Can't wait to piercing strike with oathsworn... Screw your death knights, screw your carrion worms, screw your heroes.

I doubt piercing strike would be this effective. You can take moment of inspiration that would do roughly similar damage against armor 3+ targets but still work against infantry. The only benefit is the option of discarding this card that can score last wound on a hero. It is not bad, but I doubt it will be widely used.

2 hours ago, el peludo said:

I doubt piercing strike would be this effective. You can take moment of inspiration that would do roughly similar damage against armor 3+ targets but still work against infantry. The only benefit is the option of discarding this card that can score last wound on a hero. It is not bad, but I doubt it will be widely used.

Moment of inspiration is melee only.

-- oh, you were talking about on oathsworn, my bad...

he was referring to on oaths though since that was brought up.

Lets math!

Oaths roll 2R1B. Best case scenario = 6 hits w/ modifier dial, 7 with Temp Steel (different slot so you can have both). 3 threat = 21 damage. (chart is assuming you already reduced the armor)
Against 2 armor = 10 wounds
Against 3 armor = 7 wounds
Against 4 armor = 5 wounds
Against 5 armor = 4 wounds

With Inspiration, maximum damage is now 9 hits or 27 damage.
Against 3 armor = 9 wounds
Against 4 armor = 6 wounds (and just shy of a 7th)
Against 5 armor = 5 wounds
Against 6 armor = 4 wounds

Since we are talking about reducing to 2 armor i left that out with MoI math and left out the 6 armor for PS

Literally translates to 1 more wound than usual if you just use it to dink their armor down to a minimum of 2. Except for 5 armor targets, which right now is just Hawthorne and Golems i think.

So, imo, its more of a preference than actually better.
Piercing Strikes: 3pts, adds damage to 3+ armor targets without needing additional die rolling, can be discarded to add a mortal strike instead
Moment of Inspiration: 5pts, adds a die roll to all attacks its used (melee only but were talking oaths here), subject to further RNG

I think Piercing Strikes would be more stable damage but except for Siege/Heroes/DKs it wont even be a factor unless you just burn it outright for the mortal strike. Which i dont see being a valid strat except on the Crossbowmen that already got a surge mortal strike too. Against armor2 targets the 9 hits did 13 wounds, even if you add the mortal strike to the 10 wounds of the non-MoI attack thats still 2 less wounds AND you just lost it forever.

im not mathing probability because i suck at that lol

To expound a bit less maximum, as I'm curious, to what @Vineheart01 did. Expected dmg for red- .75, blue .5, whiten .75ish (ms counts for something, but what?)

2R1B - ~2 hits.

Add a white you get 2.75

Threat 1 isn't worth looking at, but threat is a bit important as a hit goes farther then. (Round partials either way, maybe round white up, who cares)

We are looking at

Threat 2 - 4 or 5.5

Threat 3 - 6 or 7.25

Threat 4 - 8 or 9

Now the next part is where we really want a table. (Switching to compy mode)

So, below shows MOSTLY rounding up on the white die, and yes MoI edges out piercing strike at 1-2 armour, no surprise as the one effect is literally doing nothing. Other than that though, as piercing effectively just moves you 1 row up in wounds (row 1 and 2 excluded), the results are identical. So it comes down to, how badly do you need those 2 points, and how much can you squeeze out of a guaranteed mortal strike, also not included.

edit: Also if someone who can actually stats can adjust for rerolls, be my guest, I never liked stats, and the stats prof hated us.

Which goes towards the scenario i mentioned where you would discard it for the mortal strike: your crossbowmen already got their surge. If they got their surge they probably have less actual hits as a result. Against higher armor its quite possible the extra hits didnt pen the armor even with the reduction. Unlikely, but possible

Even on crossbowmen i dont see myself discarding it. Since its an Or, usually the reduced armor would cause 1 more wound anyway. Usually. Killing off a hero after rolling ONLY surges and using it on their last hp would be about it imo.
Remember, a discarded upgrade also doesnt net you points. So its not even worth just tossing to kill 1 more model unless it would knock it down a points bracket last minute

But this is more about oaths. Crossbowmen should never take MoI so its a moot point on them.

On 10/27/2017 at 10:59 PM, Vineheart01 said:

Which goes towards the scenario i mentioned where you would discard it for the mortal strike: your crossbowmen already got their surge. If they got their surge they probably have less actual hits as a result. Against higher armor its quite possible the extra hits didnt pen the armor even with the reduction. Unlikely, but possible

Even on crossbowmen i dont see myself discarding it. Since its an Or, usually the reduced armor would cause 1 more wound anyway. Usually. Killing off a hero after rolling ONLY surges and using it on their last hp would be about it imo.
Remember, a discarded upgrade also doesnt net you points. So its not even worth just tossing to kill 1 more model unless it would knock it down a points bracket last minute

Points in tourny setting are what you kill, discarded cards do not count to your score though, so do net your opponent points

Just now, Darthain said:

Points in tourny setting are what you kill, discarding a card also doesn't give your opponent points, unless they kill that unit.

Oh they switched it? Havnt actually read the tourny rules since theres not many of us here and the only RWM tournies ive heard of so far are WAY too far away.

**** nebraska middle of nowhere problems....

I haven't had any either, I feel your pain.

On 10/27/2017 at 8:02 PM, Vineheart01 said:

Oh they switched it? Havnt actually read the tourny rules since theres not many of us here

For what it's worth, I was unaware of that change, too. So if I use Mistlands Saboteur to discard Rank Discipline from an enemy Oathsworn Cavalry unit, I don't score those 4 points until the unit is destroyed? Is this the same for upgrade cards corresponding to figure upgrades, or are they scored because they are "destroyed"?

10 hours ago, Parakitor said:

For what it's worth, I was unaware of that change, too. So if I use Mistlands Saboteur to discard Rank Discipline from an enemy Oathsworn Cavalry unit, I don't score those 4 points until the unit is destroyed? Is this the same for upgrade cards corresponding to figure upgrades, or are they scored because they are "destroyed"?

It’s better to have more upgrade cards in more sets than it is to have exclusive upgrade cards.

12 minutes ago, TylerTT said:

It’s better to have more upgrade cards in more sets than it is to have exclusive upgrade cards.

I'll disagree with that, but I'm collecting 2 armies, meaning I have 5 copies of some cards, anything over 3 is slush, I feel. Even then 3 seems rare.

Thats perfectly fine to disagree. I'm used to x-wing where almost everything has a unique upgrade and you need to buy a bunch of models you will likely never play to build a list.

The same kind of system in a hobby miniatures game would be much worse as each purchase is more costly and implies an obligation to paint it.

That both the undead hero and the death knights have the same unique upgrade means players who want that card will have a choice in how they get it.

That players have more cards then they need means they can give new players cards.

To sum it up the cards need to be disposable when the investment in the actual miniatures is so heavy.