33 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Thank you Geek19 and Snipafist for liking that post.

--

What exactly do you want to say to me Tae? Are you implying I should.... git gud?

I guess my 25-30 games vs Rieekan alone don't qualify for trying to learn the squadron game. Nor do my 15 or so games of playing Rieekan myself count for learning to play with squadrons. I'm also really bad playing squadrons because I haven't been playing them over and over for the whole of last year. Is that what you mean? Playing against the Regional winner of this region doesn't qualify. Okay.

Maybe I called the mirror match and top5/8 of worlds and at least 3 different regionals 6 months ahead of time because... I'm a scrub? (Oh wait I am a scrub. I don't own 4 MC30s for beating people in the face with).

Really, tell me, what do you mean? I guess I haven't lived up to your standards. Have I failed because I didn't try hard enough? If you give me another year I swear I'll grind out another 25 games of anti-mass squadron. I promise. I'm a good student. Don't green lightsaber slice me in half in my sleep.

You may have seen "Goodfellas" too many times.

Beyond that, you are way too angry at Mass Squadron lists. Get gud blood pressure medication. Enjoy your rant.

3 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Some cool data for you all.

[data]

It should be worth noting that these data can be skewed by any number of factors (Conforming to forum philosophy, individual player skill, interest in running new-to-wave archetypes that are 120+, etc), and aren't necessarily to be taken as law. Of course, I don't know the players involved necessarily.

You're welcome for fixing those formulas last night.

Blail, many here seem to agree with you, including myself after looking at the data. Squadron heavy lists are over-represented at the top. That's why there are a lot of little things in wave 7 that hit squadrons in some way, shape, or form. The developers have also already hit some aspects of squad heavy builds, such as double BCC and Rieekan abuse. Have some faith that they'll ding it again if over-representation continues.

The problem, as always, is you remain abusive and rude not just to those that disagree with you, but also those that simply take a moderate and measured tone. Take a chill pill. The problem has been identified. Congratulations are being right. Now please stop with the toxicity.

19 minutes ago, Truthiness said:

The problem, as always, is you remain abusive and rude not just to those that disagree with you, but also those that simply take a moderate and measured tone. Take a chill pill. The problem has been identified. Congratulations are being right. Now please stop with the toxicity.

So much this. The sheer toxic rage has almost made me block you several times Blail, but you have some valid points, or at least topics worth consideration, buried in there. Enough so to tip the balance and keeping me reading for now.

@Blail Blerg ...thank you for compiling that data. It's very interesting indeed.

I think that's my biggest complaint as well. One is greeted with a kind of toxicity even if you agree with Blail. And there seems to be no capacity to grasp that a person may agree on some points and disagree on others, or agree with a big picture, but disagree on some of the premises. And yes, I'd agree that there is some kind of merit to the thoughts, but the style of presentation, victim complex, and martyr complex tend to put one off for the whole discussion. Thanks to @Truthiness and @Formynder4 for saying what needed to be said and hopefully moving all of us forward to better discussion.

15 hours ago, Xeletor said:

Reading this makes me think the phantom is useful against intel. When an intel squad activates last to make a bunch of things heavy, the phantom always gets to move and tie up stuff again.

Maybe that is what cloak is meant to represent?

The problem I've had with Phantoms is that they get destroyed before their Cloak allows them to do anything useful. Point for point, 4 hull Phantoms don't compete against other squad builds in the squad-to-squad battle. Often, you lose 2-3 in the first exchange, and now with their cost premium you are way behind and who cares if a few Cloakers move away?

Before Strategic, a build with a token squad force could plan for late game engagements, aiming for ship-to-ship battles on turns 5-6, and using the token squad force to hold large squads forces at bay for a turn or 2. This doesn't work at all if your opponent has strategic and you have to choose from 3 of his strategic objectives. You're forced to get in a fight early or lose to a large objective VP gain.

8 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Thank you Geek19 and Snipafist for liking that post.

--

What exactly do you want to say to me Tae? Are you implying I should.... git gud?

I guess my 25-30 games vs Rieekan alone don't qualify for trying to learn the squadron game. Nor do my 15 or so games of playing Rieekan myself count for learning to play with squadrons. I'm also really bad playing squadrons because I haven't been playing them over and over for the whole of last year. Is that what you mean? Playing against the Regional winner of this region doesn't qualify. Okay.

Maybe I called the mirror match and top5/8 of worlds and at least 3 different regionals 6 months ahead of time because... I'm a scrub? (Oh wait I am a scrub. I don't own 4 MC30s for beating people in the face with).

Really, tell me, what do you mean? I guess I haven't lived up to your standards. Have I failed because I didn't try hard enough? If you give me another year I swear I'll grind out another 25 games of anti-mass squadron. I promise. I'm a good student. Don't green lightsaber slice me in half in my sleep.

I think what you fail to recognize is your own abilities. It's not a matter of getting good - it's a matter or being honest to yourself about what you are capable of doing. I know 100% that no matter how much practice I put in with/against squadrons I will never be as good with them as other players. Furthermore, I know that I am as good, if not better than a slim majority of the players in my local meta. Therefore, I know that being "bad" at squadron play puts me in the majority, not the minority, so it doesn't effect my self-worth.

Maybe you've just hit your cap?

Look, it bothers me too when I get whooped by a 22 year old with three part time jobs and an unhealthy obsession with Star Wars. But I've got a job, and a house, and a wife, and a kid, and a fat life insurance policy... so I win? Happiness is maintaining a .501 win ratio.

6 minutes ago, TaeSWXW said:

Happiness is maintaining a .501 win ratio.

Isn't this the Cincinnati Bengals motto?

Just now, geek19 said:

Isn't this the Cincinnati Bengals motto?

Are the Bengals even that good?

Just now, TaeSWXW said:

Are the Bengals even that good?

Lifetime? Probably. Under Marvin? ....also probably?

Cincinnati: Cromulence Exemplified

3 minutes ago, geek19 said:

Lifetime? Probably. Under Marvin? ....also probably?

Cincinnati: Cromulence Exemplified

Cincinnati: "We're better than Cleveland"

1 minute ago, TaeSWXW said:

Cincinnati: "We're better than Cleveland"

Cleveland: "We have the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame"

Happiness is also having a positive Like:Post ratio. Right now I can afford 35 crappy posts before I have to turn my brain back on.

Capital ships in Star Wars house a large amount of squadrons of fighters and bombers for a reason. A fleet with no or very little squadrons would be at a big disadvantage. I see no problem here. Fighters and bombers should be and were more than a minor annoyance to capital ships.

People always admire the battleships, but carriers are the real core of a fleet.

19 minutes ago, Cusm said:

Cleveland: "We have the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame"

Could be worse, you could be the state of Indiana: "we're famous for shrimp cocktails."
"... aren't you guys an inland state?"
"shh, just let them have this one."

3 minutes ago, TaeSWXW said:

Happiness is also having a positive Like:Post ratio. Right now I can afford 35 crappy posts before I have to turn my brain back on.

Let us buy you some time.

I mean, at least its meaningful for you, right?

2 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Let us buy you some time.

I mean, at least its meaningful for you, right?

For better or worse I do believe in the cooperative power of a community forum to identify and catalog wisdom. I'd like to think I do more good than harm.

12 hours ago, Vergilius said:

I've been doing this in my Madine Liberty list for a long time.

I smell what you're cookin', and I still do believe that it is possible to build an effective MFC and have fun with it. But didn't the Madine Liberty list you flew at regionals have a gaggle of generics? 6 A-Wings, 4x YT2400's, and 4x flotillas. I appreciate the practice and skill that it took to place that well. But with all due respect, 1+4 and max squadrons rather exemplifies the game's problems at the competitive level.

4 minutes ago, Snipafist said:

Could be worse, you could be the state of Indiana: "we're famous for shrimp cocktails."
"... aren't you guys an inland state?"
"shh, just let them have this one."

Indiana: Our shoreline is mostly useless due to bloated floating corpses and nuclear power plant waste water pollution.

37 minutes ago, Cusm said:

Cleveland: "We have the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame"

Meh, been there, wasn't impressed.

I've lived in Cleveland and Indiana. Cleveland at least didn't stink. Purdue was a good school, Bront, but from May-September manure was spread around the campus. April the gingko (Ginkapo?) Trees were in bloom, so I got fish oil instead. And let's not talk about the well water filling the fountains.

Again, good school! Technically present football team! Cow college! I am very grateful for my degree there, though.

38 minutes ago, Cusm said:

Cleveland: "We have the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame"

Also, "....that Bon Jovi just dad-rocked their way into."

1 minute ago, geek19 said:

I've lived in Cleveland and Indiana. Cleveland at least didn't stink. Purdue was a good school, Bront, but from May-September manure was spread around the campus. April the gingko (Ginkapo?) Trees were in bloom, so I got fish oil instead. And let's not talk about the well water filling the fountains.

Again, good school! Technically present football team! Cow college! I am very grateful for my degree there, though.

Is the smell why they call it "Nasty-Natti"?

I went to school in Peoria, Illinois and I recall the year when they cut down all the Ginko trees in the quad. No one told them that half of the trees will stink so when they hit maturity and the school started smelling like a toilet the administration went nuclear and cut everything down.