1 hour ago, Darth Meanie said:

This.

Rogue One was an adult film for adult fans. TFA walked the same line.

Now we are back to Porg plushies, amphibious titty jokes, one-liners, and the in-movie use of the term "lazer-sord" as the primary method for entertainment.

We had the term "laser sword" used in-movie a long time ago. Anakin says it in episode 1.

3 hours ago, Otacon said:

What? That's not what I was saying at all? The polling data from that article suggests that the overall feeling from an actual sample of people coming out of the theater being overwhelming positive(89% overall) vs. the decidedly more negative user take of the self reporting Rotten Tomatoes user rating seems to imply that the negative opinions are actually coming from a much smaller group than the RT numbers indicate. Which added to the box office numbers indicating ticket sales went up over the weekend seems like it shoots down the idea that the movie is somehow getting overall bad word of mouth, as the original post I was replying to was saying. That's all I was trying to say.

I was very much in the minority on Rogue One(it was entertaining but not an especially great movie, Scariff was the only redeeming thing about it), so I don't have some sort of need to be in the majority. Anecdotally the group I saw TLJ with was 6 to 1 happy with it, and all of my friends I've spoken to otherwise liked it, so the hate it's getting is just a bit baffling to me, is all.

I saw it with a group of four. One girl, three guys. All like Star Wars, with varying levels of fandom, fans of varying EU material (or not). None of the four of us liked it.

I guess we are all 33 or older, so maybe this movie is liked by younger audiences.

8 minutes ago, Knightcrawler said:

I saw it with a group of four. One girl, three guys. All like Star Wars, with varying levels of fandom, fans of varying EU material (or not). None of the four of us liked it.

I guess we are all 33 or older, so maybe this movie is liked by younger audiences.

My friends and I have all seen it. All the people I know under 33 years old liked it. I believe I am speaking for the younger audience when I say this movie was pretty good.

Well, Knightcrawler, I'm 48 and I thought it was excellent.

And again, being 7 when Star Wars came out, I can tell you distinctly that a bunch of critics thought Star Wars was for kids, and a bunch of adults basically told them to haul off. Star Wars literally got a bunch of critics out of jobs, and changed the way movies are critiqued. Recognition for Star Wars was decades coming. Elitists never wanted to admit it was a good film. Only in the 90's, did things begin to change, as far as I'm concerned.

9 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

My read was the Hux was promoted above his competence by Snoke specifically to have a general who would be disliked and easy to manipulate.

I think Hux got the job mainly because his Father was important to setting up the First Order (explained in the Aftermath book). His father was in charge of one of the Imperial academies at the time of ROTJ, and was rescued (along with his bastard son) from Rebellion siege, before being sent to the unknown territories to help train what would become the First Order.

And i'm the same. While i wouldn't put it on excellent, it was definitely a good movie.

It just seems that writers and the cutting room ain't what it used to be though, and that's a theme that seems to run through hollywood a lot, quite often you can see where scenes have been shortened or cut (almost like the free to air television version to get past the censors)

As an example, i found out today cameo's from Brit's Price william and harry was cut, and reading that article that weird jump from rey to finn and rose on the destroyer made sense instead of just a clunky segway

13 minutes ago, Knightcrawler said:

I saw it with a group of four. One girl, three guys. All like Star Wars, with varying levels of fandom, fans of varying EU material (or not). None of the four of us liked it.

I guess we are all 33 or older, so maybe this movie is liked by younger audiences.

The problem is not age. I'm 42, for instance. And I like classic movies that would make the (hyperactive) children of today sleep in 5 minutes.

Some people, I don't know exactly why, weren't able to "connect" with this movie. Somehow the movie struck a nerve (or several nerves) and that snowballed until there was only bitterness left in the end. I feel sorry for them, because they will not find pleasure in future Star Wars titles, unless they tell very restrained stories (like Rogue One, Han Solo and Obi-Wan).

21 minutes ago, KelRiever said:

Star Wars literally got a bunch of critics out of jobs, and changed the way movies are critiqued.

"A bunch," otherwise expressed as "one guy who people have speculated might have been fired because of it but probably isn't true" and none of that other stuff happened.

Let's not get carried away here, repeating Internet myths and passing them off as fact.


Sure, a small but notable percentage of critics in 1980 didn't like The Empire Strikes Back, and it doesn't really make a whole lot of sense. But, then again, the average critic score for The Last Jedi is 8.2, and that doesn't make any sense either because we've seen the movie and it ain't an 8.2, lol. Sometimes critics are wrong, sometimes they are apathetic. Sometimes it's just not their kind of movie. Nobody will get fired for liking The Last Jedi either.

15 minutes ago, Odanan said:

The problem is not age. I'm 42, for instance. And I like classic movies that would make the (hyperactive) children of today sleep in 5 minutes.

Some people, I don't know exactly why, weren't able to "connect" with this movie. Somehow the movie struck a nerve (or several nerves) and that snowballed until there was only bitterness left in the end. I feel sorry for them, because they will not find pleasure in future Star Wars titles, unless they tell very restrained stories (like Rogue One, Han Solo and Obi-Wan).

I can tell you exactly why I didn't connect with the movie. Pretty sure others already have. 1/3 of the movie should never have been shot, the entire pretense of the movie and its slow chase is forced and nonsensical, and every 10 or 15 minutes, something out of character/out of universe would happen to pull you out of the movie.

Also, Mark Hamill wasn't playing Luke Skywalker, he was playing Mark Hamill.

That is a short list. I am gonna make a video tomorrow, but there are plenty already out there.

Like I said, exactly the way it was.

Sorry, go on with your internet myths. I was there, that's not a myth.

The myth is, now, that people still want to say the critics were right, because that's the elitism continuing through to this day. But its dead criticism, and its now a personal point of view.

Gotta tell you, if something it good, and well liked, it becomes a thing to keep trying to shoot it down. I always laugh at it.

Back to other thing I liked about The Last Jedi. I thought the end scenes with Luke were awesome. Particularly some of the cinematography was not to be beat. Without R2 in the last scene by Luke, I can only speculate that C3PO and R2 will somehow come back together before the end.

3 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

This.

Rogue One was an adult film for adult fans. TFA walked the same line.

Now we are back to Porg plushies, amphibious titty jokes, one-liners, and the in-movie use of the term "lazer-sord" as the primary method for entertainment.

With absolutely all due respect, there is a particular delusion associated with such an assertion. What I really don't get, is how TLJ can even be seen as "Kiddy". Let's reflect on Snoke's death, Snoke's death confirmation, watching Leia almost absolutely freakin' die, the entire fight with the Praetorian Guards, that weird creature Luke got way too personal with, constant themes of loss, betrayal, and the slaughter of the helpless.

This assertion makes no sense to me.

*****IT KEEPS HAPPENING

1 hour ago, Hobojebus said:

Well Normie's have lives we don't.

I prefer the term "mundanes."

1 hour ago, TheVeteranSergeant said:

They gave that hyperspace kamikaze scene to the wrong character. Given how corny the rest of the film was, I'd have given them props if instead of Admiral Lavender, it was Admiral Akbar.

Poe: "That's a suicide mission!"

Akbar: "No... <grim smile> It's a trap."

That would have been awesome

48 minutes ago, Odanan said:

The problem is not age. I'm 42, for instance. And I like classic movies that would make the (hyperactive) children of today sleep in 5 minutes.

Some people, I don't know exactly why, weren't able to "connect" with this movie. Somehow the movie struck a nerve (or several nerves) and that snowballed until there was only bitterness left in the end. I feel sorry for them, because they will not find pleasure in future Star Wars titles, unless they tell very restrained stories (like Rogue One, Han Solo and Obi-Wan).

I am one of those people, and I can't even tell you why.

I did my 2.5 hours, I laughed at the jokes, I loved seeing the Star Wars universe on the big screen again, I geeked out at the new aliens and starships, I thought about what ships need to make into XWM. But when it was all done, I thought "WTF."

I guess the only thing I might say is that I waited for 38 years for TFA, and another 2 for Luke's Story. And then, I don't feel like it was worth the wait, and I wish I had EU Luke back again.

The feelings are the same as when I walked out of TPM. I waited 25 years for this?? Well, OK, it's Star Wars!! And then AotC happened. . .

I would say to anyone who has issues with the film and has only seen it once, see it a second time. It changed my perspective the second time around. It may change yours as well.

3 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:

I would say to anyone who has issues with the film and has only seen it once, see it a second time. It changed my perspective the second time around. It may change yours as well.

Not a bad idea. Although if people are shying away from steep theatre prices, they might want to wait for a cheaper version of media to deliver it if they weren't fans.

Me, on the other hand, am definitely going to see it again, because I think I'm going to like it again, and want to go with other people.

12 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:

I would say to anyone who has issues with the film and has only seen it once, see it a second time. It changed my perspective the second time around. It may change yours as well.

IIRC, I liked TFA better on a second pass as well.

In any event, my wife loved it, so I'm going back no matter what

Just saw the movie. Im upset. I was sure all the fan criticism where undeserved. I was wrong.

Since spoilers are allowed: what i wanted most was to see Luke being badass at least once. Him not having any kind of spoken appearance in Force Awaken was one of the only drawback of that film (for me). What i wanted the least was for them to kill Luke. Not only did they kill him but he never got at least 1 real fight. Worst, he died because he meditated too hard??? What the frack!

How about Snoke. We have a glimpse at how powerful he is when he shocks Kylo. Hes just starting to get interesting and wham, he dies like a clown. Where does he come from? Why does he hates the Skywalkers? What are his motivations?

In the end we are left with Kylo and Rey and no potential main protagonist/hero. They both feel like support characters.

Contrary to Strike Back i wasnt left wanting for more. I feel like the story is closed, that no matter where it goes it wont look like a real trilogy.

The movie pacing feels wrong. There are major slowdowns when you expect some form of excitement.

Rey turns out (again) way more powerful than she should be. With almost no practice she was lifting all those rocks like she was already a master. It's just too much. Same with her lightsaber fight. Yes she got some practice with her stick. Yes she might be powerful. But fighting like she does with a weapon she barely ever handled makes no sense.

There is no gap between the 2 movies yet Rey appears changed a lot physically. It's almost as if Ridley was at the beginning of a pregnancy.

The casino part doesnt feel like it belongs to a Star Wars movie. The aesthetics contrast way too much with the rest of the film. For a short time i felt like i was back in one of the prequel movie.

Phasma: all we end up seeing of her is a small part of her face. Another promising character that turned out to be just an empty shell.

Would be soo funny if we get a new crew upgrade card. Flying Space Leia: common!!

The kid at the end looks way too much like young Anakin. It's scary.

So many more things to say. First major disappointment since Disney took the franchise.

1 hour ago, Thormind said:

Would be soo funny if we get a new crew upgrade card. Flying Space Leia: common!!

Oh, I got a better one:

1 hour ago, defkhan1 said:

I would say to anyone who has issues with the film and has only seen it once, see it a second time. It changed my perspective the second time around. It may change yours as well.

Just saw it a 2nd time and I like this movie a lot better. Does it still have issues yes, but it’s not as bad as I first thought. On ROTS level for me now.

Top things I noticed the 2nd time:

Ackbar gives command to divert energy to aft shields just prior to Kylo and his wingmates strafing run. So this means the bridge was either unshielded or lightly shielded. And two missiles/torps would be more than enough to damage the bridge the way it did.

The time gap: Rose and Finn land on Canto Bight with 18 hours to go, get locked up, and begin their escape with 5 hours to go. So normally you would think the resistance would have run out of fuel two hours ago but the ship they stole was a Sienar weapons dealers ship so it would be more than likely to have a faster hyperdrive than the escape pod. Of course we’re not told this. So they stick to the rules, they just didn’t tell anyone. There’s some fudging with the numbers with the Falcon, but it’s the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy so...

snoke... well he tied his own noose. Tell Kylo he will never be like Darth Vader, then praise him for following in Vader’s footsteps when Rey shows up. You kill and then re-ignite the spark of idolizing Darth Vader. Which of course from the books we know the FO considers Vader’s redemption his folly. So Kylo seizing Power is very thematic. And yeah we don’t know everything about him but then again we’ve had a trilogy, comic series, and two novels (one legends, one canon) to explore palps so... patience you must learn!

Phasma... same thing with snoke, but a lot more poorly executed.

DJ... by no means do I like him any better, but Finn/rose Aren’t Ezra and DJ isn’t Hondo/Maul so.

and here’s hoping the little kid with the broom at the end is Corran horn.

So my new takeaway: it’s a Star Wars film, and it fits in the universe, but not as good as the others do. Feeling atm it’ll be the weakest of the trilogy. It does have plot issues, but there not as blantant as people seem to think. It does bother me still leias Alive and luke is not, but it will be interesting to see where 9 goes. It feels very ROTS to me.

12 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

Oh, I got a better one:

Moff jerrjerod Likes her.

4 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

This whole "it's a huge deconstruction of the Star Wars mythos" thing as a point of applause is in my mind one of the failures of the movie.

As KelRiever points out, both Abrams and Edwards when to great lengths to recapture the feel of the original SW material. The imagery of the New Order, the ships, tie-ins to extant material and cross-overs, etc.

Johnson comes in an sends all that to the shredder and gets kudos for originality??

Fine, call me a fan-boy who can't stand change. But it's my (and others, of course) 40 years a patronage that made this IP worth 4 billion, so I think we all deserve the fan-boy homage.

The only part that Rian destroys and doesn't build back up, is the idea of "The Chosen One".

He does deconstruct the idea of the legendary heroes in Star Wars. Showing them that they aren't perfect. And shows what would have happened in those dashing adventures had failed. But the important point is that new heroes would be able to arise. That anyone could be a hero.

But of course, a pretty big call that Star Wars isn't necessarily about the Skywalkers or Solos any more is going to no sit well.

1 minute ago, Sithborg said:

But of course, a pretty big call that Star Wars isn't necessarily about the Skywalkers or Solos any more is going to no sit well.

Given that these were going to be the last 3 movies of the Old Guard no matter what, maybe he could have waited for his own trilogy to go stomping into new thematic elements. . .

I mean, it's done. Two characters are dead cinematically, and the last is dead in real life. Star Wars will never be about the Skywalkers or the Solos ever again. At least not the way we grew up with them.

This movie didn't feel like a decent last hurrah for Luke or Leia.

I think if I have one overarching nerd complaint for all of the new trilogy so far, it's that neither director has any concept of scale in the Star Wars universe.

JJ, as he did in Star Trek, has no concept of the scale of space or travel within it, and he treats hyperspace like an instantaneous teleport to anywhere in the galaxy.

Whereas Rian Johnson has no concept of the scale of galactic armed forces. The idea that the New Republic, a galactic superpower, somehow lost it's entire fleet with the loss of a single star system is ******* ridiculous.

3 hours ago, Knightcrawler said:

Also, Mark Hamill wasn't playing Luke Skywalker, he was playing Mark Hamill.

To be fair, he's said he disagrees with pretty much every decision they made for Luke in this movie. But he still did what he was told because he's a professional.

So maybe he didn't play it very Luke Skywalkersy because he didn't feel the character was very Luke Skywalkersy anymore.

3 hours ago, KelRiever said:

Back to other thing I liked about The Last Jedi. I thought the end scenes with Luke were awesome. Particularly some of the cinematography was not to be beat. Without R2 in the last scene by Luke, I can only speculate that C3PO and R2 will somehow come back together before the end.

R2 was on the falcon along with 3PO at the end of the film when the handful of Resistance forces were boarding up.

26 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:

The time gap: Rose and Finn land on Canto Bight with 18 hours to go, get locked up, and begin their escape with 5 hours to go. So normally you would think the resistance would have run out of fuel two hours ago but the ship they stole was a Sienar weapons dealers ship so it would be more than likely to have a faster hyperdrive than the escape pod. Of course we’re not told this. So they stick to the rules, they just didn’t tell anyone. There’s some fudging with the numbers with the Falcon, but it’s the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy so...

5 hours to LITERALLY get from one end of the galaxy to the other as can be seen from the image posted earlier in this thread.