Before I begin, I want to say Nym is excluded from this. Ok, here we go. The Scurrg bomber seemed pretty darn cool to me. It could deliver B wing firepower against ship at speed 3, it has the Y wings 6 hull points, the Y wings squadron armament (not a good one) and heavy (also not good). After a small study, I realized the Scurrg is overpriced. It cost 6 points more than the Y wing, which has everything the Scurrg has except the Scurrg has a Black/Blue battery, while the Y wing only had Black. One additional Blue die is not justification for a 6 point increase. What are your thoughts?

An additional blue die isn't worth 6 points.
Its worth less than that.

Because Grit costs something.

Just now, Drasnighta said:

An additional blue die isn't worth 6 points.
Its worth less than that.

Because Grit costs something.

DOH!! Lol, I completely forgot it had Grit! But still, it would have been nice if it had a little more power against squadrons.

People always forget about Grit. Such an underappreciated keyword.

People always forget about Grit. Such an underappreciated keyword.

Just now, Megatronrex said:

People always forget about Grit. Such an underappreciated keyword.

I don't like it, because of you're engaged with one squad, you're bound to be engaged with a second one. I've never found a use for it (granted, I don't fly Grit squadrons a lot).

I love Rebel squadrons. The Scurrg is the only one which I have removed all of my extra stands of. I keep just one for Nym.

I loved the idea: a slightly faster, more durable, and harder to stop Bwing. The practice was that just throwing the extra anti-squadron dice with the Bwing helped kill blockers faster. Trying to do an end run with the scurrgs didn’t work at speed 3. FCT made Bwings much easier to use

If if it had a third blue anti-squad, then I would see a fair argument either way for players bringing scurrgs or Bwings. Then you are looking at paying two points to gain heavy, grit, 1 hull, and 1 speed. 1 negative and the positives

1 minute ago, Church14 said:

I love Rebel squadrons. The Scurrg is the only one which I have removed all of my extra stands of. I keep just one for Nym.

I loved the idea: a slightly faster, more durable, and harder to stop Bwing. The practice was that just throwing the extra anti-squadron dice with the Bwing helped kill blockers faster. Trying to do an end run with the scurrgs didn’t work at speed 3. FCT made Bwings much easier to use

If if it had a third blue anti-squad, then I would see a fair argument either way for players bringing scurrgs or Bwings. Then you are looking at paying two points to gain heavy, grit, 1 hull, and 1 speed. 1 negative and the positives

100% agreed.

22 minutes ago, schmidty1701 said:

I don't like it, because of you're engaged with one squad, you're bound to be engaged with a second one. I've never found a use for it (granted, I don't fly Grit squadrons a lot).

I can't tell you how many times I've had people try to lock down Maarek Stele with a single squadron.

Back in wave 2, Scurggs were fairly legit, honestly. @geek19 did fine with some in his fleet at Adepticon in 2016. As the number of speed boost upgrades for Rebels increases, B-Wings become more appealing and Scurggs suffer in that comparison. I think they're still usable nowadays but my immediate knee-jerk reaction is "why not B-Wings with the support tech?"

Grit is underappreciated, though. Being able to shoot enemy engagers down to just one with your fighters then being able to peel out with your bombers can be very good. The problem is Intel has always overshadowed Grit, although there is some paradoxical synergy between the two.

4 minutes ago, Snipafist said:

Back in wave 2, Scurggs were fairly legit, honestly. @geek19 did fine with some in his fleet at Adepticon in 2016. As the number of speed boost upgrades for Rebels increases, B-Wings become more appealing and Scurggs suffer in that comparison. I think they're still usable nowadays but my immediate knee-jerk reaction is "why not B-Wings with the support tech?"

Grit is underappreciated, though. Being able to shoot enemy engagers down to just one with your fighters then being able to peel out with your bombers can be very good. The problem is Intel has always overshadowed Grit, although there is some paradoxical synergy between the two.

I keep hearing Scurrgs and E-wings go good together... But then you lack escort. My X-wings love jumping in front of blue dice meant for Ten Numb or Nym or Dagger Squadron and all.

Me, I do! I love the Scurrg - I often joke that I'm the only one , but I do.

B-Wing dice, X-Wing speed, a bit more expensive but not really once you've paid for FC/FCT or whatever, and I find Grit really useful (spread two Scurrgs out and it takes four fighters to tie them up!) Less anti-squadron dice, but that's not what I bring bombers for anyways.

I tend to take Scurrgs when I'm running a fleet that's gone 134 points into bombing, but also has a combat ship or two, and so appreciates the lessened need for Intel/Escort; and has less room for speed tech, fewer squadron commands, and needs the extra speed (to jump on a target my ships have bloodied).

Personally, I rank the Scurrg sort of similar to the YT-2400 - outshined by other options in heavily synergistic bomber fleets (eg, Pelta/Yavaris/3 flotilla), but with a niche in slightly different archetypes. If we were in the old days, I'd probably say something like "Consider Scurrg-ing if you have 0-1 BCCs, don't Scurrg if you have 2+" as the sort of list I do/don't use it in.

.

I've not used a lot of rebel squadrons recently, but I do like the Scurrg and it's on my list to revisit soon. The issue it runs into is its weird synergy/anti-synergy with Yavaris compared to the B-wing. Heavy ends up hurting it in terms of flexibility, while grit doesn't help much when you have access to FCT for movement anyway and it doesn't apply for FCT. So I don't think it's quite a drop-in replacement for the B-wing in a classic B-wing build. I can't say I know what it's ideal fleet does look like, but I do think there's still a role out there for it.

I think one problem is that the B-wing should have also been heavy.

If it were, the decision of which to use would be far more difficult.

I use them in my large 900-point fleet/300 point fighter wing battles, but otherwise i agree with everyone else. Just a tad too expensive when compared to other choices.

I like them with hera n yvaris... You can hold em back until squad phase and then launch em in at speed 3 rogue during squad phase... Then you can double tap with yvaris next turn...

22 minutes ago, SkyCake said:

I like them with hera n yvaris... You can hold em back until squad phase and then launch em in at speed 3 rogue during squad phase... Then you can double tap with yvaris next turn...

I've been trying to find a good way to make this work, and I'm struggling. How do you get them clear in the squadron phase for that rogue attack? Just hold Intel back and push the rogues after ship combat is joined? Stack a bunch of Z-95's to get squadron-phase activation advantage? A pinning A-wing screen?

I really love the idea but I'm having a hard time making it work in the listing phase because Hera+2 Scurrgs is just such a meaty chunk of your squadron budget.

14 minutes ago, Ardaedhel said:

I've been trying to find a good way to make this work, and I'm struggling. How do you get them clear in the squadron phase for that rogue attack? Just hold Intel back and push the rogues after ship combat is joined? Stack a bunch of Z-95's to get squadron-phase activation advantage? A pinning A-wing screen?

I really love the idea but I'm having a hard time making it work in the listing phase because Hera+2 Scurrgs is just such a meaty chunk of your squadron budget.

Spread em out distance wise and make them overcommit to stop Grit. Intel where needed.

7 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Spread em out distance wise and make them overcommit to stop Grit. Intel where needed.

I underestimate Grit but i think a large part of that is that i have a dedication to winning the squad war. I seldom drop less than 130 on squads so the idea that "you can only easily hold up one" doesn't really seem like a selling point, I plan on killing one and then moving to the second. A-wing's are the things that irk me the most to that plan but even then they aren't "super" terrible. I'm pretty in love with sloane right now after fielding rebels to tournaments the first 8ish months i was playing.

25 minutes ago, dominosfleet said:

I underestimate Grit but i think a large part of that is that i have a dedication to winning the squad war. I seldom drop less than 130 on squads so the idea that "you can only easily hold up one" doesn't really seem like a selling point, I plan on killing one and then moving to the second. A-wing's are the things that irk me the most to that plan but even then they aren't "super" terrible. I'm pretty in love with sloane right now after fielding rebels to tournaments the first 8ish months i was playing.

Thing is, Skycake is doing the 134 just he same. If you want to win the squad game, you have to double and triple up somewhere, leaving somewhere exposed.

2 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Thing is, Skycake is doing the 134 just he same. If you want to win the squad game, you have to double and triple up somewhere, leaving somewhere exposed.

gawd i need to be exposed to more players. I love the people i play with around here but larger sample sizes = better games on my part. I felt a bit stomped (though by excellent people, seriously each of them was great) at gencon so I'm hoping to have a better showing at regionals.

Yeah Grit and Intel have some paradoxical synergy. If you overcommit to pinning down the Grit squads, you're a big huge clump target for Intel. If you undercommit, it's easy for Grit to slip right past you, especially with some fighter support to take out one of a pair of engagers (X-Wings and Scurggs are BFFs for basically the same reason X-Wings and Y-Wings are BFFs - Scurggs are basically elite Y-Wings).

The problem is making it all come together for the points investment while still having enough everything. Scurggs are horrible at dogfighting for their cost, where B-Wings can make do if necessary.

I would use Scurrg more, actually ever, if they didn't have Heavy. Heavy is a huge liability and kills this squad for me, especially since it has 1 less anti-squad than the cheaper B-Wing. B-wing all the way. Scurrg shouldn't have had Heavy or should have 2 blue + 1 red AS.

60% increase over ay wing for a grit and a blue die... No thanks. A lot of people compare them to b wings which I think is the incorrect comparison. They have far more in common with y wings.