OK, so I'll admit I haven't piloted nor put on the mat a TIE Striker, but it seems this 22 point PS 6 Pure Sabacc rolls four dice until she has at least two damage cards.....is this ship not --on paper-- awesome in a squad? Am I missing something? Never flown against it either...never seen one actually?

So how can I put this in a squad and see for myself why I never see her?

Just now, clanofwolves said:

OK, so I'll admit I haven't piloted nor put on the mat a TIE Striker, but it seems this 22 point PS 6 Pure Sabacc rolls four dice until she has at least two damage cards.....is this ship not --on paper-- awesome in a squad? Am I missing something? Never flown against it either...never seen one actually?

So how can I put this in a squad and see for myself why I never see her?

Any of the strikers are super effective. If you are not seeing them then it’s either a preference thing or a matter of people not flying the. For a lack of knowledge. The dial is also very deceiving it looks incredibly slow, until you add the ailerons to them. Which also means a good bit of skill and practice is needed to really get them to shine.

Sabacc in particular is an aggro magnet. He needs wingmen who will draw fire way from him or block making it easier for him to survive.

I cant remember the exact build but I had alot of fun with something similar to this.

Sabacc - VI, Title and LWF

QD - Expertise, FCS, PA, Title and LWF

BD - Expertise, FCS, Title and LWF

Plus a point for a bid or initiative

I played Sabacc with swarm leader for fun a couple of times. He never lasted very long but it was fun rolling lots of red dice

OK, you guys got me thinking, I gotta try her out, so builds? What if I made it easy first flight and put in two targets, one of which I have lots of hours in the cockpit and get it flying? I’m thinking Sabacc with adaptibility to 7, LWF and the Title; Ryad with VI and X7 and Vynder in a Gunboat (harpoon boat technically), with a fun load out and EPT that mates with him (not sure which one) and run them all PS 7, sound good?

Cheap is best.

LWF is often good. I'd consider Trick Shot, Adaptability, VI, Crack Shot, and Rage for Elite upgrades.

Maybe Decoy (if there's a PS 11 Quickdraw, that might work... get Sabacc's shot off first, since QD can take a few more hits, and has her revenge shot). Decoy is probably bad, I'm just rambling.

//

I like the Countess and Gunboat premise, but I don't know how much I'd prioritize making them all PS 7. It's not too high, and I might rather get some things which improve performance directly.

I've often seen Pure Sabacc paired with a TIE/D Vessery. Both are such high-damage ships that it becomes harder to find an obvious first target. An /x7 Defender isn't going to die fast, so blowing Pure Sabacc away quick is an easier choice.

I'll add to the chorus that Sabacc is very powerful, and has a VERY big target on his head, despite his relatively low cost. I'd recommend using him in a squad where you want to draw aggro off of another ship that your opponent might want to otherwise alpha strike. To that end, think about other ships that are "easy first targets" you might want to pair him with, that could draw aggro from each other. Wampa is a good cheap addition, because nobody wants to see that "free" damage sliding through. Vessery/x7 is pretty nasty, too, especially if you have another ship who likes to target lock (maybe Inquisitor or Vader?).

Will pure sabacc add a die to snap shot when she had no damage cards?

38 minutes ago, flooze said:

Will pure sabacc add a die to snap shot when she had no damage cards?

Snap Shot doesn't allow dice modifications, which are defined as adding results, changing results, or rerolling dice. Adding dice before they are rolled, however, is NOT a modification... so there's nothing to prevent it from working.

38 minutes ago, flooze said:

Will pure sabacc add a die to snap shot when she had no damage cards?

Sabocc says “ When attacking, if you have 1 or fewer Damage cards, roll 1 additional attack die.” So yes he adds a die, so long as his conditions are in fact met.

Adding dice is modifying, it's why you can't use evade tokens vs. Omega Leader.

Power creep is high and ps is also high. Mid tier PS ships are disappearing. Meta is becoming low ps with high damage or extremely high PS.

Pure Sabaac will get 1 round of his ability...maybe. put really dangerous ships with him.

Pure sabaac + crackshot,title =23pts

x2 Rho + deadeye,harpoons,chips =52pts

Nu + mangler,title,linked battery = 25pts.

Flank with sabaac. Opponent turns their back to boats who can fire and reload. Or sabaac comes from behind and maybe lives punching hard.

Most ships are multi arc or turrets, which also kills Strikers as well. Does no good to arc dodge when you have no autothrusters.

The TIE striker is a decent ship for its cost. Adaptive Ailerons is excellent, although you don't have to use it to make the little buggers effective.

Having said that, they are very weak generally speaking against turrets. Rey and Ventress for example just eat these guys for breakfast. The best pilot of the lot is actually Countdown (although not so great against Ventress or other stress-dealers, but none of them are perfect). Sabaac's downfall is the fragility. Its super easy to put damage cards on him, although interestingly enough, sometimes opponents will put a couple damage on him and then ignore him for a while (thus letting him still contribute). This the main reason I like AA. Once one of your Strikers is hanging on with a hull left, you can get the **** out of dodge and actually make it safely. Without AA, you can't really do that...

But if you want to get the most out of Sabaac, as mentioned in the post above me, you gotta put some really high threat, dangerous ships in there. Also, running him as a flanker is also a great idea---if you send him straight into the arcs of your enemy, he won't be rolling that extra attack for very long...

35 minutes ago, blade_mercurial said:

The TIE striker is a decent ship for its cost. Adaptive Ailerons is excellent, although you don't have to use it to make the little buggers effective.

Having said that, they are very weak generally speaking against turrets. Rey and Ventress for example just eat these guys for breakfast. The best pilot of the lot is actually Countdown (although not so great against Ventress or other stress-dealers, but none of them are perfect). Sabaac's downfall is the fragility. Its super easy to put damage cards on him, although interestingly enough, sometimes opponents will put a couple damage on him and then ignore him for a while (thus letting him still contribute). This the main reason I like AA. Once one of your Strikers is hanging on with a hull left, you can get the **** out of dodge and actually make it safely. Without AA, you can't really do that...

But if you want to get the most out of Sabaac, as mentioned in the post above me, you gotta put some really high threat, dangerous ships in there. Also, running him as a flanker is also a great idea---if you send him straight into the arcs of your enemy, he won't be rolling that extra attack for very long...

Exactly right. Turrets chew through Sabacc and any striker really like they dont exist. Worst of all the lack of a target lock makes for inconsistent damage.

As much as I love them I have a hard time choosing countdown/sabacc over Optics Zeta Leader lately. PS8 or PS9 with a Tie FO dial and better mods overall.

1 hour ago, Hoffburger said:

Adding dice is modifying, it's why you can't use evade tokens vs. Omega Leader.

Evade tokens don't add dice, however, they add results. FFG has ruled in the FAQ that adding dice that get rolled into the pool (Pure Sabacc, Lightweight Frame, Jan Ors pilot) is not modification of your dice, but adding results (Evade tokens, Finn, Accuracy Corrector) is modifying dice. I'll further say that the rules make a distinction between rolling dice, and rerolling dice.

4 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Evade tokens don't add dice, however, they add results. FFG has ruled in the FAQ that adding dice that get rolled into the pool (Pure Sabacc, Lightweight Frame, Jan Ors pilot) is not modification of your dice, but adding results (Evade tokens, Finn, Accuracy Corrector) is modifying dice. I'll further say that the rules make a distinction between rolling dice, and rerolling dice.

Good point, thanks for the correction.

What do you think about focusing more offensive and expensive Sabacc? For example changing VI to Predator.

My experience is Sabacc can’t really get most out of his pilot ability cause many times he can’t modify red dice losing his focus on defense.

Also do you feel there is big difference between ps 6 & ps 8?

I almost feel like Pure Sabacc is like a very offensive Biggs for the Imperials. You don't have to kill him first when you are facing him, but its probably a good idea as he can throw out a lot of dice. My favorite Sabacc build before the last wave dropped was 3 Gamma Vets w/ Deadeye, EMs, Crusise, chips and Sabacc w/ AAs, LWF, and a 1 point EPT of choice (usually Crackshot). Most of the time your opponent would deal with Sabacc, leaving the Bombers to get off a few Cruise missile shots. It could potentially have a huge alpha strike.

Now with Gunboats being a superior platform to Bombers, you can do something similar:

Rho Squadron Veteran (21)
Deadeye (1)
Harpoon Missiles (4)
Guidance Chips (0)

Rho Squadron Veteran (21)
Deadeye (1)
Harpoon Missiles (4)
Guidance Chips (0)

Rho Squadron Veteran (21)
Deadeye (1)
Harpoon Missiles (4)
Guidance Chips (0)

"Pure Sabacc" (22)
Adaptability (0)
Adaptive Ailerons (0)

Total: 100

Sabacc has no upgrades, but the Harpoons and the better chassis of the Gunboats makes up for it. Sabacc here is basically a distraction and can allow for the Gunboats to bug out of an area and get reloaded.

On ‎12‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 10:21 PM, theBitterFig said:

LWF is often good. I'd consider Trick Shot, Adaptability, VI, Crack Shot, and Rage for Elite upgrades.

I'd probably thin that down for Veteran Instincts or Crack Shot:

• Trick Shot works with obstructed shots - fine in theory, but strikers really don't like exchanging fire at range 3 or through cover because they don't get their bonus dice due to the way Lightweight Frame functions, and with their high minimum speed and inability to pull a 'normal' speed 1 turn, they really don't like to find themselves pointed at obstacles.
• Rage is very good value for money, but TIE strikers are incredibly stress-sensitive - their manoeuvrability absolutely collapses when stressed and being left with no tokens is a nightmare. Front-loading Pure Sabbac for an 'alpha strike' is good but not at the expense of making him useless for a couple of turns if he isn't your opponent's primary target.
• Adaptability is okay, but going from PS6 to PS7 doesn't really impress many opponents (to be fair, these days 8 doesn't impress all that many people....)

6 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I'd probably thin that down for Veteran Instincts or Crack Shot:

• Trick Shot works with obstructed shots - fine in theory, but strikers really don't like exchanging fire at range 3 or through cover because they don't get their bonus dice due to the way Lightweight Frame functions, and with their high minimum speed and inability to pull a 'normal' speed 1 turn, they really don't like to find themselves pointed at obstacles.
• Rage is very good value for money, but TIE strikers are incredibly stress-sensitive - their manoeuvrability absolutely collapses when stressed and being left with no tokens is a nightmare. Front-loading Pure Sabbac for an 'alpha strike' is good but not at the expense of making him useless for a couple of turns if he isn't your opponent's primary target.
• Adaptability is okay, but going from PS6 to PS7 doesn't really impress many opponents (to be fair, these days 8 doesn't impress all that many people....)

That's probably all correct. I mostly just listed anything cheap which adds damage. I tried to make a Pure Sabacc Rage/Yorr list once. Didn't really work, but it was sooooooooo cool on paper. Rage to start the engagement, then Adaptive Ailerons into a 2K or S-Loop, and still be free to Rage. In theory. Yeah, not really going to happen.

On 12/01/2018 at 8:35 PM, Hoffburger said:

Adding dice is modifying, it's why you can't use evade tokens vs. Omega Leader.

Adding dice result is modifying, throwing more dice on the initial roll is not a modification

• Modifying Dice:
  • Adding dice results (Finn adds blanks, Adv. Targetting Computer adds crits, spending an evade token adds an evade result, etc)
  • Changing dice results (spending a focus token to convert focus results to hits, Palpatine converting a blank to an evade, etc)
  • Re-rolling dice results (spending a Target Lock, Predator, etc)
• Not Modifying Dice:
  • Adding dice before they're rolled (Jan Ors' pilot ability, Trick Shot, Countermeasures)
  • Cancelling dice (Wampa's pilot ability, R3 Astromech, Lieutenant Kestal's pilot ability)

Some effects combine modifications with non-modification changes, like Accuracy Corrector . You can always cancel your attack dice results, but if an effect prevents you from modifying dice, you can't add results back in.

16 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

That's probably all correct. I mostly just listed anything cheap which adds damage. I tried to make a Pure Sabacc Rage/Yorr list once. Didn't really work, but it was sooooooooo cool on paper. Rage to start the engagement, then Adaptive Ailerons into a 2K or S-Loop, and still be free to Rage. In theory. Yeah, not really going to happen.

Oh - the only other one I forgot to mention - Adrenaline Rush.

It's a random one to pick up on, but TIE strikers have their manoeuvrability ludicriously crippled by stress (going from one of the best white dials in the game to the green dial of a T-70 X-wing with no astromech), and have by far the best red dial in the game. Being able to pull an adaptive ailerons segnor's loop, still focus, and still be able to pick freely from your dial & ailerons next turn is amazing.

6 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Oh - the only other one I forgot to mention - Adrenaline Rush.

It's a random one to pick up on, but TIE strikers have their manoeuvrability ludicriously crippled by stress (going from one of the best white dials in the game to the green dial of a T-70 X-wing with no astromech), and have by far the best red dial in the game. Being able to pull an adaptive ailerons segnor's loop, still focus, and still be able to pick freely from your dial & ailerons next turn is amazing.

Oh, that'd be pretty cool.

I would agree with everyone saying that Strikers are bomb. They are so effective for their cost. But it's true, they are fragile - especially with Sabacc, he is there to draw fire from someone else, or else punish people for not doing do. Silencer Kylo and Omega Leader would be VERY appropriate wingmen for such a purpose, as you want them late game. Vessery too, or Ryad - anyone who shines late game but tend to be vulnerable early on.

AA and LWF are essentially stapled on to Strikers in my mind. They lose a lot without them. However, EPT for Sabacc is variable. I, for one, LOVE the idea of Snap Shot with his extra die. That's just crazy fun.