Hey peers,

I've just had my first game against a Phoenix deck (small meta!) and I've found the whole experience thoroughly discombobulating. I'm currently playing Scorpion and my deck is terrible, but that's beside the point currently. My issue is that I've found Phoenix to be an exceptionally confusing opponent, absolutely awash with characters that only do things if certain rings have been claimed. I'm not new to card games, and generally don't struggle to commit cards to memory (actual useful real life stuff is another story) - but with Phoenix's heavy interaction with the rings, I find it extremely difficult to understand the board state.

I also don't want to slow down what is already a reasonably ponderous game by checking all of my opponents cards against what rings are claimed, and which rings could be claimed after every conflict in a turn.

Does anyone else suffer with this, or am I just thick?

I have the advantage of almost exclusively playing Phoenix since proxying before the core came out, but it should be easier after game 3 or 4!

Yeah. Play more is of course the answer, but finding a Phoenix opponent around here is like being a street thug in Gotham City trying to punch Batman.

Can't find him.

Can't find him.

Can't fin... OH MY GOD HOW DID HE DO THAT?

1 hour ago, Ersatz Nihilist said:

Yeah. Play more is of course the answer, but finding a Phoenix opponent around here is like being a street thug in Gotham City trying to punch Batman.

Can't find him.

Can't find him.

Can't fin... OH MY GOD HOW DID HE DO THAT?

Build a Phoenix deck and play against yourself.

At one point I saw someone talk about using flash cards or the cards themselves to drill themselves on learning troublesome/ problematic cards. So that might be an option to familiarize yourself with the cards when there isn't an opponent to play.

I've actually played several games against myself and it works to teach you a clan/deck

I think once you play more games against Phoenix you will start to understand their board state easier. They are a headache to play against. However, they do have one big flaw that is also their biggest strength. Almost all of the characters have incredibly high glory. As Scorpion you are the best-equipped clan to render their characters relatively useless through dishonor. Whatever you do, do not let them honor their characters. If they get a character honored they likely get +4 strength for a long time. Save your Court Games for their characters as well. Also, try to keep their board small. Many of the strong Phoenix decks I have played against try to build an incremental advantage and if the game goes long, it heavily favors them. Also, do not try too hard to get the Imperial Favor because Phoenix can get it relatively easily. If they have 2 fate and do not defend the conflict, expect a Display of Power. Right now, Phoenix really like the Water Ring, but there are a few characters who interact with other rings as well. Hope this helps!

5 hours ago, LifeGain said:

I think once you play more games against Phoenix you will start to understand their board state easier. They are a headache to play against. However, they do have one big flaw that is also their biggest strength. Almost all of the characters have incredibly high glory. As Scorpion you are the best-equipped clan to render their characters relatively useless through dishonor. Whatever you do, do not let them honor their characters. If they get a character honored they likely get +4 strength for a long time. Save your Court Games for their characters as well. Also, try to keep their board small. Many of the strong Phoenix decks I have played against try to build an incremental advantage and if the game goes long, it heavily favors them. Also, do not try too hard to get the Imperial Favor because Phoenix can get it relatively easily. If they have 2 fate and do not defend the conflict, expect a Display of Power. Right now, Phoenix really like the Water Ring, but there are a few characters who interact with other rings as well. Hope this helps!

Keep in mind the card abilities as well. There are cards that bow opponents or send them home.

Well, I've redone my deck a bit (really, the last one was terrible), and may well get to have match tomorrow. So I'm sure I'll wander back in crying about the big mean fire chicken again soon.

Just need to keep repeating the mantra of "If I win it's skill, if they win it was because of overpowered cards".

But in all seriousness, it's just a case of playing more; I think I just need to adjust to cross-referencing cards in play with where all the rings are at any point, as it's not something I feel I need to do with the other clans.

As for building a deck and playing myself - is that effective as practice? I used to try and do that with miniature games back a few years ago, and it never really revealed anything to me. I only ever learned by getting my face kicked off.

By overpowered models.

Until I had developed a high enough level of skill to win.

12 minutes ago, Ersatz Nihilist said:

Well, I've redone my deck a bit (really, the last one was terrible), and may well get to have match tomorrow. So I'm sure I'll wander back in crying about the big mean fire chicken again soon.

Just need to keep repeating the mantra of "If I win it's skill, if they win it was because of overpowered cards".

But in all seriousness, it's just a case of playing more; I think I just need to adjust to cross-referencing cards in play with where all the rings are at any point, as it's not something I feel I need to do with the other clans.

As for building a deck and playing myself - is that effective as practice? I used to try and do that with miniature games back a few years ago, and it never really revealed anything to me. I only ever learned by getting my face kicked off.

By overpowered models.

Until I had developed a high enough level of skill to win.

Playing [against] myself has always worked for me.

Well, lets have a little breakdown:

Water

Prodigy of the Waves can ready itself if the water ring is claimed. Adept of the Waves gives a character Covert during Water Challenges. Asako Tuski lets them honour a Scholar after the water ring is claimed. One important thing - the Water ring effects trigger off the ring being claimed, NOT being claimed by Phoenix.

Air

Fearsome Mystic gains Glory during Air challenges. Seeker of Knowledge adds Air to any challenge where she's an attacker, but they still only resolve one ring.

Earth

Solemn Scholar bows an attacking character when Phoenix has the earth ring.

Fire

Isawa Masahiro bows to discard smaller characters during a Fire challenge.

Void

Isawa Kaede adds Void to any challenge where she's an attacker, and she lets you resolve ALL the ring effects. Isawa Atsuko is a buff/debuff for all characters in a Void challenge.

Based on that.....Fire and Earth are currently pretty simple, just think of them as any other character with a conditional effect. Air is similar, you don't need to worry too much about it unless Phoenix is going for dishonour, or the Seeker of Knowledge is attacking alongside Kaede (because she'll let them resolve three rings).

Water and Void are the big ones at the moment, with multiple powerful effects related to them, so they are what you really need to be thinking about.

That's actually amazingly helpful, thank you very much for writing it up like that. Sadly I didn't get to play today because Twilight Imperium happened.

So instead I got my face kicked off by the Baroney of Letnev.

1 hour ago, Ersatz Nihilist said:

So instead I got my face kicked off by the Baroney of Letnev.

Curse those overpowered Letnev models!