Hi!

I'm new to Armada, but got hooked up right from the start. Due to having many people in the group already playing Empire I decided to go Rebel

I only had 2 games besides that starting scenario so my experience is limited and to make it worse I haven't played strategy board/miniature games for an awful long time

I'm playing with many ideas on how to build fleets, but I'm a bit overwhelmed by the amount of possibilities you have. How does one built a (Rebel) fleet? Start with objectives or a commander and then try to develop everything around that?

I have no idea how to make several units work and I do envy the Empire opponents a bit because they seem to have better ships/squadrons. Going only/always Ackbar to have the shooting power seems a bit boring to say the least, but I'm very unsure how to make an Rebel fleet go against this setup?

Last game he took the center and just moved straight ahead pushing my ships at long range, crippleing or destroying one each turn.

Any tips in general are appreciated. I have tried to search the forum, but I seem not to get the right topics...

BR,

Gordon

Its funny... I find making rebel fleets easier...

But generally start with either an idea (be it tactic, objective you want to play, or even an upgrade you want to use) or an admiral.

Eg use Monmatha... that then says no point picking any ships that dont have an evade because of her ability

Or use Cracken.. who wants speed 3+ ships

Then pick 3 or 4 ships with the basic upgrades that work with the admiral /tactic /idea, look at about 100 points of sqns then fill up the rest of the points with extra upgrades and /or sqns

On table... go for hand of justice then work on the other kittens whilst staying out of the front of the ISD. Use Hera + luke + dutch + rogue sqn to remove his sqns and then go on to threaten a kitten

I'll have a longer more helpful comment later, but he's not putting Advanced Gunnery on the ISD, is he? They don't stack the way he wants them to...

If you are starting from scratch, don't try to build from EVERYTHING. It's too overwhelming and you won't understand, or will miss how or why certain upgrades are powerful.

Try limiting yourself a bit. Start by just building some Wave 1 only stuff. Wave 1 ships, commanders, upgrades. Pick different commanders, or ships, and try to figure out what is good about them. Playtest them against other units you have. Toss other ships on the table, give them basic commands and no upgrades. See how your ships and upgrades perform against them. Think about the results and rebuild your same fleet, but consider other available options. Do this several times.

Then introduce 1 expansion from wave 2. Think deeply about how those options change things. How does the new ship fit in. How can this commander be used. How can these upgrades compliment older ships. Build new fleets, change things up. Really think about each change you make. Play test them. Introduce another expansion to the set and see how that changes things. Force yourself to playtest what you see to be weaker ships, upgrades, and commanders. Learn why they are weak, but also, think about how they can be useful. Is there a fleet build you could imagine this taking advantage of?

I also suggest doing a lot of reading. https://cannotgetyourshipout.blogspot.com/ is an amazing resource. Read through the ship/fighter/commander sections for whatever you are introducing to your set. It will give you a good idea of how to use that piece, and what it's pros/cons are.

Again, don't overwhelm yourself with too many options at once. Ease into it. You are starting several years behind, while others have had that time to absorb it all.

The Empire has squadrons that when viewed in a vacuum may seem stronger or on an individual level, but rebels have some ball busting combos and better damage amplification (Toryn, Adar, Yavaris, Norra, Ten). If a good Rebel player wants to win the squadron fight, It's very hard for imps to stop them.

14 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

The Empire has squadrons that when viewed in a vacuum may seem stronger or on an individual level, but rebels have some ball busting combos and better damage amplification (Toryn, Adar, Yavaris, Norra, Ten). If a good Rebel player wants to win the squadron fight, It's very hard for imps to stop them.

You don't say. I gotta agree with Mastershake, on paper the Imp squads may seem OP and their synergies more obvious but the Rebels can create a squadron wing that's greater than the sum of its parts. H*** if you can proc Ten's crit ability three times on a swarm of TIE aces they all just go away. I know this because I watched, through my own tears, in horror as it happened to me. The B's, the B's, by all that's holy please God no more B's!

I'm relatively new too so take all this advice with a grain of salt but that fleet doesn't look too scary to me. What ships do you have to work with?

You've met the one Imperial fleet that loves to stand off and throw red dice. It sounds like you are trying to play the same game using Ackbar to throw a lot of red dice back, but you've realized this Imp fleet does it even better than you because it has lots of cheap, hard hitting ships and rerolls. If you want to beat them you need to stop playing their game. Make them play your game instead.

Do you have a fighter pack? Bring bombers. A solid mixed force of X-wings and Y-wings under Dodonna will chew through their three generic TIE Fighters and start pouring damage into ships quickly.

Or try using Mon Mothma with hard hitting evady ships like MC30s and TRC90s.

It's easier said than done when you're new but try to stay away from the Star Destroyer and out of its front arc as much as you can. Hunt the Arqs. They're squishy and they can basically only go straight forward each turn so you should be able to predict where they are going to end up based on their speed.

1 hour ago, geek19 said:

I'll have a longer more helpful comment later, but he's not putting Advanced Gunnery on the ISD, is he? They don't stack the way he wants them to...

Hi! I have put his list in the original post and linked it to keep it short: http://armadawarlords.hivelabs.solutions/view_list.php?token=150519&key=38d8ab43eacb8e8d2a67a1efdd525459

I'm not sure if I get you right, but I not sure I know what Advanced Gunnery is. I'm a German player and got all rules and cards in German. In hindsight it would have been far better to get everything in English, but alas... I checked the glossar but didn't find the term either.
Did you mean the Veteran Gunners or the Gunnery Team?

To all of you: Thank you. Right now it really seems like the Empire is far better and I made the wrong choice. I can't seem to find good combos and even if I seem to do my tactics are... mediocre right now. Even the imperial Star fighters seem superior

I love playing with fighters and for CAP I really make them work. As for bombers... I haven't had the chance to make them work.

@kmanweiss: Thanks especially for the additional resource.

Next go is something along this line: http://armadawarlords.hivelabs.solutions/view_list.php?token=150867&key=b0847ace6bf107765da727b260e79cb8

All fighters up front, followed by the MC80, covered by the CR90s. I want to use the MC80 as thread while the fighters are more or less ignored until they hit.

1 hour ago, slasher956 said:

On table... go for hand of justice then work on the other kittens whilst staying out of the front of the ISD.

As a very serious question: How do I stay out of the front arc of the ISD? He normally starts in the center (because he wants to get into my face). With speed 3 he will get my on turn 2 at long range and turn 3 at med (or even short). Latest he will get me on turn 3 long range and then pin me down.

I have played Star Fleet battles for a couple of years. To outmaneuver somebody on a fixed map you need to be way faster than him. Going the same speed if he has the center (what he normally does) seems impossible to me.

Where do I make the mistake?

3 minutes ago, Gordon Freemann said:

As a very serious question: How do I stay out of the front arc of the ISD? He normally starts in the center (because he wants to get into my face). With speed 3 he will get my on turn 2 at long range and turn 3 at med (or even short). Latest he will get me on turn 3 long range and then pin me down.

I have played Star Fleet battles for a couple of years. To outmaneuver somebody on a fixed map you need to be way faster than him. Going the same speed if he has the center (what he normally does) seems impossible to me.

Where do I make the mistake?

You can add engine techs to your mc80 and just do lots of Nav Commands early on. I also try to have my mc80 home one stay close to an edge. If he’s going to put you in his front arc, make sure he is on your side arc so he pays for it.

Shoot Imperials, claim moral high ground, get Twi'lek dancing girls!

or as Jyn Erso would tell you...

2 minutes ago, Gordon Freemann said:

As a very serious question: How do I stay out of the front arc of the ISD? He normally starts in the center (because he wants to get into my face). With speed 3 he will get my on turn 2 at long range and turn 3 at med (or even short). Latest he will get me on turn 3 long range and then pin me down.

I have played Star Fleet battles for a couple of years. To outmaneuver somebody on a fixed map you need to be way faster than him. Going the same speed if he has the center (what he normally does) seems impossible to me.

Where do I make the mistake?

Well I have an idea it won't be popular. If you can't avoid it, meet it head on.

Allow me to elaborate ISD front is a real pain. If you lack the skill and experience to Doge it, force it to fire at what you want and bring fast moving pain to the sides. The liberty is probably the best way to go about this strong front sheild and good frontal fire. It's very hard to ignore. The trick is you have to be ok with the odds being against it. On top, then you must choose your sword to deal killing damage. MC 30s cr90s HHs another liberty. You may look at it as trading his big bad for yours. If the liberty survives huzah! This idea sits upon having multiple deadly threats. Each one a serious threat in and of itself but together it makes them a gauranteed killer, thus giving you the choice of who will take the ISD punch so you can punch back harder. So I like to think of it as a heavyweight prize fight, all you gotta do is out last him till he opens up for the haymaker.

27 minutes ago, Gordon Freemann said:

Hi! I have put his list in the original post and linked it to keep it short: http://armadawarlords.hivelabs.solutions/view_list.php?token=150519&key=38d8ab43eacb8e8d2a67a1efdd525459

I'm not sure if I get you right, but I not sure I know what Advanced Gunnery is. I'm a German player and got all rules and cards in German. In hindsight it would have been far better to get everything in English, but alas... I checked the glossar but didn't find the term either.
Did you mean the Veteran Gunners or the Gunnery Team?

His Red objective. In the list you posted, the chosen red one is advanced gunnery.

If he equips it onto any of his ships, it will not actually work by the wording of the card.

Slaved turrets prevents a second shot from occurring from that ship, so the arquitens can't actually use advanced Gunnery.

As for the ISD, the "cannot" on gunnery team (upgrade card) beats the "can" on the objective card. So it ALSO can't get the full benefit from it.

Can anyone explain this better than me? @Drasnighta, is this the right wording?

What about battle reports? Is it useful watching/reading them? Learning tactics?

Just now, geek19 said:

His Red objective.

As for the ISD, the "cannot" on gunnery team (upgrade card) beats the "can" on the objective card. So it ALSO can't get the full benefit from it.

Thanks! Got it! I was looking for upgrade cards...

Just now, Noosh said:

If you lack the skill and experience to Doge it, force it to fire at what you want and bring fast moving pain to the sides

Much ISD. Such hull. Wow.

Just now, geek19 said:

Much ISD. Such hull. Wow.

Well I did say it wouldn't be a popular idea.

3 minutes ago, Gordon Freemann said:

What about battle reports? Is it useful watching/reading them? Learning tactics?

Yes, very much so.

25 minutes ago, Gordon Freemann said:

As a very serious question: How do I stay out of the front arc of the ISD? He normally starts in the center (because he wants to get into my face).

6 minutes ago, Noosh said:

Well I have an idea it won't be popular. If you can't avoid it, meet it head on.

Allow me to elaborate ISD front is a real pain. If you lack the skill and experience to Doge it, force it to fire at what you want and bring fast moving pain to the sides. The liberty is probably the best way to go about this strong front shield and good frontal fire.

If he always sets the ISD in the very center of the table and turns into your ships try splitting them up wide. He can only turn one way. Either he turns into the Liberty and you come in behind him with the rest of your fleet, or he turns towards your small ships and gets the Liberty behind him which is pretty bad news even for Star Destroyer.

10 minutes ago, geek19 said:

His Red objective. In the list you posted, the chosen red one is advanced gunnery.

If he equips it onto any of his ships, it will not actually work by the wording of the card.

Slaved turrets prevents a second shot from occurring from that ship, so the arquitens can't actually use advanced Gunnery.

As for the ISD, the "cannot" on gunnery team (upgrade card) beats the "can" on the objective card. So it ALSO can't get the full benefit from it.

Can anyone explain this better than me? @Drasnighta, is this the right wording?

You got it right.

”cannot” on upgrade cards is considered absolute.

That is why advanced gunnery and slaved turrets does not work.

Furthermore, the advice and faq we were given essentially gives the objective card the same weight as an upgrade, so the cannot on it overrides the gunnery team upgrade “can”.

Simple, Rebels that are not eliminated by their ships exploding, are then captured and interrogated by the Imperial ISB. Then if any survive that, the traitors are shipped to the Kessel spice mines or one of the other Imperial detention facilities.

14 minutes ago, Moore1980 said:

Simple, Rebels that are not eliminated by their ships exploding, are then captured and interrogated by the Imperial ISB. Then if any survive that, the traitors are shipped to the Kessel spice mines or one of the other Imperial detention facilities.

You forgot ones who become trusted members of design teams and place cataclysmic flaws in reactor modules do that any direct hit will make the whole system go up..,

1 hour ago, Drasnighta said:

You forgot ones who become trusted members of design teams and place cataclysmic flaws in reactor modules do that any direct hit will make the whole system go up..,

Boom. I think dras wins the day.

2 hours ago, hufflazon said:

If he always sets the ISD in the very center of the table and turns into your ships try splitting them up wide. He can only turn one way. Either he turns into the Liberty and you come in behind him with the rest of your fleet, or he turns towards your small ships and gets the Liberty behind him which is pretty bad news even for Star Destroyer.

Yes that's very much the idea. Command of the center of the map is all well and good, but if played against well can leave you extremely vunerable. In most cases player will take the bait one way or another. The attempt to be decisive against one part of the attack is your best hope to not get crushed in a pincer. If you can anticipate that your opponent can leave himself wide open.