3 minutes ago, 2P51 said:

Yes, but only if you have a really good Blast rating. The damage is equal to that, so if your Knowledge in this case is 1, your rating is 1, and the damage is 1.

Neat, that's why Leoric of the book hast 4 in so many qualities due to his Lore 4.

as I read the magic system on Genesys, I had move quickly friday night to get to Miniature Market to pick my copy up. But there is another way to add Effects and that is using Magic Implement with your spell which is cool. I would thing somewhere down the line there will be Magic talents added from Setting books or others will make a list of Magic talents...

6 minutes ago, GroggyGolem said:

I'm not so keen on a magic system that involves random chance beyond just whether you hit or not. I'll probably remove the advantage cost in certain settings. I think an increased difficulty for effects and 2 strain per attack is cost enough.

Reason being I've ran star wars for 2 years now and players have a huge aversion to the auto-fire rules. I had players that never really got into it because they didn't like all the costs and I had players that avoided trying to affect multiple targets with the Move power because it required not just force points but also the auto-fire rules.

Might wanna re-think that. Let me read it back to you in Player-ese, I'm fluent......We can carry an inexhaustible supply of grenades, and the GM is going to make the effects occur every time.....

Generating a couple Advantages or a Triumph on a roll, particularly for an advanced character, is no big deal. Plus as the wizard advances since he can activate all the effects he wants to without using any results, the 2 Strain cost in essentially rendered meaningless since there will always be extra Advantages now to heal that with every casting.

4 minutes ago, gilbur said:

as I read the magic system on Genesys, I had move quickly friday night to get to Miniature Market to pick my copy up. But there is another way to add Effects and that is using Magic Implement with your spell which is cool. I would thing somewhere down the line there will be Magic talents added from Setting books or others will make a list of Magic talents...

I'm sure in the setting books they will add relevant Talents involving the genre specific mechanics. For example in my quick read through I see nothing for healing robot characters.

4 minutes ago, 2P51 said:

Might wanna re-think that. Let me read it back to you in Player-ese, I'm fluent......We can carry an inexhaustible supply of grenades, and the GM is going to make the effects occur every time.....

Generating a couple Advantages or a Triumph on a roll, particularly for an advanced character, is no big deal. Plus as the wizard advances since he can activate all the effects he wants to without using any results, the 2 Strain cost in essentially rendered meaningless since there will always be extra Advantages now to heal that with every casting.

I appreciate your concern. I don't plan on using the fantasy setting, I plan to use the magic system for a modern day supers setting (x-men) and to be honest, a hero who can control fire but only sometimes make explosions or only sometimes cause things to burn is a very inconsistent mutant.

So basically, I do what I want.

1 hour ago, DarthDude said:

No advantages needed beyond the increased difficulty for effects.

Example from the Terrinoth adventure:

So thats a standard attack with 1 purple. Two effects with each one adding one puple: 1 purple for deadly and 1 for blast.

No advantages needed at all.

EDIT: It disappoints me the more I read about GeneSys. I am not a fan of what I’ve seen of magic and superpowers. No biggie if I don’t dive in (I still may). I have a ton of other games.

3 minutes ago, GroggyGolem said:

I appreciate your concern. I don't plan on using the fantasy setting, I plan to use the magic system for a modern day supers setting (x-men) and to be honest, a hero who can control fire but only sometimes make explosions or only sometimes cause things to burn is a very inconsistent mutant.

So basically, I do what I want.

Didn't say you couldn't.

1 minute ago, Alderaan Crumbs said:

Thank goodness! If you needed to increase the difficulty and get Advantages, that would **** near be a no-buy for me. Great to see that’s not the case.

It is the case. The spell only gives "Blast 4," but it does not trigger the effects. If it did, it would say "and deals 4 damage to every other character in engaged range."

Just now, Swordbreaker said:

It is the case. The spell only gives "Blast 4," but it does not trigger the effects. If it did, it would say "and deals 4 damage to every other character in engaged range."

Yeah, I read further. I saw the initial misunderstanding and was excited. Now...not so much.

Now everyone needs to remember this is a toolkit for your game as it helps you come up with stuff you can do in your game and you can alternate stuff as long as you are the GM or you have GM approval to do that with the game. The idea of the book was to Use the Narrative Dice for any game now, just sit down and think how you would convert over and do it... IT is After all your game and as long as you and your players are having fun who cares how thinks happen...

I guess there are magical talents needed.

I rolled 10 times twice with the FFG Genesys dice app simulating an experienced char with Intellect 5 and magic(arcana) 5 tryingb adding a blue die for aiming to cast a fireball at medium range (difficulty 4 and ^^ for blast and another ^^ for burn or appropriate triumphs) and I only succeeded once every 10 rolls. I honestly expected a higher rate of success for a highly competent character with maximum skill and attribute.

And aiming only for blast (the original D&D 3rd level spell actually has no fire effect per se) still had just a chance of 50% success. max in 3 times 10 rolls. I could've been just very unlucky, though.

I just rolled 10 x twice and succeeded in some way on every single roll with that dice pool. I either at the very least hit the target and/or activated Blast.

YYYYYBPPPP.

8 minutes ago, 2P51 said:

I just rolled 10 x twice and succeeded in some way on every single roll with that dice pool. I either at the very least hit the target and/or activated Blast.

YYYYYBPPPP.

I just applied the tier 5 talent Master to magic(arcana) lowering the check by two purple but costing 4 strain. So rolling YYYYYBPP, I succeded nearly every time, even able to regain some strain in the process. I guess Master is the talent to go, when purchasing tier 5 talents for a magician.

I don't know how you failed as much as you did.

I just rolled 10 real dice and got a hit, blast, and/or hit/blast, on 9 of the 10. Only 1 was a complete fail and even that gave me 2 Advantages for Strain recovery or assisting allies.

Using an array of YYGGPPPP, I rolled 20 times and got the following

Failure: 4 times

Failure with at least ^^: 3 times

Succeed: 9 times

Succeed with at least ^^: 4 times.

So out of the 20 rolls, I, in some fashion, managed to damage my opponent 16/20

If I would have used a Magic Implement, it would have higher, I suppose.

However , the sample size was much too small to get any real meaningful data. And I just realized that I didn't keep track of threats.

1 minute ago, DarthDude said:

I just applied the tier 5 talent Master to magic(arcana) lowering the check by two purple but costing 4 strain. So rolling YYYYYBPP, I succeded nearly every time, even able to regain some strain in the process. I guess Master is the talent to go, when purchasing tier 5 talents for a magician.

I think implements will be the best tool for making magic rolls easier. They shouldn't be as powerful as using the Master talent, but I think it will be important to give a good implement to your mages in a high magic system to give them the ability to do cool stuff at lower skill levels then you're testing.

I imagine it will take some seasoning-to-taste until a fantasy sourcebook comes out, but I don't think its as dire as your number-crunching is making you believe.

The probabilities on the dice are weighted to a positive outcome in a 1 for 1 ratio. So as a general rule minus the math, if you are rolling 6 positive dice and 4 negative you should have a high % of positive outcomes, particularly with Blast as you don't even need to succeed on the check itself to use it.

For a dedicated fantasy setting, I can't see how they would not include magic-related talents. Giving boost dice, ignoring one (or more) difficulty upgrade(s), etc. H´êll, if you look at my Critique My Talents thread, we're discussing this very thing.

Based on that cast results table I can see a Talent for ignoring a Despair result once and encounter or session. Those consequences are harsh.

Rerolling those 20 rolls using the same mage (YYgg) casting the fireball (PPPP) while aiming (B) and using a staff (-p), nets: YYGGBPPP.

Failure: 1 times

Failure with at least ^^/T: 2 times

Success: 10 times

Success with at least ^^/T: 7 times.

Aiming with a staff = VERY helpful!

The need to trigger using ^^ is almost like having Saving Throws.

Don't know if this is too far off the main topic, and I apologize if it is.

I'm from a Shadowrun background, and I plan to implement something closer to SR Drain using the Qualities system spelled out in the Genesys book. Adding Qualities will add difficulty dice as described, but rather than spending ^'s to activate the qualities the caster chooses whether to activate them before rolling. Choosing to activate qualities adds Strain to the spellcasting equal to the Quality's ^ cost, and that Strain can be mitigated with ^ from the casting roll. This way, there's less variability on whether the Quality will happen, but choosing to cast Fireball rather than Firebolt means the caster is channeling more dangerous magical energy and is likely to take more Strain as a result. Throw too big a spell, and whether it succeeds or not you may knock yourself unconscious from the effort.

Again, I apologize if this is too far afield of the original question as I realize it's outside the RAW.

5 minutes ago, Mercutio3 said:

... I apologize if this is too far afield of the original question as I realize it's outside the RAW.

I'm not sure how meaningful it is to define things by "inside/outside RAW".

The RAW is a compass, not a map, really.

7 minutes ago, Mercutio3 said:

Don't know if this is too far off the main topic, and I apologize if it is.

I'm from a Shadowrun background, and I plan to implement something closer to SR Drain using the Qualities system spelled out in the Genesys book. Adding Qualities will add difficulty dice as described, but rather than spending ^'s to activate the qualities the caster chooses whether to activate them before rolling. Choosing to activate qualities adds Strain to the spellcasting equal to the Quality's ^ cost, and that Strain can be mitigated with ^ from the casting roll. This way, there's less variability on whether the Quality will happen, but choosing to cast Fireball rather than Firebolt means the caster is channeling more dangerous magical energy and is likely to take more Strain as a result. Throw too big a spell, and whether it succeeds or not you may knock yourself unconscious from the effort.

Again, I apologize if this is too far afield of the original question as I realize it's outside the RAW.

Well, that's a bit of a departure from the norm, but it could work.

I can't decide if it would be fun, just from thinking about it. I could see it working fine, but I could also see it being irritating with a strange roll causing your character to collapse. It would need full table buy-in. Definitely a very high-powered rule (in the first 2 rounds of combat before you knock yourself unconscious), so I'd keep that in mind when designing the rest of your setting.

9 hours ago, fjw70 said:

So do you need advantages to active the effects that are added by increasing the difficulty?

Yes, you are adding weapon qualities to the attack. Those weapon qualities are "Active" qualities, so you have to also roll the Advantage or Triumph required to activate those Active qualities. Adding Blast 4 and Vicious 4 to an attack, you get Vicious to any crit you roll because that's a Passive weapon quality. You still need to roll 2 advantage to get that Blast 4 to activate, because you're adding an Active weapon quality to an attack.

8 hours ago, DarthDude said:

What about an attack with two weapon qualities. Do I need 4 advantages to trigger both or 2 to trigger all who need 2 advantages? It would be hefty because increasing the difficulty to add qualities will lower the chances to generate advantages significantly an so the possibility to trigger qualities will be quite diminished.

Yes, if those qualities you're adding are Active Qualities like Blast, Burn, Stun, or Knockdown. Not if those qualities are passive like Pierce, Stun Damage, or Vicious.

So you need to be a pretty good spellcaster to be able to pull it off. Which is the point.

Can’t cast Fireball at 1st Level if I recall