I've heard more than a few rumblings discussing the strength of Scurrg or Gunboat alpha strikes. If either of those gain traction, there's quite a bit of use for a ship that can avoide the initial shots and then get to work at close range. It certainly plays into the arc dodger's strengths more than the JM5k did.
Based on @phild0 's argument that arc dodgers are really pushed put by ships that get a free turn-around, a Defender resurgence might complicate the resurgence of the arc dodger.
You might not get a pure 3 arc dodging ship list to work, for various reasons as mentioned above.
But you might see Soontir, Inky or Carnor pop into a 3 ship list alongside a HLC/Missile Gunboat and an Expertise Quickdraw (for example) the Gunboat packs too big a punch to be ignored, allowing your ace to survive to the mid/late game where it’s really going to shine.
I’m sure we’ll see Fen Rau with PTL pop up as well - he’s a monster.
52 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:I meant outside of Fel.
Barrel Roll + Focus is something everything with Barrel Roll und Focus on the Action bar can do with PTL.
The good aces like Fel just can do "more" and are usually anti-synergistic with intensity, though Vader actually might be not too shabby with Intensity… and Poe obviously is the guy the card was made for.
Evade + Target Lock (Inquisitor)
or
Lonewolf or Predator + Focus or Evade (Vader)
or
Evade + Focus (Ryad, Jake Farrell)
or
…
17 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:Barrel Roll + Focus is something everything with Barrel Roll und Focus on the Action bar can do with PTL.
The good aces like Fel just can do "more" and are usually anti-synergistic with intensity, though Vader actually might be not too shabby with Intensity… and Poe obviously is the guy the card was made for.
Evade + Target Lock (Inquisitor)
or
Lonewolf or Predator + Focus or Evade (Vader)
or
Evade + Focus (Ryad, Jake Farrell)
or
…
And all of those tokens are utterly useless while in the bullseye arc. Have fun stacking useless tokens while I barrel roll and then get to actually use my focus token, without the stress. (Unless I’m flying fel or keyan, obviously then I’m taking PTL).
3 hours ago, FlyingAnchors said:And all of those tokens are utterly useless while in the bullseye arc. Have fun stacking useless tokens while I barrel roll and then get to actually use my focus token, without the stress. (Unless I’m flying fel or keyan, obviously then I’m taking PTL).
All of those tokens you KEEP after doing a barrel roll to get out of the bullseye arc ;-)
You have PTL, so you can do that barrel roll, do one defensive action AND trigger your special ability for action economy.
4 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:All of those tokens you KEEP after doing a barrel roll to get out of the bullseye arc ;-)
You have PTL, so you can do that barrel roll, do one defensive action AND trigger your special ability for action economy.
Unless your jake farrel, please explain in your above example after taking an evade and focus and stress you somehow gain a miraculous 3rd action? 
9 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:Unless your jake farrel, please explain in your above example after taking an evade and focus and stress you somehow gain a miraculous 3rd action?
9 minutes ago, hawk32 said:
Useless when you’re still in the bullseye arc. You need to move out of it to use your tok- oh what does it matter anyway, jamming Rhos are gonna be the new hotness when they drop so you won’t have tokens anyway.
1 minute ago, FlyingAnchors said:Useless when you’re still in the bullseye arc. You need to move out of it to use your tok- oh what does it matter anyway, jamming Rhos are gonna be the new hotness when they drop so you won’t have tokens anyway.
It'd take some real skill to barrel roll and still be in that arc.
8 minutes ago, hawk32 said:It'd take some real skill to barrel roll and still be in that arc.
Well you took PTL and pilot whose name I don’t remember has VI at ps 10 so there going to catch you in it.
Why no one seems to grasp the basic concept that if you don’t have initiative at PS 10 or at PS 11 you can stack as many tokens as you want until they reach the models height and when you’re caught in that arc they are useless. So it would appear intensity is a nice alternative that lets you post move out of the bullseye arc AND grant you a token you can actually use. Obviously Fel still wants PTL but not every Ps 9 ace wants a stress token every round, wedge for example.
Edited by FlyingAnchors1 minute ago, FlyingAnchors said:Well you took PTL and pilot whose name I don’t remember has VI at ps 10 so there going to catch you in it.
Why no one seems to grasp the basic concept that if you don’t have initiative at PS 10 or at PS 11 you can stack as many tokens as you want until they reach the models height and when you’re caught in that arc they are useless. So it would appear intensity is a nice alternative that lets you post move out of the bullseye arc AND grant you a token you can actually use.
Taking intesity doesn't solve your dilemma of moving before PS10/11. Soontir gives you BR, focus, evade. Also, intensity gives you a token you can't use, if you wan't to actually be able to flip intensity back over.
51 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:Unless your jake farrel, please explain in your above example after taking an evade and focus and stress you somehow gain a miraculous 3rd action?
I literally wrote after each dice modification option what pilots can get it.
Inquisitor and TIE Adv. Prototypes in general get still evade + target lock. Vader goes with lonewolf + focus or Evade (does not need PTL even), Soontir and Jake are finally on you list too, heck even OL still has her evade token ready to use. Even someone öike Carnor should be better of with PTL. Boosting out of bullseye and taking a stress and focus while denying focus is better than not taking stress and not being able to do it next turn agaib.
All of them are better of with not using Intensity even when some will will pay their extra action with stress.
I think Arc Dodgers will make a comeback, once the Ordinance carriers have driven the bomb carriers out of the meta.
Gunboats, and similar ships, can alpha strike the usual Bomb carriers off the board fairly trivially. Which will lead to arc dodgers not having their natural enemies around. And Arc Dodgers themselves are good against these ordinance carriers which are reliant on their arcs.
So yeah, Arc Dodgers will make a comeback and will be dependent on the Ordinance carriers being around to kill off the bomb carriers.
On 11/4/2017 at 11:41 AM, Biophysical said:Based on @phild0 's argument that arc dodgers are really pushed put by ships that get a free turn-around, a Defender resurgence might complicate the resurgence of the arc dodger.
The Defender v traditional ace matchup was always weird. Everybody had easy access to focus + evade (also Palpatine), nobody had a lot of firepower. If you could get a bunch of shots on the same target, great, but between the K turns and the dodging you probably couldn't. So mostly the shots just bounced off, and Defenders in particular could soak the damage that bled through regardless.
People keep using the term arc dodgers.....
What exactly are people dodging?
Do yall mean ships that can take autothrusters?
Or just stuff that can dodge missiles?
Or does arc dodger also mean Dash and RAC?
Or are we really just talking about 4 double reposition ships? Vader, Fenn, Soontir, and Whisper?
Or are we really only talking about Palp Soontir since he can easily tank 10 dice in one round slightly better than a PS1 Wookie with Re-enforce?
Edited by Boom OwlI think Arc Dodger means the following,
Arc Dodger: Any ship which typically relies on out maneuvering it's target. Typically using repositioning and high pilot skill to avoid attacks entirely OR get into a position where autothrusters can be used to avoid damage. Typically ships are quite fragile and have moderate damage output, relying on slowly whittling their targets to death.
One aspect that frequently, but not entirely overlaps with Arc Dodging is speed, the ability to get from one place on the board to another place.
Fel and Vader for example, are very strong in a flanking position because they can approach on a flank and are so fast that they can more easily time their maneuver so that they meet the opposing ships at the same time as your main body. The Inqusitor, in contrast, can't do this as well because his stress clearing moves are mostly slow.
Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that the ability to deploy wide from the main force and still engage at will is a pretty powerful ability in many arc dodgers that isn't directly related to arc dodging.
Technical you have described flankers and not arc dodgers, even when many aces are flankers as well. Ryad for example is not an arc dodger at all, but she is a perfect flanker. She can engage and disengage without trouble and is great at engaging as well. Arc dodging at the other hand? You nearly always know where she will land and she has not the PS either for it.
Edited by SEApocalypse8 hours ago, Boom Owl said:People keep using the term arc dodgers.....
What exactly are people dodging?
Do yall mean ships that can take autothrusters?
Or just stuff that can dodge missiles?
Or does arc dodger also mean Dash and RAC?
Or are we really just talking about 4 double reposition ships? Vader, Fenn, Soontir, and Whisper?
Or are we really only talking about Palp Soontir since he can easily tank 10 dice in one round slightly better than a PS1 Wookie with Re-enforce?
I define an arc dodger as a ship that uses PTL and has Boost and barrel roll.
17 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:Technical you have described flankers and not arc dodgers, even when many aces are flankers as well. Ryad for example is not an arc dodger at all, but she is a perfect flanker. She can engage and disengage without trouble and is great at engaging as well. Arc dodging at the other hand? You nearly always know where she will land and she has not the PS either for it.
I mean, I explicitly said it was different from arc dodging.
Just now, Biophysical said:I mean, I explicitly said it was different from arc dodging.
And I grandiosely ignored it not once, but twice. Just take it as adding an example to your correct post. 