gear' out in between missions without checks, just a time investment and a the proper machinery.

Another thing is characters. You'd need to introduce some talents that differentiate one mecha pilot from another. There are some in Star Wars already, but adding a few more is always a good idea.

Yeah, with mecha combat at the forefront of whatever campaign these things would be used in, they're going to need to be able to take more than a pair of hits before going down.

I'm thinking to include the AD-1S's rules for switching out load-outs just for mid-battle changes; this ties into weapons/gear being lost/damaged getting added in to either the Critical Hit tables, narrative result uses, or both.

Showboat immediately comes to mind, but that might be residual trauma from what our pilot put us through in that last Age game. But yes! Past Archetypes and Careers, pilots are going to need Talents to stick out from the crowd.

1 hour ago, Cannibal Halfling said:

Yeah, with mecha combat at the forefront of whatever campaign these things would be used in, they're going to need to be able to take more than a pair of hits before going down.

I'm thinking to include the AD-1S's rules for switching out load-outs just for mid-battle changes; this ties into weapons/gear being lost/damaged getting added in to either the Critical Hit tables, narrative result uses, or both.

Showboat immediately comes to mind, but that might be residual trauma from what our pilot put us through in that last Age game. But yes! Past Archetypes and Careers, pilots are going to need Talents to stick out from the crowd.

You could do like the lightsaber form talents. Have certain talents that allow a pilot to use an alternate characteristic when piloting, then two or three other talents that specifically use that combination. Incorporate a few other skills in as well, like how Superhuman Reflexes uses Cool.

you could also look at my battletech stuff, I had already posted there as I have stopped my conversion since alot of others were doing a mecha conversion already. I had posted some special actions based on special equipment some mechs had like Jump Jets and for others they have the Masc system installed which allowed additional movement and I was planning on that also granting setback dice for the Smaller mechs. It should be a couple of pages back by now since I stopped it a could weeks ago. But recommend looking at Battletech for other stuff as well. I was chatting with one of my players and we both think I should have gone with Light and Medium mechs either silhouette 2 or 3 and Heavy and Assault Mechs as Silhouette 4. Will probably get back into my conversion after I do other conversions first.

10 hours ago, Swordbreaker said:

You could do like the lightsaber form talents. Have certain talents that allow a pilot to use an alternate characteristic when piloting, then two or three other talents that specifically use that combination. Incorporate a few other skills in as well, like how Superhuman Reflexes uses Cool.

Yeah, definitely something along those lines.

I can say that the Willpower one will probably include something bonus for Scathing Tirade because, let's be honest, anime mecha pilots are always yelling at one another.

Well, one does need to have a giant robot or two if they're going to have giant robots smashing one another to pieces.

This month's System Hack presents the CHM-01 Ogo, the base line machine for my version of Mecha in Genesys, including the Load-Out system it uses. Also included in the article are some new rules, the answers to some of the questions raised in the Design Goals article, Mecha-as-Minions-and-Rivals, and some thoughts on how to deal with non-mecha vehicles in a mecha world.

Let me know what you think (and keep your own Genesys Mecha ideas coming, it's really cool to see how others are doing it)!

As a total mecha fan girl all I can say is...

More Mecha Now... I mean, Please!!!

Alright, so we have ourselves a giant robot. Still can't have it smash another giant robot to pieces without someone to pilot the darn things.

This month's System Hack is all about Archetypes and Careers, with the Archetypes based on character types common to the genre and the Careers based off of the roles they play. Along the way I explain a few design choices, mull over a different way to create Careers, tip my hat to the Genesys Talents Expanded list on this very forum, talk about the problem with Brawn when you've got giant robots on the field, and make a point to spend some time out of the cockpit.

I'm curious to see what people think, particularly about the Archetypes and their Special Abilities!

Did you make any changes to the skills list?

Why not do a two tier career selection process? Everybody is a Pilot, so they can get those. But the other choice is where they could diverge from each other. Sure thus will give all the characters more career skills than Genesys Core Rules say, but these are badass mecha pilots after all.

The idea of picking two "careers" like options I'm taking from the Elder Scrolls hack from on here.

Another potential solution is thinking of more Pacific Rim type Mecha. Where the pilot puts on gear and has to have some physical skills themself to pilot the Mecha. Or all of the above with different kinds of Mecha with different controls and associated stats.

A giant Mecha that needs a crew and uses Operation. Think the giant Mecha in Gurren Lagan.

A standard Mecha that uses pilot as normal. Think Evangelion.

A Jager style that us the pilot just moving as normal and might use Athletics/Coordination. Thinking Pacific Rim.

This would allow you to spread the skills across more Careers and create different kinds of Mecha.

11 hours ago, Stacie_GmrGrl said:

Did you make any changes to the skills list?

Why not do a two tier career selection process? Everybody is a Pilot, so they can get those. But the other choice is where they could diverge from each other. Sure thus will give all the characters more career skills than Genesys Core Rules say, but these are badass mecha pilots after all.

The idea of picking two "careers" like options I'm taking from the Elder Scrolls hack from on here.

1) Just a few so far! Clash is a new skill to represent mecha-scale melee combat, and in this version of things uses the Brawn of the mecha as its base. In this particular article Knowledge got broadened a little bit: Knowledge (Warfare) ported over from Age of Rebellion and Knowledge (Mecha) made from scratch.

2a) Interesting idea. Probably taken care of by having players, with GM guidance, pick their 8 career skills a la Dice for Brains, but a viable alternative. I wouldn't see a problem with them getting a few extra skills, either. Genesys characters are a little light on Career Skills and free ranks compared to their Star Wars brethren, after all. 2b) Elder Scrolls hack? That I've got to check out.

10 hours ago, Noahjam325 said:

Another potential solution is thinking of more Pacific Rim type Mecha. Where the pilot puts on gear and has to have some physical skills themself to pilot the Mecha. Or all of the above with different kinds of Mecha with different controls and associated stats.

A giant Mecha that needs a crew and uses Operation. Think the giant Mecha in Gurren Lagan.

A standard Mecha that uses pilot as normal. Think Evangelion.

A Jager style that us the pilot just moving as normal and might use Athletics/Coordination. Thinking Pacific Rim.

This would allow you to spread the skills across more Careers and create different kinds of Mecha.

Ooooo, or for another example, G Gundam's mobile fighters with their 1:1 (quite skintight) control system.

The giant mecha and jaeger/mobile fighter types operate on some different genre assumptions than what I've defaulted to so far with Genesys Mecha (cockpits, control sticks, decidedly 'real robot' feel, etc) but they're perfectly viable, and while they create a different 'feel' the game design implications are interesting. I've been mulling over a 'super robot' article or two down the line; this gives me a few more ideas for different 'genres' of mecha/alternate rules that could be explored.

The Elder Scrolls hack is the Edge of Tamriel by Kalaamity on these forums. Look for the thread below.

Its amazing.

We've got pilots, we've got a basic machine they can fight one another with . . . but variety is the spice of life, and improving pilot skill is only one way to better take the fight to the enemy.

So for this slightly-ahead-of-schedule System Hack for Genesys Mecha we have some Advanced Models: the general-purpose CHM-02 Dacar, the artillery-firing CHM-03 Peren, the high flying CHM-04 Capax, and the 'salvage expert' CHM-05 Verdeloth. Included is a fine and elegantly crafted link to the Genesys Mecha Armory where you can find all of the hand-held mecha weaponry and attachments created for Genesys Mecha so far.

It's a relatively straightforward one, but what do we think? Solid entries? Need some tweaks? Got an idea I missed that would make for a good CHM-06?

4 hours ago, Cannibal Halfling said:

We've got pilots, we've got a basic machine they can fight one another with . . . but variety is the spice of life, and improving pilot skill is only one way to better take the fight to the enemy.

So for this slightly-ahead-of-schedule System Hack for Genesys Mecha we have some Advanced Models: the general-purpose CHM-02 Dacar, the artillery-firing CHM-03 Peren, the high flying CHM-04 Capax, and the 'salvage expert' CHM-05 Verdeloth. Included is a fine and elegantly crafted link to the Genesys Mecha Armory where you can find all of the hand-held mecha weaponry and attachments created for Genesys Mecha so far.

It's a relatively straightforward one, but what do we think? Solid entries? Need some tweaks? Got an idea I missed that would make for a good CHM-06?

Gonna have to give some of these mechs a shot, then. Also, we can't forget the aquatic suits ?

On 4/30/2018 at 1:47 PM, satkaz said:

Gonna have to give some of these mechs a shot, then. Also, we can't forget the aquatic suits ?

An untapped market! Thanks for the idea.

. . . . this is a chance to build a harpoon gun. Excellent.