What would happen if Veteran Instincts was changed to read: “Increas your pilot skill value by 2. You cannot equip this upgrade if your pilot skill is “8” or greater.”? Would this creat a space for aces to operate? How would this cap of PS change the game?

I would not chang adaptability to allow pilots with a printed value of 9 to get over a 7 with VI.

who actually cares if vader or quickdraw go to 11?

It’s not the 11 that I see as a problem it’s the PS 8 going to 10 with VI. This slight change would allow pilots like Vader to maintain the top pilot skill without using the EPT slot allowing the pilots that are supposed to be the best in the galaxy have the advantage.

3 minutes ago, TreebeardTheEnt said:

It’s not the 11 that I see as a problem it’s the PS 8 going to 10 with VI. This slight change would allow pilots like Vader to maintain the top pilot skill without using the EPT slot allowing the pilots that are supposed to be the best in the galaxy have the advantage.

And if vader wants the top PS he can go to 11... I'm really not seeing the problem with this.

I can’t say this enough. The trade off of shooting first through VI means you are losing a damage improving EPT. I would rather have a fully loaded Vader vs say ps 10 Han Solo because you can make Vader’s damage be more consistent.

31 minutes ago, Mackaywarrior said:

I can’t say this enough. The trade off of shooting first through VI means you are losing a damage improving EPT. I would rather have a fully loaded Vader vs say ps 10 Han Solo because you can make Vader’s damage be more consistent.

That's just it though - the trade off is not just shooting first. It's also moving last, which can completely deny your opponent shots, or gain you shots you otherwise wouldn't have had.

Then there's things like Target Lock range restrictions and ordnance...

Maybe if there was a way to rotate out upgrade cards (say wave 1 & 2 upgrade and classic core only) then VI won't be a thing anymore. Everyone will just have to use adaptability. Now since Ion cannon turret is found in wave 3 and proton torpedoes and are found in other waves they will still be in play. That does mean we will have to miss out on concussion missiles though, oh well.

Nevermind VI is also in Wave 9 and 10 (those waves seem to be producing the most problems for X-wing).

2 hours ago, TreebeardTheEnt said:

What would happen if Veteran Instincts was changed to read: “Increas your pilot skill value by 2. You cannot equip this upgrade if your pilot skill is “8” or greater.”? Would this creat a space for aces to operate? How would this cap of PS change the game?

I would not chang adaptability to allow pilots with a printed value of 9 to get over a 7 with VI.

Instead of wasting a point on an EPT, we'd waste a point on initiative bid instead.

Right now VI prevents an initiative race to the bottom because you can never outbid a PS11 unless you also have one yourself, which is not always possible. But introducing that hard ceiling at PS9 would most likely shift the PS war into an initiative war - which might have worse effects.

Personally I would prefer the initiative war though.

18 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Instead of wasting a point on an EPT, we'd waste a point on initiative bid instead.

Right now VI prevents an initiative race to the bottom because you can never outbid a PS11 unless you also have one yourself, which is not always possible. But introducing that hard ceiling at PS9 would most likely shift the PS war into an initiative war - which might have worse effects.

Personally I would prefer the initiative war though.

Scum lists prefer initiative war because they have some seriously underpriced ships but can’t really go above 9-10 without sacrificing too much (exception thweek)

Empire kind of prefers the PS war because they have Aces like Vader and Quickdraw who can do almost anything with their EPT, and while they would like something better they aren’t married to it.

Rebels don’t really care either way but weirdly they are the ones with the PS 10 Nym that is super effective which pushes the Empire into a PS war.

If PS is capped then initiative wins which is also a problem. Personally I think the only real solution is too actually rotate initiative. The whole bid for inititiave is pretty problematic because in some matches those 3pts win you the game. It would be better if the game was about flying and timing.

VI was an issue on Nym. Might still be, I’m not sure. Generally, though, I think it’s a good card to have in the game because of the way it complicates squad building. If 9 is the cap, the meta pretty quickly figures out which EPT choice is always optimal on your aces. QuickDraw always has Expertise. With VI, there’s some added complexity; now she has to at least choose between Expertise and VI.

Best idea i've heard yet was to make it limited.

ps9 cap will just create currently 2nd teir monsters we don't need, making them favorable because vi is point under costed to anyone with a good ability or that relies on ordnance

1 hour ago, GreenDragoon said:

Instead of wasting a point on an EPT, we'd waste a point on initiative bid instead.

Right now VI prevents an initiative race to the bottom because you can never outbid a PS11 unless you also have one yourself, which is not always possible. But introducing that hard ceiling at PS9 would most likely shift the PS war into an initiative war - which might have worse effects.

Personally I would prefer the initiative war though.

There is still Adaptability that would allow PS 9 pilots to get to 10, but no other pilots can since they are caped at PS 9.

3 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:

That's just it though - the trade off is not just shooting first. It's also moving last, which can completely deny your opponent shots, or gain you shots you otherwise wouldn't have had.

Then there's things like Target Lock range restrictions and ordnance...

This is the biggest problem with the VI PS wars. If they capped it at 9, Changed the text to add in the combat phase increase your PS by 2. As FTS says, Rolling or boosting out of arc is the big winner with high PS turrets like Han or Nym. I like high PS because I suck at flying more than 4 ships, some people may say more than 1 ship... but it's the re-positioning that is killing it atm in my mind.

How about a caveat of "You can only equip this card if you do not arm yourself with a secondary weapon"? This includes as well turrets. Makes your pilot more of an " Ace" then.

51 minutes ago, Herr Style said:

How about a caveat of "You can only equip this card if you do not arm yourself with a secondary weapon"? This includes as well turrets. Makes your pilot more of an " Ace" then.

You cannot shoot outside of your firing arc?

Small Ship Only?

During the activation phase you gain 2 Pilot Skill?

All of these could change the way it works in some regard. The last kind of kills Thweek as a meta choice but also stops the PS kill Wars because in firing everyone is back at 8-9.

I personally don’t mind VI, but I also ran two copies in my Nationals List. Did I want to? Not really, but PS 10 Nym (even after the nerf) was an issue and wasn’t the type of list I wanted to punt against.

Speaking of.... Should I go with VI PS 10 Poe or Intensity Poe at PS 8?

4 hours ago, Ralgon said:

Best idea i've heard yet was to make it limited.

I assume you mean unique, not limited.

I don’t really have a problem with VI, but I would not be opposed to this change. However, it wouldn’t have any effect on Nymiranda or Nymdengar (Nymgar? Denym? There just isn’t a great mash up here...)

16 minutes ago, Boba Rick said:

Speaking of.... Should I go with VI PS 10 Poe or Intensity Poe at PS 8?

Intensity Poe at PS9, obviously.

1 hour ago, Herowannabe said:

I assume you mean unique, not limited.

I don’t really have a problem with VI, but I would not be opposed to this change. However, it wouldn’t have any effect on Nymiranda or Nymdengar (Nymgar? Denym? There just isn’t a great mash up here...)

Intensity Poe at PS9, obviously.

Doh! yes i meant unique

nymdengar and nymranda are already starting to fall off metawing (albeit with small sample sizes yet)

It's still strong, but i don't think it has the teeth it did pre genius nerf. It now looks to be the age of the "triple loks", the wookies, and new age kanan, which may only get worse with wave 12.