Hi

I'm a big Twilight fan and have played my fair share of third edition. Both classic and with SE expansion.

My first impression out of the box is that it all felt fresh and polished. Some unnecesary stuff have been removed like transfer actions and small exceptions like pds not firing through wormholes. Less exceptions makes it alot easier for new players, but might annoy veterans.

After 2 played games with 5 players in each I got some pros and cons

- All races felt uppdated, balanced and diverse thanks to race tech, notes, flagship and more. More playtroughs might show balance problems

- New agenda system works great IMO. I like that it starts only after mecatol have been taken.

- Streamlined too the point that new players understand more and play takes about one hour less.

- Components and artwork looks amazing.

- Strategy cards feel balanced, espechially imperial. I Love the fact that mecatol is more important in this version.

- New secret objectives being only one point, possible too complete in tactictian phase and possible to get more feels just right. Neither useless or must complete anymore.

- Public objectives having 2 revealed from start and a set number of turns before Imperium rex feels just right.

Cons

- No 8 player is a dissapointment for the price of the box

- Only enough hexes too complete the galaxy and no triple systems hurts varity and the galaxy building phase

- Trade feels so far a bit too weak and underused. (2nd game did see more trade though). Some race notes seem too powerful to give away.

- Shortage in command tokens without tech, not sure IF good it bad.

- No optional rules in rulebook.

- Few examples in rulebook.

- All stage 2 objectives feels like a doubled version of stage 1. Would have liked 2-3 Wild card objectives being worth 3 points. Espechially when playing too 14 points

- No sabotage runs!!!

It feels like they are saving some of the good stuff for a future expansion which would be fine if the box was cheaper.

Final thoughts is that some optional rules could be easily added from third edition in your possession. Like wormhole nexus, distant suns and leaders.

My score is 8.5/10. It needed some extra treat in the box to get a 9. I predict an expansion will make it a 9.5/10.

Less clunky, faster and fresher Tham third edition, but it lacks that one extra touch. Will play this over third edition.

12 minutes ago, jocke01 said:

No optional rules in rulebook.

I do have some concerns about the phrase "no optional rules", which I don't think is a fair phrase to use about 4th Ed.

The Optional Rules in 3rd Ed.....

1. Three, Four, and Five player games - Yes, this was an "optional rule" in 3rd, and it still exists in 4th. Might not be listed as an optional rule anymore, but still exists.

2. The Long War - Want to play to 14 instead of 10? Still in the Game

3. Age of Empire - While not in the Rulebook, its the easiest one to carry forward.

4. Distant Suns - Gone

5. Leaders - Gone

6. Sabotage Runs - Gone (Statistically it had 2% chance of success, the Fighter would have better success in actual combat)

So, "Less" or "Fewer" optional rules, I'd agree with. But it isn't "without any".

The Flagships & Racial Tech, which were both options in prior versions are now base game parts you don't play without.

Does it have any new optional rules? Yes it does.

We have a "Beginner Game" and an "Advanced Game". That's an option (might be a lame one, but it is an option). We might play without Promissary Notes for several games until everyone feels ready to add that to the game.

Basically, Options, as defined by 3rd Ed, do still exist. They might not be as many, or your favorite ones are missing (I'm in the missing Distant Suns group, and I might add them back after more game play), but they DO exist.

47 minutes ago, Vilnic said:

I do have some concerns about the phrase "no optional rules", which I don't think is a fair phrase to use about 4th Ed.

The Optional Rules in 3rd Ed.....

1. Three, Four, and Five player games - Yes, this was an "optional rule" in 3rd, and it still exists in 4th. Might not be listed as an optional rule anymore, but still exists.

2. The Long War - Want to play to 14 instead of 10? Still in the Game

3. Age of Empire - While not in the Rulebook, its the easiest one to carry forward.

4. Distant Suns - Gone

5. Leaders - Gone

6. Sabotage Runs - Gone (Statistically it had 2% chance of success, the Fighter would have better success in actual combat)

So, "Less" or "Fewer" optional rules, I'd agree with. But it isn't "without any".

The Flagships & Racial Tech, which were both options in prior versions are now base game parts you don't play without.

Does it have any new optional rules? Yes it does.

We have a "Beginner Game" and an "Advanced Game". That's an option (might be a lame one, but it is an option). We might play without Promissary Notes for several games until everyone feels ready to add that to the game.

Basically, Options, as defined by 3rd Ed, do still exist. They might not be as many, or your favorite ones are missing (I'm in the missing Distant Suns group, and I might add them back after more game play), but they DO exist.

True, but coming from third edition with expansions, they are almost non existing from such an expensive box.

I can agree that the definition should be few. Less than third core and way less than exp.

Yes sabotage runs haven't been succesful ever in My group, but it was fun and that one time it happens!. Easy to add like I mentioned, but I still prefer to have it in the box

You put Sabotage Runs in the wrong column.

You don't blow a fleet of fighters to do them, you do them when you have just a couple fighters who are going to be dead in one round of combat anyway. Then, if you get lucky, you have a chance to destroy your opponent's 12-resource ship (that he had to acquire technology to even build) for the price of half a resource. This is undoubtedly fun for the guy who got the 1-in-50 roll, but how about the guy who just lost his hard-earned War Sun (or worse yet, his starting Muatt fleet)? Booooooo.

29 minutes ago, MikeEvans said:

You put Sabotage Runs in the wrong column.

You don't blow a fleet of fighters to do them, you do them when you have just a couple fighters who are going to be dead in one round of combat anyway. Then, if you get lucky, you have a chance to destroy your opponent's 12-resource ship (that he had to acquire technology to even build) for the price of half a resource. This is undoubtedly fun for the guy who got the 1-in-50 roll, but how about the guy who just lost his hard-earned War Sun (or worse yet, his starting Muatt fleet)? Booooooo.

How fun is it for the empire when Luke does it. Still an awesome moment

Yeah, but the Empire was the bad guy. Perhaps that sad Muatt player was trying to liberate the galaxy from the evil Letnev oppressors!

I've also seen great propaganda describing how Luke was a horrendous mass murderer terrorist who killed over a million people in the blink of an eye.

38 minutes ago, MikeEvans said:

I've also seen great propaganda describing how Luke was a horrendous mass murderer terrorist who killed over a million people in the blink of an eye.

I mean, if Obi-Wan was still around, what kind of disturbance in the Force would he have felt when the Danger Egg blew up? Not as big as an entire planet, to be sure, but still sizeable, I imagine. What, do deaths not count if their on the wrong side?

That's apparently how it is according to politics. But I'm just messing around anyway!