I have just finished my first read of the Rogue Trader rulebook and have the feeling something is missing.

After testing the ship creation system I have come to the conclusion that the Spaceship material is thin. I really hope FFG will release soon the Spaceship Handbook of the quality of the Inquisitor's Handbook to add more material cause right now it feels stale. I just fear that the oversimplified template (example: only 1 battery per side for all but Lunar-Class Cruisers) limits the development of new stuff.

This kind of simplified mechanics are appropriate in Battlefleet Gothic or Epic 40k where each players controls fleets/armies, but in Rogue Trader it would have been nice to have detailed ships when the players control one or very few ships.

Sure the rulebook say to watch out for more (What about the torpedoes?), but even those would take up only a corner of a page ...

Anyways if somebody knows of anything in the pipeline it would be cool to know.

There is quite a lively discussion here on future RT books.

The Starships chapter is indeed very sparse, and it was the part of the book I was most disappointed with. What there was is fine, it's the fact there isn't more that's the problem.

A Designer Diary just before the game went to press stated that the FFG people had got too carried away writing the game and overshot the page limit by a fair margin, and so several areas had to be cut from the rulebook. I think that it's pretty obvious that the Starship chapter was one of the main casualties of this.

It's pretty inevitable a supplement focused on Starships will come out for the game, though, and hopefully this will have everything we've been waiting for. As good as it sounds, I'm disappointed to hear that the first RT supplement will be an adventure book and not something containing all the things we were promised for the main rulebook that got cut.

Tantavalist said:

Should have been expected though, since the first book out for Dark Heresy was also an adventure book. It's because a book that helps people to start playing the game and give them ideas on how to run games it more important for newer players than more rules.

Overshooting the page limit and then cutting back is never a bad thing really - it just means that the expansions are pretty much already written!

Tantavalist said:

The fact that no content expansion is announced at the moment combined with the usual FFG release schedule, we are a few months away from having an actual book in our hands. Deathwatch will probably be out before it.

I really think it will be too late and without a proper game at launch Rogue Trader won't have the momemtum needed for FFG to print more material. I fear a quick death for the series.

Carmedil said:

Lack of announcement doesn't mean anything except that FFG haven't announced anything...

Carmedil said:

Eh, if we lose Rogue Trader to me that isnt a big deal. I know lots of people like it but I would rather have Deathwatch come out and then they can start publishing 40K Sourcebooks that are supplements for all three games at once.

But I have a feeling, since it is still 5 months til GenCon gives us Deathwatch, that we will probably see 2 Dark Heresy books and 2 Rogue Trader ones and then get Death Watch and the Death Watch GM Kit.

Count me in the I want more material for Roque Trader Category. We play both Dark Heresy and Rogue Trader actively and I am waiting for some quality materials to come out. I am really anxious to get my hands on the adventure pack that will keep us occupied for awhile. More Starship rules woul;d be great but there are so many fanbased resources out there with such details and vehicle rules that I do not think that we must have those rules now. However a good adventure pack will help me to develop my campaign.

About Deathwatch, sure I buy the book and perhaps play a few missions but it has not the lure both RT and DH has to me.

Well, don't forget, that RT is first of all a roleplaying game, not a space combat simulator. Of course, space battles are definitly an important part of the game and as I read the rules, the developers see it the same way so they will add more meterial on space combat and starships as soon as they can.

I would personally love to see a release schedule, even a rough and ready one (ie we hope to release x in quarter 3, y in Q4).

I think a sourcebook on treasure and wierd planets would actually be more useful. It's quite easy to make up components or port ships in from BFG, but the really exciting stuff happens with plunder and adventure. Ideas for that, for me anyway, would be more useful in the long run for running a game

Some of the things from the other topic I think should be in a RT expansion:

1. A detailed system generator would be nice... then add a bunch of 'story hooks' that GMs can use as sources for endeavours.

2. More NPC ships - The book goes into depth on Eldar Raiders, but provides no examples. Perhaps more ships componants (but that topic has been flogged to death I'll bet).

3. A chapter on 'Life on board' would also be great in a future book. Looking at a ship's population being equal to a town and what areas it would contain (Algae farms, grox pens, servitor repair, market place, Marine quarters, Storage, Supply, life support, water reclamation, the black market, the Ghilliam pits, etc etc etc). Perhaps even create a specific internal shipboard endeavour? The characters are going to spend ALLOT of time on board ship after all! - It could go into more depth on the watches (Ship’s Time)
- Also could have stuff on shipboard life (Eg. Crew are organised into Divisions according to their ship-board function and will always contain the following sub-groups: Collegiums: The Collegiums are nominally responsible for keeping the peace in their division and therefore maintain a ‘Home Guard/Police Force’. They are also responsible for running and regulating all ‘quasi-legal’ recreational activities (Prostitution, Gambling, Drugs, Alcohol, etc) Maintenance & Repair: All Divisions contain their own maintenance & repair sections. These sections will work closely with Damage Control officers of the Command Crew. Workers: All Divisions will contain workers (Servitors are components, not workers) Officers: All Divisions will contain an officer cadre that is responsible for the conduct and efficiency of their Division. Officers are selected/promoted on a merit system. Professional Lodges: Each Division will maintain a professional ‘lodge’ specific to their Divisional duties. This is to promote pride in the Division’s work and is closely linked to Ship-wide recreational Events and Divisional prayers to the Emperor.)
- Each Division will regularly perform a selection of the following Drills – Divisions will be commended if they perform more efficiently and fast than other - Divisions: Boarding Boat Drill, Damage control Drill , Depressurisation Drill, Fire Drill, Gunnery Drill, Repel Boarders Drill, Warp Breach Drill
- Each Division will regularly perform he following duties: Maintain & Repair, Learn & Teach, Ensure peak efficiency, Ensure redundant measures in place, Ensure personal & ship combat/defence readiness, Manufacture spare parts, Manufacture Required items
- Each Division of the Crew will form teams to participate in Recreational events on Saints Days, staggered throughout the Calendar year (eg. Eisteddfod, Ghillium Hunt (Officers represent their divisions ), Grox Bull Fighting, Individual combat, Laser Maze, Ship Race, Tackle-Ball, etc)

4. Finally some people want more on Xenos, but I think there is already allot out there on the major Xenos... Perhaps though meeting non-warp capably xenos to exploit and crush might be fun? A ‘make your own Xenos’ table (much like the mutant table only factoring in society organisation, tech stuff and oddities).

I'd like the RT equivalent of Disciples of the Dark Gods. Perils of the Expanse?

A toolkit filled with organizations, humans and xenos, that the GM can use as the basis of adventures in the Expanse. Hooks for trade, treachery, and open warfare between these organizations and the players' mercantile empire.

A "player's handbook" with additional weapons, equipment, and character options (background packages and possibly an additional career if the ones in the core book haven't covered all the bases already) mixed in with expanded options for starships and exploits.

A monster manual with lifeforms unique to the Kronus Expanse, perhaps with sapient xenos to befriend, betray, or blow away. Maybe even rules for having xeno pets, slaves, or mercenaries on the ship.

Other then those two things... not a lot in particular that I "want." And on the topic of Deathwatch... If FFG does something particularly spectacular with it, I might look into it but otherwise I have no real interest save for the atlas of Jericho Reach. Marine lore never really interested me like the Tau or the Imperial Guard and of my current group; most of them would play whatever and don't particularly care. We hade two that I thought would be intrigued, but one of them surprised me by turning it down. He complained that the game made "everyone play the same character." (his words, not mine) and at this time, I really have nothing to argue otherwise with even if I was inclined to take him on over it.

Psion said:

I think that Dark Heresy's Inquisitor Handbook covered alot of ground PC equipment wise. Starship are in a much dire need of detail. Even if RT isn't about Starship Battles, I would like the few space battles to be very detailed. I feel the actual system is about as detailed as Gothic where you control whole fleets.

Psion said:

Monster manuals are very cool, but I think there is enough published material to:

a) Generate new creatures

b) Use Xenos fan material

c) Translate exisiting WH40k creatures

I must agree with Nojo509 that a Disciple of the Dark Gods ... Rogur Trader version would be useful with information on : trade houses, other rogue traders, organizations, etc.

In warhammer 40k general fluff terms, having a Adeptus Mechanicus background and workings would be awesome. They remain mysterious in any realm of 40k.

Psion said:

Reading the last Deathwatch Dev previews, I'm confident that Deathwatch shall be well detailed. We know that there will be many "classes" (marine speciaties) and different "races" (Chapters), here my "x" been the normal fantasy rpg wording. If well done each character should be unique and interesting when these elements are supplemented with a rpg personnality.

Carmedil said:

His words, not mine. I'm not saying anything in particular until I see what chapters are up.

Psion said:

Well according to one post on Bell of Lost Souls from a playtester, apparently Blood Angels and Space Wolves are in there. No comment on the others.

The Space Marine Chapters might be covered in an expansion book, it might as well be like that to ensure that they will actually have at least 2 pages per chapter for material.

Carmedil said:

Erm... no? They've already said that there will be 6 Chapters in the main book. We know there are Space Wolves and Blood Angels, we're trying to figure out the other 4.

Anddddd we're drifting off-topic. Seeing as how I haven't read Dark Disciples, what else would a RT version of the book contain other then sample Rogue Trader NPCs, trade houses, and pirate clans? Not that those aren't interesting in themselves but still...

As for an Ad Mech supplement... honestly I feel that would be better served as a independent book with notes for each game. I admit to being an Adeptus Mechanicus fanboy but really, character options would be limited in scope. We have specializations in the "Ordinary priesthood" that could double for a few careers or as interesting "alternative Tech Priests" but nothing in particular that stands out...

I want a real mixed-bag book, the mirror of the Inquisitor's Handbook, but for RT. Loads of insights into the RT lifestyle, the Koronus expanse, weapons, ships, xenos etc etc. The IH was great because it fell over itself with loads of ideas.

I think a Mechanilexicanum could wait personally (though it would be interesting) but if it did come out I'd be interested in seeing more on the Magos Biologis (and specialisations) particularly non-augmetic enhancements and the more extreme sects interactions with the Mechanicus (and Imperial Society) as a whole.

Psion said:

Alien threats of the Expanse.

MDMann said:

They did that for DH and then took a neverending amount of crap from people complaining when stuff didn't come out on schedule.