On 12/14/2017 at 6:16 AM, Estarriol said:

Starkiller base fired a few shots and the entire New Republic navy is gone? There’s like not even a stray frigate or two? No naval bases that weren’t in the Josmian system? Talk about eggs in one basket.

i kind of needed a block and tackle to suspend my disbelief there.

If jumping to hyperspace causes so much damage, why aren’t there hyperspace Missiles?

Yea it is really stupid, like having all of our military concentrated around DC with all our ships and soldiers since you know that makes sense....oh wait it doesn't? Hmm, yea, it is almost as if they really, really, want to sell it as the rebellion against a superior foe again. Really the New Republic seems so much more inept in the ST than it ever did in the books and even more than the corrupt and plodding Republic of the PT.

I think in the EU they had a galaxy gun which basically fired missiles at lightspeed.

On 12/14/2017 at 7:15 AM, Rojek said:

I'm wondering if Ep IX takes place a few years after this, the ending seemed to hint at it. Overall I'm pleased with the major points and dissapointed at minor things mostly. I wonder how it holds up to multiple viewings.

I'd imagine so, it seems that their Rebel allies and Resistance allies didn't come so they are in recruitment mode so a few years would let them get them and set up Kylo as the Supreme Leader of an Empire. I guess that would allow them to deal with Leia passing from age or something in the opening crawl but at the same point it makes me wonder how they might finish this trilogy when it sort of feels like this is a Revenge of the Sith kind of setup with the Resistance so depleted and defeated. I guess on the plus side now the FO no longer has its capital with the Supremacy being destroyed, unless they somehow salvage it.

On 12/14/2017 at 8:52 AM, GreenDragoon said:

The worst part and an actual problem for me is the time frame.
Just think how few days passed from the beginning in Episode 7 and the end of Episode 8! That's in the span of days, maybe weeks. And yet they all changed so much!

Yea, I really have no idea how big the First Order is supposed to be, it was sort of set up that they are radicals and the like but how can they seem to have the forces that even the Empire at its height didn't really have. Like as you mentioned the time frame I have no clue how they could deploy fleets to all the key worlds and take them over in such a sort period of time, let alone how the systems which now have defense fleets with the New Republic downsizing its own military. I mean I get that there were people who were funneling resources and stuff to them but how many babies/children did the FO kidnap and take the time to raise and get everything together without having any people finding out about it?

The Resistance bombers really seemed sort of more like liabilities than anything. I mean they were complete powderkegs that blew once hit, and having to drop your payload directly ontop of the enemy ship seems like a bad plan too, like heavy missiles and torpedoes would make much more sense. They way they went up I'm just imagining that they need some title or something that makes you roll for damage whenever you take hull damage for every bomb upgrade on your ship and then take damage from them. I know that I was sort of looking at the Resistance Bomber as being a sort of in cannon replacement of the K-Wing but now I'm just thinking about how that ship seemed so much more less prone to exploding from a sneeze in its general direction.

2 hours ago, BlodVargarna said:

This entire thread is dog sh**.

A **** fest of miserable haters.

I got two pages in and that’s about all there was to it.

Boo haters!

Go read my posts! I for one loved it!

I am a total night owl and I'm on Christmas break and yet I'll still be hauling myself out of bed to go to an 8:30 am showing tomorrow!

1 hour ago, Forresto said:

The hyperspace ram is one of the most believable parts of the film, starships are essentially super powered projectiles, it just has wide reaching consequences for the universe now.

The Raddus is the same size if not bigger then a Resurgent class Star Destroyer. So of course it ripped through them. The Supremacy only lost part of a wing, the rest of it is fine.

Why? It is a maneuver that sacrifices the starship. Which, you don't just turn your top class warships into suicide bombers. It is also a bit easy to predict. They didn't recognize it at first, so when they did realize what it was about to do, it was too late.

That type of military incompetence seems common place, with the dreadnaught's captain complaining about the late deployment of fighters.

I wanted to like it. I even did like quite a few scenes and moments. But overall I can't say it sits quite right with me. There are a number of scenes that have been pointed out as... problematic earlier in the thread so I will try to avoid beating a dead horse.
I will sum them up as first a general annoyance I can have with shows/movies which is, if you have to make your bad guys incompetent to make your heroes look good you should rethink the story. Arrogance is fine, Tarkins' refusal to evacuate the Deathstar was a good example of pride leading to his fall. The other is the movie felt like it was moving from spectacle to spectacle to distract you from noticing they weren't answering anything substantial about kind of key pieces of information left out of Ep. 7 that should have gotten addressed here. An instance of this is them not telling or showing us a broad scope of how big a territory the First Order controls vs the Republic vs the Empire remnants. The Galactic Empire in Ep. IV didn't need this because the very name alone gave you sufficient context to grasp the nature and scope of the bad guys.

I saw it, and I am really conflicted about it. I only read the first couple pages of this thread.

The Bad

-Space Witch Leia

-HyperSpace cuts through an entire fleet

-Super Poe in the beginning

-Any BB8 humor

The Good

-Luke's story

-Poe’s character

-Redifined Force Powers

-The world building

The Meh

-Snoke was anti climatic

-DJ and his story or lack there of

- intense but uninspired battles

-Phasma.

So much of this movie seems like wasted/missed opportunities. Overall I enjoyed it slightly over The Force Awakens, but not by much.

As X-Wing TMG is concerned:

-Flappy X-Wings are now a thing

-I still think the missing SKU will be DJ’s ship or the stolen vessel

-Not many fighters or many ships to fit into X-Wing

Well this movie now officially has a viewer review score on Rotten Tomatoes that's lower than Attack of the Clones. So make of that what you will.

16 hours ago, Stay On The Leader said:

Phasma Boba Fett- Hi, I'm Captain Phasma Boba Fett, you may have heard of me due to how many toys I've featured in and because I look amazing in this awesome shiny armour. I got cruelly edited out of large bits of TFA ESB but I was always intended to be more prominent so I'm back now and ready to... oh, I'm dead in a meaningless way.

Again with the fixing.

Wonder why people like the Fett and not the Chrome dome?

I am very mixed about it. At times it feels like a disorganized ESB (start with evac, “the last transport is away”, and then take 2 hours to fly away, insert the Dagobah and Cloud City parts while fleeing, and end with fighting the walkers. And as a bonus, we get a remake of Lando’s Death Star run set to the music used when the Falcon first fled the Death Star.

While there was some growth in Kylo and Rey as characters, the rest was very flat. Poe, Finn, and Rose add almost nothing to the movie. Poe’s actions at least impacted the plot. If Finn and Rose were not in the movie, I’m not sure we would have noticed.

Luke’s ending was fitting for a Jedi Master. Who Luke becomes in the Disney version is hard to accept I think because of growing up reading all of the Ledgends material.

I think at the end of the day, there were too many plot lines going on to provide the character growth that I expected.

And yes, I wanted to see Luke in an X-Wing! (That has nothing to do with my feelings on the movie)

3 minutes ago, kyten44 said:

Again with the fixing.

Wonder why people like the Fett and not the Chrome dome?

Sexism.

1 hour ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Don't hate them. Pity them. While the film is not perfect, much of its flaws come from not being what people imagined, including mimicking of past stories. There are many that can't enjoy it for whatever reason. Some people have grown bitter and jaded, and nothing would make them happy. If these films were a direct adaptation of the old Thrawn trilogy legends books, people would still be complaining that Mara Jade wasn't right, or something else.

The misplaced and unearned arrogance of these kinds of posts is always amusing.

12 minutes ago, TheVeteranSergeant said:

The misplaced and unearned arrogance of these kinds of posts is always amusing.

He's right though. So far the fans have been almost impossible to please.

Unless it was directly related to The Original Trilogy.

But we can't sit around that era forever. There's too much else to see.

27 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

He's right though. So far the fans have been almost impossible to please.

Unless it was directly related to The Original Trilogy.

But we can't sit around that era forever. There's too much else to see.

I wouldn't agree. The point is that Rogue one was made for the diehard fans - it pleased them. TFA was made for the general audience - it mostly pleased them. Sadly, this film just has a lot of rubbish scenes... why would it please us?

1 hour ago, Rouge Five said:

I am very mixed about it. At times it feels like a disorganized ESB (start with evac, “the last transport is away”, and then take 2 hours to fly away, insert the Dagobah and Cloud City parts while fleeing, and end with fighting the walkers. And as a bonus, we get a remake of Lando’s Death Star run set to the music used when the Falcon first fled the Death Star.

While there was some growth in Kylo and Rey as characters, the rest was very flat. Poe, Finn, and Rose add almost nothing to the movie. Poe’s actions at least impacted the plot. If Finn and Rose were not in the movie, I’m not sure we would have noticed.

Without Finn and Rose in the movie all of the resistance transports would have survived since the FO would never have known they were there.

4 hours ago, BlodVargarna said:

This entire thread is dog sh**.

A **** fest of miserable haters.

I got two pages in and that’s about all there was to it.

Boo haters!

You know what? Comments like this one are exactly what I hate about the internet. Read a thing you didn't like? Just label it 'hate' or 'fanboyism', call out the supposed culprit and grind the conversation to a halt. I made a very hard effort to voice my opinions about the movie in a constructive, respectful manner. So no, not everybody who wasn't oberwhelmed by the boldly different new Star Wars movie is a hater.

Please, do respond. I hope that you will actively partake in a discussion about the movie's highs as well as its lows.

The movie was horribly bloated due to Finn's sideplot and weighed down by a relentless onslaught of slapstick that ruined a lot of scenes, particularly the ones that were meant to provoke a different emotional reaction.

That, in combination with the way Luke, Snoke, Rey and Leia were handled, completes the trainwreck for me.

It's a shame, really, because there were some genuinely great scenes and ideas here and there, but they got drowned out by the movie's flaws.

48 minutes ago, VanderLegion said:

Without Finn and Rose in the movie all of the resistance transports would have survived since the FO would never have known they were there.

Without Poe in the movie the vast majority of the Resistance would probably have survived.

Without Rey in the movie Luke would still be alive.

God, the new cast just blows!

On 14/12/2017 at 0:35 PM, Azrapse said:

Yes. That was kind of explained.
Basically they have a new tech that can just "tag" a ship and trace it thru hyperspace. They don't need anything or anyone onboard that ship. Destroying the flagship wouldn't achieve anything because any other destroyer could tag the ship.

Going by the way the hyperspace computer is described in The Last Jedi Visual Dictionary - it's unique to the flagship - basically, by using hyperspace energy, the computer can calculate at "hyper-speeds".

3 hours ago, Animewarsdude said:

I think in the EU they had a galaxy gun which basically fired missiles at lightspeed.

The missiles had to leave hyperspace to hit the target and destroy it via its warhead. The hyperspace part is simply the delivering method.

In the EU it was quite clear that objects in hyperspace can't interact with objects in real space. But Vice versa real space objects are creating a mass shadow in hyperspace which is deadly to every fast moving object in it.

You could still ram something via the acceleration prior to the jump. But as this part is implied to work like a warp drive. So actually no real velocity.

26 minutes ago, RogueLeader42 said:

In the EU it was quite clear that objects in hyperspace can't interact with objects in real space.

Depends heavily on the author. ICS: Revenge of the Sith had a bit about how a battlecruiser - the Quaestor - hyperspaced-crashed into a planet, and left that planet fractured down to the core (and bathed in radiation).

3 hours ago, Princezilla said:

Well this movie now officially has a viewer review score on Rotten Tomatoes that's lower than Attack of the Clones. So make of that what you will.

Haters. Haters everywhere.

Just saw the movie on Thursday afternoon.

Pretty good movie probably the best one since Empire. In New Hope Han says objects colliding while travelling at lightspeed ends with disastrous results. Established in canon in the first half of the first movie.

I kinda want to be like either Snoke, walking around my throne room in a golden bathrobe. That's true evil.

Or like Luke, milkin my seacow's teet for that tasty green milk and letting that green milk dribble down my chin like the sick bastard I am.

1 hour ago, FTS Gecko said:

Without Poe in the movie the vast majority of the Resistance would probably have survived.

Without Rey in the movie Luke would still be alive.

God, the new cast just blows!

That does presuppose that the dreadnought wouldn’t have just wiped Raddus two minutes in...

1 minute ago, Shadow345 said:

In New Hope Han says objects colliding while travelling at lightspeed ends with disastrous results. Established in canon in the first half of the first movie.

The question is whether the thing that is not in hyperspace takes damage as well as the thing that is in hyperspace. Some sources, at least, say yes. I'm not sure if I've ever read a Legends source that specifically states otherwise.

9 minutes ago, Ironlord said:

Depends heavily on the author. ICS: Revenge of the Sith had a bit about how a battlecruiser - the Quaestor - hyperspaced-crashed into a planet, and left that planet fractured down to the core (and bathed in radiation).

I know. I had a very good discussion in a german speaking forum about it. And the result was that aside from a few strange things (e.g. ICS and a Comic where a ship jumped through a planet to escape) hyperspace was mostly consistent to the "rules" created by WEG.

Asides from that. I'd take everything form the ICS regarding weapons power and capabilities of ships and technology with a grain of salt as the Author, Curtiss Saxton, is heavily involved in the SW vs ST arguments and uses his position to create canon to let the SW side benefit from it. 200 Gigaton per bolt Turbolasers on the Acclemator...

7 hours ago, drail14me said:

I left the theater depressed. They killed Luke. WTF! My childhood idol! I thought Mark did a fantastic job bringing Luke back and with dealing with the script he was given but I think Rian is a ****** for killing him off in this film and in this manner.

How do you wanted him to die? Not only the character, but the actor are old. It was the best way.