OP, you've stirred up the Armada players.

Luke's X-Wing was in the Armada core set and he's still fantastic. Vader exists as a TIE Advanced Pilot (decent), a Commander (kinda niche), and a Boarding Team (not out yet).

11 hours ago, Ralgon said:

Heck the vsd fix isn't quite out yet is it?

It sure is.

2 hours ago, Rumar said:

I share the concern. There is significant power creep in X-Wing and Armada.

For Armada - not really? Every ship and squadron sees play; and even the less loved are generally more recent. There's a couple Imperial commanders (Tagge and Konstantine) that nobody uses, but that's been true since they came out.

I cant imagine it is easy balancing fun-for-the-whole family play and competitive play and on top of that is the product needs to be successful more-or-less out of the gate, not several waves in which is why I think they opened up with Vader and Luke. That's all marketing for the masses (justifiably so). It would not surprise me if the 75% of the next 3 "waves" will be will known/identified units.

As others have said, it would be easy for them to bring out a "Luke-Jedi Knight" version to update him. Though they could also just bring out units that synergize very well with Luke such as R2D2 that gives some benefit a thus keeps Luke relevant. Or you know, I could be completely wrong.

9 hours ago, Ralgon said:

i never said that. As we learn more and have the new units and rules revealed vader gets more and more dangerous ( if somewhat difficult to get the most out of due to his mobility). But as many posters will point out, this is a shaping up to be a game of tactics and objectives which leaves the rest of vaders forces in a bind to balance cost vs offense vs effective objective achievers.

Now consider that if vader gets taken the rebs get roughly a free trooper unit of spare points ........

Sorry, I didn't mean to put words in your mouth. Thanks for the clarification.

17 minutes ago, NukeMaster said:

Sorry, I didn't mean to put words in your mouth. Thanks for the clarification.

Not trying to be an *** about it if it comes off like that......

What i think we are going to see though is unless there somehow *are* lists that can pull off a full tabling consistently there are going to be multiple distinctive lists from both factions themed around tactics rather than units. Vader is always going to have his uses (sit him on an objective with a trooper unit and just try try and dig him out! or zombie advance as a clump with snow troopers, laughing at any attempt to break them with suppression.... ) but he's definitely not your guy if you also want to stomp stuff with an atst now we have veers because 2 models coming in at well over half your army points by the time you pick upgrades is likely going to get out played.

13 minutes ago, Ralgon said:

Not trying to be an *** about it if it comes off like that......

What i think we are going to see though is unless there somehow *are* lists that can pull off a full tabling consistently there are going to be multiple distinctive lists from both factions themed around tactics rather than units. Vader is always going to have his uses (sit him on an objective with a trooper unit and just try try and dig him out! or zombie advance as a clump with snow troopers, laughing at any attempt to break them with suppression.... ) but he's definitely not your guy if you also want to stomp stuff with an atst now we have veers because 2 models coming in at well over half your army points by the time you pick upgrades is likely going to get out played.

What with Veers being a guy whose only real talent was telling vehicles to do stuff and not getting killed by Vader, it makes sense that he'd be much cheaper that our favourite Sith lord.

Also, since Veers was a vehicles expert, it makes sense he'd be better priced for a armour based list, while Vader suits a more infantry focused approach.

The Imperial way of doing things was essentially to over-specialise into 1 role and stick with it, so expect commanders that suit being used with 1 type of unit more than others.

I personally think that Vader's bubble of unbreaking loyalty will keep him in the game for quite a long time post launch.

5 hours ago, Tirion said:

Ummmmmm again I say you must not play Armada.

Yes I do mate, extensively. Check my signature block.

All the models in the core set came out as expansions, so I am not sure what your point is

3 hours ago, Funk Fu master said:

Yes I do mate, extensively. Check my signature block.

All the models in the core set came out as expansions, so I am not sure what your point is

You may own a lot of armada but I have to totally disagree about a power creep in Armada. Luke is still one of the best rebel squadrons in the game and every ship released can be used effectively. I still use plenty of wave 1 thru 4 ships and squadrons. Armada is as close to perfect balance as I’ve seen in a miniatures game.

4 hours ago, Funk Fu master said:

Yes I do mate, extensively. Check my signature block.

All the models in the core set came out as expansions, so I am not sure what your point is

My point is Luke didn't sooooooo..... This isn't a forest for ffg. And Vader didn't come in the core set...... Hence my point that it appeared you didn't play Armada.

My point being is that with X-wing and Armada, all the MODELS in the core came out at initial release as separate expansions.

Legion isn't doing that with Luke and Vader, so they could be released at a later date as a "patch".

Also, I wasn't saying anything about a power creep in Armada?...

2 minutes ago, Funk Fu master said:

My point being is that with X-wing and Armada, all the MODELS in the core came out at initial release as separate expansions.

Legion isn't doing that with Luke and Vader, so they could be released at a later date as a "patch".

Also, I wasn't saying anything about a power creep in Armada?...

I get what you mean , but legion is different. All the units are models

On 5.1.2018 at 4:23 PM, svelok said:

OP, you've stirred up the Armada players.

Luke's X-Wing was in the Armada core set and he's still fantastic. Vader exists as a TIE Advanced Pilot (decent), a Commander (kinda niche), and a Boarding Team (not out yet).

It sure is.

For Armada - not really? Every ship and squadron sees play; and even the less loved are generally more recent. There's a couple Imperial commanders (Tagge and Konstantine) that nobody uses, but that's been true since they came out.

Neither Luke nor Vader are must-haves, but obscure units like Rhymer, Howlrunner or Jan Ors (must-haves are always a design flaw, by the way). Compare the Victory to the ISD. Bigger, stronger AND faster? Nothing I would like to see in Legion.

11 minutes ago, Rumar said:

Neither Luke nor Vader are must-haves, but obscure units like Rhymer, Howlrunner or Jan Ors (must-haves are always a design flaw, by the way). Compare the Victory to the ISD. Bigger, stronger AND faster? Nothing I would like to see in Legion.

It could be your skill level or your opponents because I see Vader and Luke quite often. I very seldom see rhymer since he’s been nerfed. Not sure what your “victory to the isd” complaint is about. Both ships see a lot of use in the game.