3 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Ultimately the greatest counter to lists like Ghost/Fenn is that most people just get super bored using it and move on after having success with it.

I wonder if that same basic issue led to the reduced presence of Ego, Wookies, and I assume Trip Defenders or Quald TLT.

All that stuff still pops up and dominates at pretty much every tournament but in fewer #s.

I guess this is due to most X-Wing players actually having a preference for using fun things?

Oh, i disagree. We really like winning. That's what high level competitive X-Wing is all about. And frankly, I found flying Ghost Fenn to be quite interesting. If I weren't so list A.D.D. I would definitely run it again to see if I could get better at it. Turns out I was flying it the worst way possible. Also, I'd like to try it with Synced turret to see what the Polish are talking about.

I just think there's a lot of healthy and fun counter play. Prevents a "this or nothing" meta.

10 hours ago, Killerardvark said:

Oh, i disagree. We really like winning. That's what high level competitive X-Wing is all about. And frankly, I found flying Ghost Fenn to be quite interesting. If I weren't so list A.D.D. I would definitely run it again to see if I could get better at it. Turns out I was flying it the worst way possible. Also, I'd like to try it with Synced turret to see what the Polish are talking about.

I just think there's a lot of healthy and fun counter play. Prevents a "this or nothing" meta.

Yea I think I am more referring to List A.D.D. then whether or not there are a couple interesting layers of the Ghost/Fenn Onion.

I feel like im basically running around from list to list like this hero:

You can be Jar Jar. I'm over here learning and plotting like Thrawn. To defeat your enemy you must know your enemy. That's a good bit of why I flew it at Indy. I feel more capable of defeating it now that I've flown it.

5 hours ago, Killerardvark said:

You can be Jar Jar. I'm over here learning and plotting like Thrawn. To defeat your enemy you must know your enemy. That's a good bit of why I flew it at Indy. I feel more capable of defeating it now that I've flown it.

This version of Ghost+ is legitimately better than Ghost/Biggs or Ghost/Lowhrick right? I want to say yes and I guess on paper if you look at Meta-Wing the answer is maybe? Thinking back to what it was like to try and bring down Biggs I recall it taking a similar # of rounds as it does to bring down Fenn...usually 2-3...4 being a near guaranteed loss. With this it seems closer to 1-2 in Fenn's case if you have actionless mods but 2-4 otherwise. The PS11 Coordinate adds an entire layer of extra capability the ghost never had before. So maybe thats why its caused such an uproar in addition to the Ezra/Maul combo serving as a significant buff to TLT.

Kanan/Biggs certainly wasn't a bad list in its day but it was pretty much universally viewed as an annoying but only above average list. Seems to have had fewer tricks than Ghost/Fenn. Either way this latest iteration is an extremely solid list that everyone has to plan for first in the list building stage, it can dumpster entire sections of the meta but ultimately isn't a world beater.

Practicing against lists is helpful but running it yourself as you point out really can drive home what the decision tree looks like and how it can be exploited. I know the few times I have run Lothal/Fenn for research purposes I walked away from it thinking that it doesn't work all together that different from RAC/Lo, its just better against stuff without actionless mods. You roll up, you negate a ton of damage, and you dish a bunch of damage, and you sorta big base "arc" dodge while being a bit more afraid of multiple ship lists and a few specific cards. Avoiding walking Fenn into a kill box where he can get hit from both sides at once is important, ending up in a spot where Fenn has only 1 of an opponents 3 ships in arc is also a good way to end up with a chance of losing. The most interesting/tense part to me is what happens the turns near and after deploying Zeb, though many games don't get to that point it usually means there is only 1 of your opponents ships left probably on 1 or 2 hull. Pretty much every time I have beaten Ghost/Fenn it has always been a nail biter of my last remaining ship limping along and trying not to get destroyed by Zeb, which sounds funny but is basically my win condition since I don't have a ton of actionless dice mods in my usual lists ( something I probably need to change). Figuring out how to keep Fenn close to the ghost is also something I see get messed up a bit...though playing them separated is a legit strategy since the Ghost doesn't 100% need the coordinate in all cases and can go a round or 2 without it. Seems much more important that Fenn keeps the maximum quantity of ships in arc. The main thing I am surprised by is how many Ghost players don't stick to the edge of the board to circle round the asteroids with the 4x TLT and instead just drive right up the middle and serve Fenn up on a platter. I haven't decided yet if thats the sign of a bad Ghost/Fenn player or a Ghost/Fenn player thats really good and I should be afraid of.

I know i said it before but seriously....

Sooner or later it will stick

5 hours ago, atkrull said:

I know i said it before but seriously....

Sooner or later it will stick

Marksmanship Sabacc is actually a legit Ghost/Fenn counter. Has proven out in testing so far.

Coach sees the Matrix. Confirmed.

Enjoy some Beer on the house.

I may have found my peoples. Listened to my first OCX today. You guys **** on 3-6 year olds. THANK YOU. Terrible 2's have nothing on ******* 4 year olds. Seriously. They are terrible human beings at that age. Oh...I'm a former resident of Iowa City, Omaha and married a woman from South Dakota. Do I get some sort of honorary OCX status?

12 hours ago, viedit said:

I may have found my peoples. Listened to my first OCX today. You guys **** on 3-6 year olds. THANK YOU. Terrible 2's have nothing on ******* 4 year olds. Seriously. They are terrible human beings at that age. Oh...I'm a former resident of Iowa City, Omaha and married a woman from South Dakota. Do I get some sort of honorary OCX status?

Immediate disqualification for living in the same city that birthed the Hawkeyes Just kidding, welcome to the fold my brudah! Grab a beer and warm up the keyboard for Wednesday night, we go live on youtube around 8:30ish

I've definitely found you guys to be amazing. I have a 1 year old that's the size of a 2 year old and find your child insight to be spot on. Also, fack I'm hosed. I've visited the field of dreams and my grandparents lived in Dubuque, is honorary OCX scrub status a thing?

12 minutes ago, jonnyd said:

I've definitely found you guys to be amazing. I have a 1 year old that's the size of a 2 year old and find your child insight to be spot on. Also, fack I'm hosed. I've visited the field of dreams and my grandparents lived in Dubuque, is honorary OCX scrub status a thing?

Everyone is an honorary OCX scrub..... we are adopting a new acronym for OCX, "Open Community X wing"

LIVECAST DAY! DILLY DILLY!

Also, listened to the most recent podcast over again (played Vassal during the livecast) and between the latest and the OCX ON TOP! episode with champagne, @atkrull has been hitting the booze hard. Lets see if it continues tonight!

nope... wasted all my whiskey on the Millennium Condor podcast Monday King of Beers tonight

oh wow.... for your own sanity Time Stamp 51:30 for real content

14 minutes ago, atkrull said:

oh wow.... for your own sanity Time Stamp 51:30 for real content

For last episode or tonight's recording? Or both?

hahaha both

as yoda said

Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.

Fly it and they shall rend their sack cloth's and cry salty tears!

On 2/26/2018 at 9:52 AM, Killerardvark said:

You can be Jar Jar. I'm over here learning and plotting like Thrawn. To defeat your enemy you must know your enemy. That's a good bit of why I flew it at Indy. I feel more capable of defeating it now that I've flown it.

OCX Radio Live: Worlds Championship Ft. North America (plus Gerry Russell)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9qCrkbhNK4

Just finish listening to the episode on cheating and there’s another thing to look out for with templates. At my kit tournament Sunday we had a guy using Attack Wing acrylic templates. I always thought that the templates were exactly the same, but it turns out that the 1 and 2 banks for Attack Wing are way bigger than their X-Wing equivalents. Luckily we caught it early in the first round.

1. Mark randomly making Wookie noises is a solid new segment.

2. I hope Marksmanship and Jabba make at least Top 8.

3. Kyle's scum list sounds like stupid amounts of fun.

4. When will the trophy shelf segment be returning?

5. I would definitely play Imperial Assault as an alternate to X-Wing if everything was pre-painted.

14 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

1. Mark randomly making Wookie noises is a solid new segment.

2. I hope Marksmanship and Jabba make at least Top 8.

3. Kyle's scum list sounds like stupid amounts of fun.

4. When will the trophy shelf segment be returning?

5. I would definitely play Imperial Assault as an alternate to X-Wing if everything was pre-painted.

I do have another shelf to build.

13 hours ago, Brunas said:

I do have another shelf to build.

You should get Bob the "Builder" to help you out with that.

"I'm just gonna put a bomb here..."

13 hours ago, RStan said:

You should get Bob the "Builder" to help you out with that.

"I'm just gonna put a bomb here..."

Instead of a robe @Brunas wears a construction vest next episode?

Great to meet you this weekend Coach! Forget the east/west coast things.... No coast drunkest coast?! Inquiring minds would love to know, where's that footage of your Game 4 streamed game?

Also, how the **** was this on page 3?!

For anyone that didn't go to the Omaha regional, you haven't lived until you hear 100 xwing players sing 80's songs. Plenty more room in the shop for next year...

1 hour ago, jonnyd said:

Great to meet you this weekend Coach! Forget the east/west coast things.... No coast drunkest coast?! Inquiring minds would love to know, where's that footage of your Game 4 streamed game?

Also, how the **** was this on page 3?!

For anyone that didn't go to the Omaha regional, you haven't lived until you hear 100 xwing players sing 80's songs. Plenty more room in the shop for next year...

I'm not sure where the footage is of my 15 min "game". I am wondering if they forgot to archive the footage on twitch, which means its lost forever..... which shucks darn that's a shame

#flyingasajjofftheboardisnotagoodwaytoflyasajj