4 hours ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Sigh, arcdodgers are just too polarising...but whenever they are too good is when the game is at its best.

Fixed.

29 minutes ago, Ailowynn said:

I think it could. EI Miranda is pretty much as good, since you can go through rocks and bump and still bomb.

I don’t think you use Clusters, though; I think you go back to Conner Nets. Kylo can’t Advanced Sensor if he doesn’t reveal a dial.

You can't bump or run over a rock and drop a bomb. You need to be able to perform an action before you get the free action from EI.

6 minutes ago, RunnerAZ said:

You can't bump or run over a rock and drop a bomb. You need to be able to perform an action before you get the free action from EI.

You can execute a maneuver, SLAM over an obstacle or into another ship, and then use EI to drop an action bomb, however, which is what I assume is being referred to here. Advanced SLAM required that the SLAM maneuver be executed without overlaps to drop the bomb.

10 minutes ago, kraedin said:

You can execute a maneuver, SLAM over an obstacle or into another ship, and then use EI to drop an action bomb, however, which is what I assume is being referred to here. Advanced SLAM required that the SLAM maneuver be executed without overlaps to drop the bomb.

EI specifies that the "Action" upgrade card is done as a FREE ACTION, which means you cannot be stressed. I also think that running over a rock or bumping makes you unable to perform an action.

JUDGE!?!?!?

2 minutes ago, RunnerAZ said:

EI specifies that the "Action" upgrade card is done as a FREE ACTION, which means you cannot be stressed. I also think that running over a rock or bumping makes you unable to perform an action.

JUDGE!?!?!?

You cannot be stressed, correct. Overlapping a ship or obstacle token has no effect on your ability to take actions per se , overlapping a ship or an asteroid causes you to skip your perform action step. Once you're SLAMing, you're already in your perform action step (and have performed your action), so that restriction doesn't have any effect on EI.

Can’t overlap a debris I guess, since you’d be stressed. But yeah, hitting a ship or obstacle just makes you skip your perform action step; a free action is not part of that step.

I love how everyone's plan for arc dodging Kylo is PS10 and 11, completely forgetting his ability to PS0 his opponents.

Given his defensive abilities, even a full on PS10+ Alpha list might not be able to kill him before he PS0s all his opponents and just arc dodges away again.

Advanced Sensors Kylo has the potential to be as bad as Whisper without Whisper's standard counters. Maybe Tactician Wookiees can handle him, maybe Asaaj, but best case we're looking at a vastly condensed meta come December 7.

You know, OL + a palpshuttle is pretty cheap. 45pts is a pretty solidly loaded Kylo.

Imperial Aces may just rise again.

1 hour ago, SEApocalypse said:

Fixed.

You've missed their point: When arcdodgers become prominent, turrets rise as their counter.

Turrets do pretty well against other turrets, too.

So you end up with everything being turrets, with the odd ace around keeping any of the joustier lists from rising to promience.

13 minutes ago, Reiver said:

You know, OL + a palpshuttle is pretty cheap. 45pts is a pretty solidly loaded Kylo.

Imperial Aces may just rise again.

Problem is that list hits like a wet noodle without Whisper.

46 minutes ago, MacchuWA said:

I love how everyone's plan for arc dodging Kylo is PS10 and 11, completely forgetting his ability to PS0 his opponents.

Given his defensive abilities, even a full on PS10+ Alpha list might not be able to kill him before he PS0s all his opponents and just arc dodges away again.

Advanced Sensors Kylo has the potential to be as bad as Whisper without Whisper's standard counters. Maybe Tactician Wookiees can handle him, maybe Asaaj, but best case we're looking at a vastly condensed meta come December 7.

Well, there are only a potential of two PS0 cards in your enemy's damage deck, so unless you are running against a two-ship list...

6 hours ago, gamblertuba said:

I'll take my four starvipers and sunny and we can roll off 11 v 12.

11 v 14! Bad at math today.

1 hour ago, Reiver said:

You've missed their point: When arcdodgers become prominent, turrets rise as their counter.

Turrets do pretty well against other turrets, too.

So you end up with everything being turrets, with the odd ace around keeping any of the joustier lists from rising to promience.

Turrets are also some of the best, if not THE best, arcdodgers

Good Lord it's wave 5 all over again

But yeah, depending on how much of a negative effect it has on the meta, it'll be time to take a good long look at primed thrustered sensors. Whether by blocking obstacles or stress, you just can't stop the silencer from re or prepositioning

I prefer any Silencer with FCS for additional mods or Threat Tracker. PTL/Debris Gambit, FCS, title, and Threat Tracker/Primed and Autothrusters is my most effective build.

6 hours ago, AllWingsStandyingBy said:

Time will tell, though I'm also not convinced that PS11 Kylo isn't going to be the go-to version...

PS11 Kylo, PS11 Vader, and Giant Bid are the three pilots I've been personally using.

Kylo at PS 11 won't be able to reposition as much.
He is countered HARD by bombs, stressbots, Autoblaster Turrets, RAC with Vader, **** even bumpmaster with Intelligence Agent can give him hard time.

Some people seems to whine just for the sake of it. Now you tell we won't have meta of jousters when not so long ago we had invasion of TIE Defenders and everyone hated it.
From those times typical jousting match ups looked like this - fly at each other, shoot, kturn, repeat ad nauseum.
Do you know why Silencer won't be as much problematic as Defenders or Jumpmasters? Because it got no white sloops and k-turns, got no evade action and it got "only" single 3 dice attack with primary weapon.
Meta of arc-dogders is the most interesting meta in my opinion - asteroid placement, mind games, attempts at blocking or sudden changes of movement direction, it all got place when Aces fight, it is walking on the razoredge. I love it.

Problem is that with advanced sensors, you can't even block these guys. Ever.

2 hours ago, MacchuWA said:

Given his defensive abilities, even a full on PS10+ Alpha list might not be able to kill him before he PS0s all his opponents and just arc dodges away again.

If he PS0‘ed 3 ships then he lost at least 3 hp. Which would be incredibly lucky, considering the lack of an evade action

(e: of course he can only do that to 2 ships, but the point stands - he will lose a lot to get there)

8 hours ago, Q10fanatic said:

So, I get to experience the joys of pre-nerf Whisper now?

Not really. In the current meta pre nerf Whisper isnt even close to as OP as he was when he got released. After this preview it's one of the rare ship that i cant predict how good it will be until i have a lot of playtime with. That means it looks like its balanced. Not obviouly OP (because of the cost) and not DOA either. Here the cost of the ship is really what's going to make or brake it. Can you build a strong enough squad with the remaining points?

Blackout might be the savior here. Hes 4 points cheaper than Kylo (thats a lot) can get a decent ps9 with VI and it's pilot ability seems superior. An expensive ship like that needs to be able to do some work offensively. He seems much more geared toward that. Much better it's end cost makes him a good partner for the usual RAC with the superior Kylo (crew) option.

8 hours ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

In other news, turrets even more mandatory?

Sigh, arcdodgers are just too polarising...but whenever they are too good is when the game is at its worst.

^^this

pro: some of the podcasts will stop whining, con: NPE for everyone else that doesn't NPE the Kylo player

Problem is he is only 3 red dice!

Quckdraw, Fenn Rau, Dengar (even Pure Sabacc); all roll a more potent attack (more dice or multiple attacks).

Not sure how he will fare..

Guys... Kylo won't be beaten by a 2 ship list. Yes, he is a beastly arc dodger at ps 9-10-11, with some supernice system + tech combos, and AT with the (second) best dial in the game... but that's not all he is.

You still don't want to hit him. You go PS 0 the first time you attack. Pair him with Colzet and you will never shoot again the second time you attack. Yeah, Dash might be able to fly around, keeping you at range and VI Han could work as a counter like he did with Whisper... you know, until they manage to hit you. And then what?

Kylo as a crew was a counter for many of these lists. Kylo as a pilot can dish out the same effect. So what's it gonna be? You attack Kylo first, maiming your own ships and let the other 50 something points worth of imperials kick your ***, (because taking down Kylo will still take some time) or you want to leave him alone and want to encounter him in the endgame?

None of those stand out as particularly good ideas to me.

I'm not too worried about Kylo. He is just another hard ship to kill like Miranda is and I take her down enough. A good pilot with a good list can take down anything.

1 minute ago, Kijaucey said:

I'm not too worried about Kylo. He is just another hard ship to kill like Miranda is and I take her down enough. A good pilot with a good list can take down anything.

Problem is when the 'good list' gets narrowed down to either very high PS or turrets, or worse, both. That just is not an enjoyable game.

I don't think the Silencer will be anywhere near as damaging as prenerf Whisper or Nym, but I also don't think it will improve the state of the game by much, mostly by hopefully boosting the weakest faction, not because it is an enjoyable ship to fly against.

Turrets and high PS are already prevalent. Plus, there is a lot more content in this game since whisper's release. So I am going to be positive and say things wont be so bad.

Now, I do think giving ions a little love would be nice for the game.

Alright, can anyone please explain to me why you insist on putting Primed Thrusters on PTL/Advs Kylo? There are so many great options for the tech slot that I find it utterly incomprehensible why you'd fill it with an anti-stress upgrade on a ship that clears it right after performing his actions. The only cases where PTs would be useful are:

1) next round after performing a red maneuver (or using PTL and NOT using AdvS) you really, really want to pre-position before you move - but if you do so you can only perform one action or you end up double stressing yourself,

2) next round after performing a red maneuver (or using PTL and NOT using AdvS) for some reason you decide not to clear stress and choose to perform a white maneuver, but want the ability to reposition anyway - with the same caveat as before,

3) you get stressed by an external source and want the ability to reposition.

All of the above are highly situational and if my experience with interceptors is any indication, you probably won't perform red maneuvers all that much anyway. External stressors are also range and/or arc dependent, so with good flying you should be able to avoid them. Either way, for 1 point more you can get advanced optics which is also an excellent safeguard against stress but additionally it improves your action economy by allowing you to bank a token - which makes them useful pretty much all the time, not just in a few fringe cases.

Is there something I'm missing here?