From one of the FB groups, author credit to Andrew Sigrist

Some subtle things that I learned from the Star Wars Legion demo at the Las Vegas Open this weekend.

1. You may not fit the same weapon to a vehicle more than once (sorry no triple mortar AT-ST)
2. Climbing over small obstacles (barricades, or small crates less than the height of your models) reduces the speed of the maneuver to be speed 1.
3. Climbing a large obstacle (a building, a cliff etc) can be done, but you must either use both actions, or roll a white attack die for each model attempting the ascent, On a hit they fall and take a wound (unless you have expert climber)
4. The maximum bend you can get out of a maneuver template is 90 degrees.
5. Height 1 is really high. Any realistic looking single story building will easily be less than height 1 meaning Luke can jump on top of it, and Speeders can fly onto/over it.
6. The weapon's special attributes (Impact 3, Ion 1 etc) confers its attributes to the whole attack rather than just the dice added by that weapon. That means if you attack with an Ion weapon and all the rest of your guys, any hit that sticks will ionize the vehicle not just the dice coming from the ion weapon.

It certainly explains the cost+restrictions on a hh-12 and ion troopers

So it seems that the single heavy weapon model is a more abstract representation that the squad is armed with several of these weapons. hence why you can only have one in a squad.

I like it. makes everything more deadly and therefore quicker games.

1 hour ago, Ralgon said:

It certainly explains the cost+restrictions on a hh-12 and ion troopers

Yeah, I figured this would be the case. It's hard to come to a different conclusion after reading the rules reminder text for the Ion keyword, "(A vehicle wounded by an attack that includes this weapon gains 1 ion token.)" That Impact would apply to all the dice in the weapons pool is logically consistent. And honestly the AT-ST grenade launcher would feel terribly over priced if Blast only applied to its 2 black dice when you attack the same target with its main laser cannon. It would feel really pointless if the cover still cancelled hits from the laser cannon's dice.

3 hours ago, Ralgon said:

6. The weapon's special attributes (Impact 3, Ion 1 etc) confers its attributes to the whole attack rather than just the dice added by that weapon. That means if you attack with an Ion weapon and all the rest of your guys, any hit that sticks will ionize the vehicle not just the dice coming from the ion weapon.

That is deeply, deeply silly.

4 minutes ago, elbmc1969 said:

That is deeply, deeply silly.

Or streamlined and easier to keep track of, depending on how you want to view it.

Sure you can roll the weapons separately , but then what about aim tokes?

Not rolling the big guns separate is a little less than I am used to from war games but can see how overall its simpler all together.

Like battlefront maybe the other troops are popping ion shot or armour peircing rounds in combination with the big gun and the overall combine effect is what we see so impact or ion for all.

I hope nobody is still worried about the vehicle spam...this confirmation makes them much more vulnerable.

3 hours ago, elbmc1969 said:

That is deeply, deeply silly.

I strongly disagree.

4 hours ago, elbmc1969 said:

6. The weapon's special attributes (Impact 3, Ion 1 etc) confers its attributes to the whole attack rather than just the dice added by that weapon. That means if you attack with an Ion weapon and all the rest of your guys, any hit that sticks will ionize the vehicle not just the dice coming from the ion weapon.

4 hours ago, elbmc1969 said:

That is deeply, deeply silly.

That is not only silly, it is the prime loophole for power creep. Now it is all about combining key words. FFG has form. Does anybody think they can refrain from doing a sharpshooter impact ion assault burst precise nimble unit? Or be able to adequately cost it? I would rather have three mortars on an AT-ST, bad as that may be. I don't mind silly, this is Star Wars, after all. I do mind faulty mechanisms.

2 hours ago, Rumar said:

That is not only silly, it is the prime loophole for power creep. Now it is all about combining key words. FFG has form. Does anybody think they can refrain from doing a sharpshooter impact ion assault burst precise nimble unit? Or be able to adequately cost it? I would rather have three mortars on an AT-ST, bad as that may be. I don't mind silly, this is Star Wars, after all. I do mind faulty mechanisms.

Ok, assuming you are talking about trooper units you only have four upgrade slots to work with... many of those keywords will only work at different ranges and against different types of targets and after having taken different actions. I really don’t see the problem here.

Adding the weapon quality to the whole attack is great, because otherwise your 32-34 point investment (almost another whole squads worth!) is less likely to be completely nullified by a crap roll. It doesn’t make the actual value of the ability go up, it’s still only what’s printed on the card.

Also, I’m not 100% sure this is how hardpoints work. Otherwise the “Arsenal” keyword seems unnecessary. So I think the AT-ST still needs to make separate attacks with each of its weapons.

10 hours ago, ShadowKite said:

Yeah, I figured this would be the case. It's hard to come to a different conclusion after reading the rules reminder text for the Ion keyword, "(A vehicle wounded by an attack that includes this weapon gains 1 ion token.)" That Impact would apply to all the dice in the weapons pool is logically consistent. And honestly the AT-ST grenade launcher would feel terribly over priced if Blast only applied to its 2 black dice when you attack the same target with its main laser cannon. It would feel really pointless if the cover still cancelled hits from the laser cannon's dice.

I thought the ATST is making two separate attacks though, not a single dice pool to roll like the troopers.

To me, blast shouldn’t apply to a laser cannon. Now, the impact keyword on the main gun does help negate the use of cover. So cover cannot cancel that many hits from the laser cannon itself.

I do like it for the troopers though.

4 hours ago, Extropia said:

I hope nobody is still worried about the vehicle spam...this confirmation makes them much more vulnerable.

Makes me wonder if it’s possible to build a decent army without the heavy class at all. If it’s not just the dice pool of the special trooper that can get impact, you could possibly burn down a heavy. And supports are way more susceptible to this.

Pretty sure a heavey vehicle won’t be able to combine attacks from its 3 different weapons. Arsenal clearly makes a point of saying it can make numerous attacks - that means individually. Possibly all at the same target, but they’re gonna have to be one after the other.

The flavour for the Troopers is good, and it is not broken. I’m picturing the y wing ion blasts on atats or the missile ion launchers in the battlefront games. They shoot, open up a period of time where all weapons are more effective against the vehicle, then its shields come back up.

I don’t think it’s gonna break the game or provide much creep as long as they keep impact under control. Remember that a match it only 6 rounds long. That Missile launch requires a whole action to release, and cannot be fired in the same turn that it moves. That means even in the very luckiest of situations in which you barely need to move and your opponent literally lines themselves up to be destroyed, you’ll still only get 3 uses out of it per game, MAX.

And even with all that. Dice still bring an element of chance into it.

7 hours ago, Ralgon said:

Sure you can roll the weapons separately , but then what about aim tokes?

Well, you roll out all the dice in the squad and depending on what hits or not you spend the aim token to change stuff into hits. So if it was an ion gun you want to get through and it misses you just re roll those dice. Idk why you’d roll separately unless split firing. If I’m understanding what you’re saying.

7 minutes ago, Kojib said:

Pretty sure a heavey vehicle won’t be able to combine attacks from its 3 different weapons. Arsenal clearly makes a point of saying it can make numerous attacks - that means individually. Possibly all at the same target, but they’re gonna have to be one after the other.

The flavour for the Troopers is good, and it is not broken. I’m picturing the y wing ion blasts on atats or the missile ion launchers in the battlefront games. They shoot, open up a period of time where all weapons are more effective against the vehicle, then its shields come back up.

I don’t think it’s gonna break the game or provide much creep as long as they keep impact under control. Remember that a match it only 6 rounds long. That Missile launch requires a whole action to release, and cannot be fired in the same turn that it moves. That means even in the very luckiest of situations in which you barely need to move and your opponent literally lines themselves up to be destroyed, you’ll still only get 3 uses out of it per game, MAX.

And even with all that. Dice still bring an element of chance into it.

Arsenal x mean that when you attack each mini can use up to x weapons. They can all shoot at the same target if they all have range/los or up to x different targets.

6 minutes ago, Kojib said:

Pretty sure a heavey vehicle won’t be able to combine attacks from its 3 different weapons. Arsenal clearly makes a point of saying it can make numerous attacks - that means individually. Possibly all at the same target, but they’re gonna have to be one after the other.

"While attacking, each mini in this unit can use up to X of it's weapons" sounds like combine attacks would be allowed. Otherwise I would expect the wording to be something like "after resolving an attack with one of the model's weapons, resolve up to X additional attacks with other weapons, one at a time."

Sounds like getting shot in this game hurts. I like it. Much better than two squads of space marines shooting at each other where only one dies

3 minutes ago, Jabby said:

Arsenal x mean that when you attack each mini can use up to x weapons. They can all shoot at the same target if they all have range/los or up to x different targets.

1 minute ago, Caimheul1313 said:

"While attacking, each mini in this unit can use up to X of it's weapons" sounds like combine attacks would be allowed. Otherwise I would expect the wording to be something like "after resolving an attack with one of the model's weapons, resolve up to X additional attacks with other weapons, one at a time."

you’re both right. Am I correct in thinking the Atst can still only make one attack per round then, but just use lots of weapons against that one target?

5 minutes ago, Kojib said:

you’re both right. Am I correct in thinking the Atst can still only make one attack per round then, but just use lots of weapons against that one target?

I don't think so, since I think it would be like making multiple weapon attacks from a unit. You can choose a different target for each weapon system, resolving shooting for each target after the declaration stage (I'm guessing that target declaration is all handled at the same time officially).

12 minutes ago, Kojib said:

you’re both right. Am I correct in thinking the Atst can still only make one attack per round then, but just use lots of weapons against that one target?

Its one ‘attack’ but with multiple weapons and targets. So you cant shoot one weapon then move and shoot another. (Also, thats 3 actions, so tbh you would only be able to do one attack anyway)

Hmm, for many keywords it doesn't really matter. The ones with numbers mostly apply to a given number of hits. For me its no difference if the left or right die can't be blocked its still one point of damage. For Ion the text of the keyword itself states that it doesn't matter how many weapons in a attack have it. If a unit of 100 Ion troopers shoot at an airspeeder it still gets just one Ion token.

The only real difference I can see is for blast and there it's thematic. Everyone not hit by the weapon will be driven out of cover and thus be an easy target for others.

8 minutes ago, LennoxPoodle said:

Hmm, for many keywords it doesn't really matter. The ones with numbers mostly apply to a given number of hits. For me its no difference if the left or right die can't be blocked its still one point of damage. For Ion the text of the keyword itself states that it doesn't matter how many weapons in a attack have it. If a unit of 100 Ion troopers shoot at an airspeeder it still gets just one Ion token.

The only real difference I can see is for blast and there it's thematic. Everyone not hit by the weapon will be driven out of cover and thus be an easy target for others.

I like your interpretation of blast.

the fact the squad is limited to six will keep the mechanic from being too crazy

1 hour ago, ScummyRebel said:

Makes me wonder if it’s possible to build a decent army without the heavy class at all. If it’s not just the dice pool of the special trooper that can get impact, you could possibly burn down a heavy. And supports are way more susceptible to this.

My temporary foray into Bolt Action ... some test games ... I remember some games being platoon based, which was your squads and some support weapons of choice but no tanks ... and others requiring use of tanks.

I wonder if there are rules within Legion that allow total flexibility with how you spend your points or if you are forced to bring a heavy each time?