I've been theory crafting an RZ-2 A-wing expansion for X-wing since I first saw the trailer, but this week I have come across the info given in the cross section from the visual dictionary which gives a lot more insight into the ship. It has also shown me that my crazy ideas are at least in the ball park so I thought I'd share them.

P.S. The visual dictionary confirms that the RZ-2 cannons can swivel to fire at pursuers, which is definitely cool and may be precedence for a rear/mobile firing arc, but I had the bullseye in mind for this ship prior to that info being released, and I've chosen to stick with it for my concept.

Here goes;

I tried to make as many of the upgrades RZ-1 friendly as I could, whilst trying to make this its own ship. I'm still not sure on it having both an S-loop and Talon Roll though. What do you think?

Seems like a lovely dedicated arc dodger, and the BFA looks really helpful on a 2 ATK but very agile ship. I like pretty much all the cards, maybe with the exception of Jamming Array and Anticipation.

JA being A-Wing only seems like a letdown, since A-Wings will almost always equip Autothrusters instead. I would say, either remove that restriction, or reduce the points cost so it can become an option to consider.

Anticipation also seems... maybe a bit overcosted for me. For ships that can equip AT, it's not a tempting option at all. For 2 pts, it's competing with Juke, Snap Shot, Intensity, and most importantly Lone Wolf.

Nice cards! You found some great images for the pilots and the upgrades (heck, where did you find that Auxiliary Payload image?)

Your ships stats are very in line with my own rendition , but you added Bullseye. Nice!

I would suggest making the Auxiliary Payload not exclusive to this ship (but only equipable in ships with a missile or torpedo) and reduce the cost to 1.

Jamming Array: I liked it, but the text should say "jam token", instead of the symbol.

Resistance Escort: make it A-Wing only, because the Resistance actually used at least 1 RZ-1 A-Wing.

2 hours ago, Captain Pellaeon said:

Seems like a lovely dedicated arc dodger, and the BFA looks really helpful on a 2 ATK but very agile ship. I like pretty much all the cards, maybe with the exception of Jamming Array and Anticipation.

JA being A-Wing only seems like a letdown, since A-Wings will almost always equip Autothrusters instead. I would say, either remove that restriction, or reduce the points cost so it can become an option to consider.

Anticipation also seems... maybe a bit overcosted for me. For ships that can equip AT, it's not a tempting option at all. For 2 pts, it's competing with Juke, Snap Shot, Intensity, and most importantly Lone Wolf.

Thanks!

The idea's for most of my upgrades were to give A-wings options. My new cards are geared towards them being used as support escorts, since that's what we see them do in TLJ, or more ordnance focused, since that is another area I think A-wings could become more involved in. As you said there are already a lot of upgrades suited to the arc-dodging archetype already in game, and that would probably still be a go to build for Tallie and Jake etc. Pilots like "Shortstop", Gemmer Sojan, and the low PS bumpers however like to be at Range 1 and aren't necessarily arc-dodgers in a traditional sense, so Jamming Array and Anticipation can cater to those types of ships. I just wanted to give A-wings more options, and potentially change how they are played in a sense, that was my headspace when making these cards up anyway.

I really think Jamming Array needs to be a niche thing. I don't think that just any ship should have access to it. A-wings have jamming tech (in canon) and have the manoeuvrability (in-game) to move into range 1 frequently. I think of it as a similar card to Spacetug Tractor Array, which is also what I based the cost on.

Anticipation in my eyes is the autothrusters for ships that want to get in your face, rather than run away. As far as A-wings go, "Shortstop", Gemmer Sojan, and Arvel Crynyd are all ships that could benefit from a defensive boost in this situation, and can boost their squad buffs in the process with Jamming Array etc. I based the cost of Anticipation on the fact that ships like Fenn Rau can utilise it, which are more dangerous than little A-wings, but maybe it should be lowered to 1.

35 minutes ago, Odanan said:

Nice cards! You found some great images for the pilots and the upgrades (heck, where did you find that Auxiliary Payload image?)

Your ships stats are very in line with my own rendition , but you added Bullseye. Nice!

I would suggest making the Auxiliary Payload not exclusive to this ship (but only equipable in ships with a missile or torpedo) and reduce the cost to 1.

Jamming Array: I liked it, but the text should say "jam token", instead of the symbol.

Resistance Escort: make it A-Wing only, because the Resistance actually used at least 1 RZ-1 A-Wing.

Thanks Haha the images are some I found on google and then edited in photoshop. Aux Payload is actually from the cross section image of the A-wing in the visual dictionary.

Yeah I think a bullseye would be a nice little touch, as soon as I saw what it did when they revealed the Kimogila, I thought that would be great for the 'new and improved A-wing'.

I was contemplating leaving Aux Payload open to every missile user as a pseudo EM. I liked the idea as it would also boost ships like the TIE adv. proto. and other 2 dice primaries but then I thought it might be a bit OP on the gunboat and TIE/sf and chickened out. I also made it 2pts to offset Chardaan Refit. If it were any less, people could circumvent the chardaan refit card restriction (of losing a missile slot) and still get a cost reduction plus a usable missile slot. I couldn't think of a restriction that could deal with all those issues so I just went with A-wing only. If anyone can think of a way balance all that I think it would be great to have it open to all ships.

Definitely agree with 'Jam token' wordage, I'll edit it.

That's true, I just had a Crimson/Cobalt squadron resistance theme in my head when conjuring that one up. I really like the idea of Resistance/FO only cards giving more depth to those sub-factions, that's why I made it Resistance (RZ-2) only. Got to give the new ship something of its own

I think this, especially the dial.

3 hours ago, Odanan said:

Nice cards! You found some great images for the pilots and the upgrades

I agree, gorgeous art @BVRCH ! I like you cards too.

I found the art for Jamming Array. It is on a website called http://www.blindltd.com . This company designs user interfaces for movies. They did work in both the Force Awakens ( http://www.blindltd.com/the-force-awakens ) and Rogue One ( http://www.blindltd.com/rogue-one ).

9 minutes ago, AwesomeJedi said:

I agree, gorgeous art @BVRCH ! I like you cards too. Some of your cards are overcosted, but that's ok.

I found the art for Jamming Array. It is on a website called http://www.blindltd.com . This company designs user interfaces for movies. They did work in both the Force Awakens ( http://www.blindltd.com/the-force-awakens ) and Rogue One ( http://www.blindltd.com/rogue-one ).

Thanks very much! Yeah I can't take credit for the images, I really only messed around with the Pilot Card art. Some manipulating and adding background images, engine glow etc. Most of the original A-wing models themselves are from DeviantArt I believe. The targeting sub-systems is actually the targeting computer from an ETA-2 starfighter. Anankin's from Ep.3 I think. The Resistance escort art is from promo art for a revell model of the RZ-2 A-wing. The Anticipation is McQuarrie concept art, I think that would be pretty recognizable.

Oh cool! I knew it was from TFA but that's all I knew. That company looks pretty awesome.

@Odanan @Captain Pellaeon

So general consensus so far is Jamming Array and Anticipation are overcosted? Do we think they should both be 1pt? Do people agree that Aux Payload wouldn't be OP on a gunboat if opened up to all missile ships? (that's the ship I'm most worried about). I guess they have 2 already with the arsenal title, 3 with a 3pt cap is probably frivolous anyway. If so I'll do some editing.

I don't think Jamming Array at 2 points is overcosted. But of course, at 1 point it would be much more popular.

16 minutes ago, BVRCH said:

So general consensus so far is Jamming Array and Anticipation are overcosted? Do we think they should both be 1pt?

I still think so. For Anticipation, I'm not sure it should be 1 pt or 0 actually. For 0 points, there exists a relatively strong EPT that allows dice modification.

Quote

Do people agree that Aux Payload wouldn't be OP on a gunboat if opened up to all missile ships?

In all honesty, I can't think of any missile ship that would be OP with a 2nd missile slot. A 2nd slot either allows for Unguided Rockets, which are meh to begin with, or 2 missiles for 3 pts each (Cruise, Proton Rockets, Ion Pulse). None of those comboes seem OP at all to me.

Here is a fix for the Auxiliary Payload.

Also, I would suggest making the Jamming Array a "Tech" upgrade instead of a Modification.

fully agree with both.

5 minutes ago, Odanan said:

Here is a fix for the Auxiliary Payload.

Also, I would suggest making the Jamming Array a "Tech" upgrade instead of a Modification.

49 minutes ago, Odanan said:

Here is a fix for the Auxiliary Payload.

Also, I would suggest making the Jamming Array a "Tech" upgrade instead of a Modification.

This card is much simpler and it also prevents A-wings from being able to take Unguided Rockets, which should definitely be avoided.

Use this image for higher quality art. Just zoom in to the part with the missiles.

I would also change "the minimum" and "the maximum" to "a minimum" and "a maximum."

42 minutes ago, Odanan said:

Also, I would suggest making the Jamming Array a "Tech" upgrade instead of a Modification.

I think that he made it a Modification so that the old A-wing could take it and so that the new A-wing could take Targeting Sub-systems.

Looking good, man. I particularly like the unique pilots.

These look more like a major thorn than an actual threat. Which is perfect for an Awing concept. Tallie wouldnt be causing any massive damage but she would really be pissing people off and greatly amp up other ships' survivability.

I'm assuming they have access to all the old Awing only stuff? (double ept, chaar-refit). It would technically enable you to have a -4 cost if you took 2 chaar-refits and that extra missile mod, but it would take away the valuable mod slot so probably wouldnt be abused. Actually i think i'd slap Unguided Rockets on these suckers, give'm a 3die attack and im not hurt about losing the targetlock benefit because generally i'll never get it anyway (still say awings should have a roll instead of tlock action). Yes i know that also dumps the new tech out the window but given action economy will be vital, comm relay or optics might be better.

Tallie w/ Test Pilot, PTL, Juke, Aux Payload, Unguided, and Optics would be 36pts, and pretty deadly imo.

Which is a point threshold i ALWAYS have problems with on rebels. Always feels like ships in that range are strictly defense or just an odd gimick and not really that dangerous on their own.

Also whats wrong with giving them Unguided Rockets access? Half of the new shinies dont work with unguided.

1 hour ago, AwesomeJedi said:

This card is much simpler and it also prevents A-wings from being able to take Unguided Rockets, which should definitely be avoided.

Use this image for higher quality art. Just zoom in to the part with the missiles.

I would also change "the minimum" and "the maximum" to "a minimum" and "a maximum."

Wow, it's gorgeous in the card:

I don't usually like CC posts, I reserve my judgement for CC League (which there should be a season 2). But this is about what everyone will think a Resistance A-wing would be. Got the extra shield +2 points and a dial that will make sure that the A-wing will never be played again. Given the bulls eye arc snap juke would be a little redundant.

• Auxiliary Payload is the most broken one thanks to Chardan refit, and if Intergrated Astromech can go on the classic X-wing thanks to FFG's funny ruling then Chardaan can go on the Resistance A-wing which will drop it by 2 points.
• Resistance Escort is an interesting one as it is also using the subfaction type but also the Star Viper cheat (title that allows for 2 titles). At least it isn't an auto include by being list restricted and cost a point.
• Jamming Array is one of those things that needs to be tighten up just a little bit. The auto jam token is a bit Op. Need to put in a restriction such as in-arc or spend target lock. You need to work on that one a bit. If it wasn't for Aux Payload this would be the most broken.
• Anticipation I think if you are going to include a bulls eye firing arc you should put a little more investment in that. Now granted only one ship has the firing arc but with such a restriction it prevents it from spilling over to other ships and increasing power creep and accretion.
• Targeting Subsystems Now this is almost the opposite of what I just said in Anticipation. Being that the tech slot is only available to the 2 smallest subfactions and the quadjumper having a bulls-eye firing arc requirement basically makes this a this ship only title. Remember that tech slot just got that permanent focus option so you have to compete with that. I would use a Target Lock requirement instead of Bullseye. Also with the limited and small ship only it unnecessary as the only double tech is the upsilon.

17 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

But this is about what everyone will think a Resistance A-wing would be. Got the extra shield +2 points and a dial that will make sure that the A-wing will never be played again.

This. There are a lot of good ideas in here, but the dial just has too many options of turning around. Not only can you turn around at three different speeds instead of two, but also with all available maneuvres. I appreciate the intent, this ship is a squirrel, after all, but for the points increase that dial feels like too much of a good thing.

To compare, the TiE/fo chassis is quite a bit better than the TiE/ln, but it lost the short turn for the sloops and crossed a price line that made it more of a filler than a swarm ship, so the /ln still had its niche, which was also apparent from the pilot abilities. This appears to fill the same niche than the RZ-1, but with very little downsides, as it fits existing A-Wing builds well and brings upgrades.

I really like them all! I think it would need playtesting, but Shortstop's ability might be a little bit overpowered (maybe make it once per round).

Resistance Escort might not prove that useful - A-Wings really like PTL and can't take Inspiring Recruit so they're not great stress-absorbers. So you could probably get away with making that a 0-cost upgrade. I also agree with the general consensus that the last two might be a point overcosted.

Jamming Array is awesome! I would totally play with that.

Not sold on the Auxiliary Payout in either rendition. I think that too many points in missiles just make the A-Wing a total glass cannon. I think you might want to consider finding a way to use munitions tokens as part of that.

On the whole though, this is one of the best and most balanced custom packs I've seen! Keep up the good work!

I don't think it should allow for the double EPT title. For lore and balance reasons. Also, this ship is fine without.

23 minutes ago, DampfGecko said:

This. There are a lot of good ideas in here, but the dial just has too many options of turning around. Not only can you turn around at three different speeds instead of two, but also with all available maneuvres. I appreciate the intent, this ship is a squirrel, after all, but for the points increase that dial feels like too much of a good thing.

To compare, the TiE/fo chassis is quite a bit better than the TiE/ln, but it lost the short turn for the sloops and crossed a price line that made it more of a filler than a swarm ship, so the /ln still had its niche, which was also apparent from the pilot abilities. This appears to fill the same niche than the RZ-1, but with very little downsides, as it fits existing A-Wing builds well and brings upgrades.

Yeah but now that Imperials have the TIE-Silencer Resistance A-wings will need something and it is obvious that twice the hit points is not the answer. But yeah maybe +2 points is not enough. +4 would be better so start at 21 like most other ships.

Amazing work, thanks for sharing!

Personally, I kinda think that Auxiliary Payload should allow an additional modification as well (for GC or AT). I get the point restriction, but 3 point missiles without GC (except Cruise) are meh. That's why they made GC, right?

Thanks for all the feedback guys! These have been rattling around my head for weeks now so its good to get others opinions.

I agree with the dial, I thought both the S-loop and the Talon-roll was a bit much as I said in my first post. Do we all think a S-loop is more in keeping with A-wing? Shall I dump the 2 T-roll?

I made Jamming Array a mod so the old A-wing can use it, as well as the player has to make a conscious choice to not take Autothrusters, you gain access to a debuff by sacrificing your own defences.

Obviously, to properly balance something it needs play testing, but I'm not necessarily interested in 'competing' with other existing cards. Not all cards are created equal, or to combat the meta, and my aim wasn't to make a meta buster. My aim with these cards is to create new options (that are somewhat future proof, hence the limited small ship only restriction on a card that currently would only effect this ship). I tried to make this RZ-2 more universal, so those that want to keep flying A-wings the same old way, they can with this ship, but it also comes with a bunch of cards that allow for a shift in A-wings use (slight shift of course, no game changers).

@Odanan I like your Aux Payload! I might reword it though if I may. I would change it to;

You may equip 2 additional missile upgrades that cost 3 or fewer squad points (to a minimum of 1).

I think that makes it obvious that its trying to block Chardaan refit. I originally made Aux Payload 2pts to counteract a double chardaan refit loadout, but I think the above version is more succinct, and also allows for any missile slot user to take it. A vaksai Kihraxz can make a double missile loadout very cheap with this card however, that is the only balancing issue that might pop up.

I want to keep Targeting Sub-systems as bullseye only as if we change it to target lock (that was my original thought as well) then anything with FCS can abuse the pants off it. That was another reason for it being a tech. I know it only affects this ship currently, but if FFG were ever to release an FO Interceptor for example, that could be a cool ship to add another bullseye too etc. That was my attempt at 'future proofing' an upgrade anyway. Same goes for the limited restriction, if FFG had added limited to Chardaan we wouldn't be having an issue with Aux payload.I know that an extremely situational and hypothetical scenario but its about keeping the design space as open as possible. That being said, should it be dropped to 1pt? Advanced Optics does seem to be the new almost auto include for tech so maybe the cost should be addressed for TSS.

I think the unique pilots are pretty solid cost wise, but are the generics a little too close to swarm territory? Shall I bump up the generics cost a bit?


Great feedback guys, keep it coming! I'm off to do some editing

Kinda weird to have an A-Wing with a bullseye firing arc. I'd sooner give it a 90 degree or more firing arc hound's tooth style to represent the pivoting blasters they have.

2 hours ago, Kingsguard said:

Kinda weird to have an A-Wing with a bullseye firing arc. I'd sooner give it a 90 degree or more firing arc hound's tooth style to represent the pivoting blasters they have.

A-Wing cannons pivot on a vertical axis. Widening the arc doesn't really make sense.