I will mention that the bids there were weirdly high compared to several of the other Regionals we've seen so far for wave 6. I thought I'd be fine with a 14 point bid and I faced another 14 point bid (a somewhat similar Imperial swarm fleet, he won the coin flip) and got outbid in a really tough match-up with Patrick Cutter (mentioned earlier) round 3 with a Sloane fleet with a 15 point bid. Oof.

My fleet does fine against most squad-heavy fleets and it's okay going second against almost anything that outbids it (won the mirror-ish match even though I lost the coin flip to take initiative), but it runs into serious issues when it is up against squad-heavy AND it goes second. I lost that one 3-8, I believe. I'm just glad I got the Quasar before it made a getaway, but it was brutal. Patrick was a nice guy, though, he's quite good with his squadron play, and I feel like we had a good game. I definitely learned a lot; it was not a Sloane build I've seen locally.

1 hour ago, Snipafist said:

Ackbar farming fleet won, it's literally the worst thing about playing Armada right now and people should feel ashamed of themselves for playing that garbage. I didn't play against it and I'm still grumpy in sympathy with all of his miserable opponents. The guy himself seemed nice enough, but that fleet archetype is an abomination.

cant tell if serious...

51 minutes ago, AdmiralYor said:

The garbage will do. I think I told every opponent that I don't like the list, but it can win when it is allowed to.

In all seriousness, it was a fun and well run tournament. Thanks to @CaribbeanNinja and Justin J for the games and advice at the MS regional

I actually got outbid by one point in two of the games, was given second both times. So apparently, I didn't have enough bid.

And while I understand @Snipafist disgust on the list I think I have to be scratching my head as to why two players without a valid use of strategic outbidded you and then proceeded to still take first. Sounds to me like they weren’t prepared for a list like that. Which goes to show you experience against different meta’s helps greatly.

@Brikhause, I know Jerry chose to go first against it because one of his objectives was Fire Lanes. He realized it would get stolen right out from under him so he might as well get the benefit of being first player. Not sure it was the right choice, but I understand his reasoning.

I'll also add:
3rd place (as mentioned) had Ackbar Assault Frigates, a blast from the past.
4th place (@comatose) had two Peltas (deal with it haters!)
Although @geek19 had a rough final round that knocked him down to 19th, he went 3-1 with Commander Leia and Hammerheads.

As already mentioned, I took 7th (also 3-1) with 4 Raiders and Ozzel, as well as some other stuff. Might as well post the fleet list:

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 386/400
Objectives: Most Wanted, Hyperspace Assault, Solar Corona

Commander: Admiral Ozzel

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
- Demolisher ( 10 points)
- Skilled First Officer ( 1 points)
- Ordnance Experts ( 4 points)
- Engine Techs ( 8 points)
- Assault Proton Torpedoes ( 5 points)
= 84 total ship cost

Raider-I Class Corvette (44 points)
- Ordnance Experts ( 4 points)
- External Racks ( 3 points)
= 51 total ship cost

Raider-I Class Corvette (44 points)
- Ordnance Experts ( 4 points)
- External Racks ( 3 points)
= 51 total ship cost

Raider-I Class Corvette (44 points)
- Ordnance Experts ( 4 points)
- External Racks ( 3 points)
= 51 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

[ flagship ] Raider-I Class Corvette (44 points)
- Admiral Ozzel ( 20 points)
- Ordnance Experts ( 4 points)
- External Racks ( 3 points)
= 71 total ship cost

4 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 32 points)

Yup, went 3-1 with Leia. Whaling is back. Party like it's 1899!

Story and reasoning and writeup tomorrow

29 minutes ago, Brikhause said:

And while I understand @Snipafist disgust on the list I think I have to be scratching my head as to why two players without a valid use of strategic outbidded you and then proceeded to still take first. Sounds to me like they weren’t prepared for a list like that. Which goes to show you experience against different meta’s helps greatly.

Excuse my ignorance, what's an Akbar farming fleet?

1 hour ago, geek19 said:

I'll get them all out when I get home tomorrow at some point. Orf, 38 lists. One Leia's worth of people.

I'm really wishing I had dual monitors at home... Would make that data entry much easier.

1 minute ago, Baltanok said:

I'm really wishing I had dual monitors at home... Would make that data entry much easier.

I am wishing that more regionals are streamed. That Indianapolis one sounded epic!

56 minutes ago, Snipafist said:

it was not a Sloane build I've seen locally.

I find that this can be the real tripping point in play at regionals or above. Sometimes, it is not merely never having seen the list, but the act of never having seen the list played at a particular skill level.

34 minutes ago, Snipafist said:

@Brikhause, I know Jerry chose to go first against it because one of his objectives was Fire Lanes. He realized it would get stolen right out from under him so he might as well get the benefit of being first player. Not sure it was the right choice, but I understand his reasoning.

I'll also add:...
4th place (@comatose) had two Peltas (deal with it haters!)

6th, one of the four tied with 29 points, but lowest MoV due to a 16-point win in round one.

37 minutes ago, Brikhause said:

And while I understand @Snipafist disgust on the list I think I have to be scratching my head as to why two players without a valid use of strategic outbidded you and then proceeded to still take first. Sounds to me like they weren’t prepared for a list like that. Which goes to show you experience against different meta’s helps greatly.

This, so this. So much of the bidding war and the first/second war is not a straight up "bid and take first," but matching up first/second versus the right kinds of lists, and then taking a bid that matters.

Im guessing 'ackbar farming' (i think thats a new armada term coined!) is dual shuttle plus mc80 ackbar?

1 minute ago, Ophion said:

Im guessing 'ackbar farming' (i think thats a new armada term coined!) is dual shuttle plus mc80 ackbar?

I like Fish Farming ( @Snipafist's idea). And it's usually two or three VCXs, super heavily loaded H1MC80 with Ackbar and a swarm of flotillas.

Probably a Defiance MC80 with Ackbar and plenty of strategic. Then a big bid for second and objectives that bring their opponents into Ackbar's happy place.

4 minutes ago, Ophion said:

Im guessing 'ackbar farming' (i think thats a new armada term coined!) is dual shuttle plus mc80 ackbar?

Ackbar farming fleets are typically a death pickle (w/Ackbar of course). That have a whole mess flotillas and strategic squadrons that farm for VP. They generally have a large initiative bid because they want to go second and make you take their objectives.

Three ways to deal with them. You either go second, go first and learn to deal with their farming and learn to utilize strategic, or go first and choose their advanced gunnery objective.

2 minutes ago, Brikhause said:

Ackbar farming fleets are typically a death pickle (w/Ackbar of course). That have a whole mess flotillas and strategic squadrons that farm for VP. They generally have a la intitivd bid because they want to go second and make you take their objectives.

Three ways to deal with them. You either go second, go first and learn to deal with their farming and learn to utilize strategic, or go first and choose their advanced gunnery objective.

ive found sensor net to be the least worse option...

Okay, we need to see the Snipafist rage fleet. What's so crazy about the fish farm?

4 minutes ago, Brikhause said:

Ackbar farming fleets are typically a death pickle (w/Ackbar of course). That have a whole mess flotillas and strategic squadrons that farm for VP. They generally have a large initiative bid because they want to go second and make you take their objectives.

Three ways to deal with them. You either go second, go first and learn to deal with their farming and learn to utilize strategic, or go first and choose their advanced gunnery objective.

@Irokenics and @beefcake4000 had pretty good counters to this in our tourneys recently. Bt avenger plus lots of activations loves taking 1st player advanced gunnery!

9 minutes ago, Ophion said:

@Irokenics and @beefcake4000 had pretty good counters to this in our tourneys recently. Bt avenger plus lots of activations loves taking 1st player advanced gunnery!

Defiance, intel officer, XI-7, leading shots and Ackbar eats Avenger for breakfast. I mean as first player against a Jeff Berling type list you need 6 activations to make Avenger not suffer from defiance. @AdmiralYor had 6 activation in his variant. How many activations Can you get with let’s assume worst case a BT/Avenger ship type list?

what is this list?

10 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

what is this list?

I believe it was this:

Ackbar Death Pickle List (385/400)
Rebels - Author: Everret

Commander: Admiral Ackbar

Objectives: Advanced Gunnery, Fire Lanes, Superior Positions

[flagship] MC80 Assault Cruiser (114)
- Admiral Ackbar (38)
- Defiance (5)
- Reinforced Blast Doors (5)
- Advanced Projectors (6)
- Leading Shots (4)
- Lando Calrissian (4)
- Engine Techs (8)
- XI7 Turbolasers (6)
= 190 total points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
- Repair Crews (4)
= 22 total points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
- Repair Crews (4)
= 22 total points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
- Comms Net (2)
= 20 total points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
- Comms Net (2)
= 20 total points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
- Quantum Storm (1)
- Jamming Field (2)
= 21 total points

Squadrons (90/134):
2x X-Wing Squadron (26)
1x Moldy Crow - Jan Ors (19)
3x VCX-100 Freighter (45)

34 minutes ago, Brikhause said:

Defiance, intel officer, XI-7, leading shots and Ackbar eats Avenger for breakfast. I mean as first player against a Jeff Berling type list you need 6 activations to make Avenger not suffer from defiance. @AdmiralYor had 6 activation in his variant. How many activations Can you get with let’s assume worst case a BT/Avenger ship type list?

5

*Edit* nevermind it's been answered.

Maybe the best answer rests in bid so that it can't play to its farm strengths? Or worse case scenario choose Advanced gunnery and just avoid with your big hitter which can't survive that scenario and take out the support ships, getting a 7-3 win doesn't require that many points overall and if there is literally one threat to avoid that shouldn't be so bad. A full squad ball could do real damage just to the flotillas.

6 minutes ago, beefcake4000 said:

My regionals BT avenger had 6 activations with a full squad ball and would come **** close to one shotting that Defiance... I don't see the problem. In fact I've seen BT Avenger with kit (spinals etc) quite happily wipe out Akbar MC80 in one shot, sadly I was on the receiving end.

I don't see how it eats Avenger either... I mean are you literally flying straight at its side arcs? My regionals build had 10 deployments, I wonder how many this one has? I can't imagine why I'd be flying into its side arcs? Surely if you're going first too you'd be flying into long range (get blasted once), wait out the next turn till it shoots you again at long range then move up next to it and wipe it out with first player double arc? Or is it running a really stupid amount of activations? I know things don't happen in a vacuum but I can't imagine what I'm missing here.

*edit* I've also seen a 4 activation BT wipe out the doom pickle simply by driving in early, took the short range volley to the face but the pickle couldn't move/couldn't use flotillas as blockers so it died at the beginning of next turn.

It's a solid build no doubt but there's plenty of options to take it out... The first one being to take a higher bid and not let it play to its strengths. Nothing worth saying the player is an awful human being for running it.

I believe the list I posted above is the accurate one.

Again here I think the discrepancy is the player. A well flown Ackbar death pickle with proper defensive and support builds will be a pain in the **** to take down, as well as intercept.

Again do I think it unbeatable? Heck no, I also don’t think it is as easy as saying BT/Avenger + 5 activations and boom win. Could a BT/Avenger best it? Heck yeah it can!

As you said the game is not played in a Vacuum. The games I witness I see ISD’s just fold to the death pickle before the ISD can get a solid shot. So I just think the the death pickle has the better chance all things being equal.

24 minutes ago, Brikhause said:

I believe it was this:

Ackbar Death Pickle List (385/400)
Rebels - Author: Everret

Commander: Admiral Ackbar

Objectives: Advanced Gunnery, Fire Lanes, Superior Positions

---

Squadrons (90/134):
2x X-Wing Squadron (26)
1x Moldy Crow - Jan Ors (19)
3x VCX-100 Freighter (45)

Is that really the list?

That feels...odd. I mean, who would take anything but superior positions against it? That's not NEARLY enough of a fighter wing to worry about scoring points, and the GR75s can't shoot at ships, so you've only got to worry about the MC80 scoring points off the objective. And it desperately wants to fly perpendicular to you, which means it isn't super likely it's going to be getting behind you soon. That feels like a cake walk?

(Especially since Advanced Gunnery and Fire Lanes are so incredibly suicidal to take against this list - where is the risk against Superior Positions, though?)

9 minutes ago, xanderf said:

Is that really the list?

That feels...odd. I mean, who would take anything but superior positions against it? That's not NEARLY enough of a fighter wing to worry about scoring points, and the GR75s can't shoot at ships, so you've only got to worry about the MC80 scoring points off the objective. And it desperately wants to fly perpendicular to you, which means it isn't super likely it's going to be getting behind you soon. That feels like a cake walk?

(Especially since Advanced Gunnery and Fire Lanes are so incredibly suicidal to take against this list - where is the risk against Superior Positions, though?)

Sorry that should have been sensor net not superior position.

So the list feels like a cakewalk though? Have you faced an Ackbar death pickle list before?