3 minutes ago, MajorJuggler said:
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. In a meta with TIE Swarms (which will exist in Community Mod), then the lack of splash is a nerf. I still haven't tweaked the missile itself yet, just the condition.
I see. I would still say that a tweak to condition to prevent it from triggering before there is a chance to remove it is in order (as harpoon chains with autotrigger via chips/mangler/etc is one of the reasons harpoon alpha is so potent)
1 hour ago, PT106 said:That actually makes Harpoons better, not worse.
Hummmm.....
1 minute ago, MajorJuggler said:
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. In a meta with TIE Swarms (which will exist in Community Mod), then the lack of splash is a nerf. I still haven't tweaked the missile itself yet, just the condition.
Well.....I kinda agree MJ
I don't think Harpoons are going anywhere soon. If you recall the game developers talking up their design directions and thoughts in recent interviews they discussed the idea of harpoon missiles being one that has been a desire for quite some time. I think this secondary has some personal 'love' attached to it so it will be a hard one for the designers to nerf; that would be a bitter pill akin to TLT which had a similar loving discussion when the design was recalled. I wouldn't hold my breath; we're probably stuck with TLT and Harpoon until 2.0.
I don't really know why I went down this specific bunny trail, but I'm hearing lots of Harpoon rumblings, with laments.....but FFG has a lot of Guns for Hire to sell around here and the on-line stores seem like they are flush with them; Thweek simply isn't enough to move them, haha.
Its not the effect thats really the issue, its the 4die no TL spend 4cost COMBINED with the effect thats the issue.
Harpoons are literally the best of every world in terms of ordnance.
I saw the condition for it before i saw the weapon itself. Condition made me think it was a weak attack or a reliable but cheap weapon that did the whole "suffer 1 damage, cancel all dice" stuff for say 3pts (since its technically causing 2 damage to the target once it triggers and splashes). Saw the weapon and went WTF?! i was positive that was the wrong card at first and they forgot the "cancel all dice" text.
Its cost and danger if you cant auto-trigger it keeps it from being the random missile in a lot of lists but theres more that benefit from it than those that fear the potential backlash of it.
(also still dont get why a Harpoon is affiliated with a bomb....generally harpoons have a tether attached and/or are meant to maim the target heavily if it didnt outright kill them from where it hit)
10 minutes ago, PT106 said:I see. I would still say that a tweak to condition to prevent it from triggering before there is a chance to remove it is in order (as harpoon chains with autotrigger via chips/mangler/etc is one of the reasons harpoon alpha is so potent)
That's not a bad idea, I could make the condition state "The round after you receive this condition...". The drawback is that you would have to keep track of which conditions were from this turn, and which were from a previous turn. Sadly that is kind of a pain in the neck. I did already change "I'll Show You The Dark Side" to have a one round latency, but that's way simpler since you can only get the condition once. With a one round latency on harpooned, you would routinely get multiple conditions stacking. The extra hassle is probably not worth it, I can just balance the missile the rest of the way via the missile card itself. (whatever that ends up being)
23 minutes ago, clanofwolves said:I don't think Harpoons are going anywhere soon. If you recall the game developers talking up their design directions and thoughts in recent interviews they discussed the idea of harpoon missiles being one that has been a desire for quite some time. I think this secondary has some personal 'love' attached to it so it will be a hard one for the designers to nerf; that would be a bitter pill akin to TLT which had a similar loving discussion when the design was recalled. I wouldn't hold my breath; we're probably stuck with TLT and Harpoon until 2.0.
I don't really know why I went down this specific bunny trail, but I'm hearing lots of Harpoon rumblings, with laments.....but FFG has a lot of Guns for Hire to sell around here and the on-line stores seem like they are flush with them; Thweek simply isn't enough to move them, haha.
Oh, I certainly agree that in the stock game harpoons aren't getting changed anytime soon by FFG. Consistent power creep has become their business model for X-wing, intentional or not. I was just talking about Mod-Wing. The flip side is that if it's good enough to get nerfed for Mod-Wing, then it's probably pretty good in the stock game. So if these 22 point gunboats are basically just harpoon carriers, they may not be as viable in Mod-Wing in the same capacity once I nerf harpoons to where they "should be" to be balanced.
actually as consideration for your Mod-Wing i think of canging Harpoons to this:
this reduces the splash damage by 50% and the initial salvo isn´t literally going to produce 4 hits with a chance of over 95%.