Wookie Avenger

By Tvboy, in Imperial Assault Rules Questions

During setup search your Command deck for 'Debts Repaid,' reveal it, put it into your hand, and shuffle your deck. Then draw 1 fewer card into your initial hand.

Two questions:

1. Do I have to actually pull the card out of my deck if I don't want to? Maybe I want to maximize my chances of drawing another card in my opening hand, or maybe I want my opponent to have to guess whether or not I have Debts in my hand. I realize the card is not worded as optional, but the reason I see this as a possibility is because

2. What if I don't include Debts Repaid in my command deck? The upgrade doesn't say I have to put Debts in my deck (do what the card says, not what it doesn't say). Well then I literally can't search out the card, optional or not. But if I'm forced to search out Debts if it's in my deck, then my opponent would need to verify this, which means they'd have to look through my deck, which is a huge information advantage, and the reason why a lot of card games have a "fail to find" rule that allows players to voluntarily whiff on search effects.

Well you complete as much of each ability as possible. So...

1) The ability doesn’t say “may,” or “use,” nor is there a cost therefore it is required.

2) You don’t have the card and therefore can’t draw it, but you still have to shuffle the deck and draw one fewer card then normal.

EDIT: Oh, and in an tournament setting the tournament officials would be available to check your deck so no your opponent wouldn’t have to.

Edited by Uninvited Guest

Yeah, I'd agree with @Uninvited Guest .

If you don't have Debts Repaid in your deck, you try to find it and fail. Then you draw one fewer card.

Basically, if you're playing Chewie resign yourself to the fact that you either go fetch Debts Repaid or start with one fewer card.

Ah I forgot the draw 1 fewer card bit would still apply, that throws a spanner in that idea I guess. I guess I just don't like how much information the card forces you to give away, but it's better than Chewie costing 15 points.

I disagree with @Uninvited Guest and @Majushi . Here is how I interpret Wookie Avenger:

During setup, search your Command deck for Debts Repaid, reveal it, put it into your hand, and shuffle your deck. Then, draw 1 fewer card into your initial hand.

This is a simple "If,then" statement as I see it. In other words, if you can't satisfy the initial statement, then result would not hold true either.

1.) During setup, search your Command deck for Debts Repaid, reveal it, put it into your hand, and shuffle your deck.

2.) Then, draw 1 fewer card into your initial hand.

If Debts Repaid is not in your CC deck, then you can't satisfy " search your Command deck for Debts Repaid, reveal it, put it into your hand . " Since you can't satisfy 1, then you don't have to do 2 as a result, and you therefore don't have to draw 1 fewer cards.

There are no "if, then" statements unless explicitly written as such. "Then" is used to indicate a sequence when an ability is split to separate sentences by a full stop. (Sequence is also indicated by a comma inside one compound statement.)

When abilities are resolved you perform as much as you can. As long as you can pay the cost of an ability when it triggers, you can activate it even if it didn't end up doing anything. (For example, Diala can use Foresight even when her defense die has already been rerolled. She can then use Defensive Stance even when the defense die did not get rerolled by her, but she used Foresight.)

There is no explicit requirement to have Debts Repaid in the command deck in the ability. If Debts Repaid is not found, you don't reveal it, and surely don't put it in your hand. You still shuffle the deck, because it's possible, and afterwards - "Then" - you draw 1 less card than you would draw.

(If one part of an ability is contingent on having performed some other part, it contains "if you do" or similar.)

Edited by a1bert
1 hour ago, a1bert said:

(If one part of an ability is contingent on having performed some other part, it contains "if you do" or similar.)

Is that written somewhere that I missed?

IF ( :P ) that's the case, it seems like an oversight to me to make the "fix" so contingent on the CC, and you more or less being punished for not including it.

In essence, it could well be argued that those 3pts that Debts Repaid handcuffs, could be better spent on other cards, and is potentially not worth that if you are drawing 1 less during setup.

Now I highly doubt that they will "fix" a "fix" so I'm quite obviously wasting my breath (well getting carpal tunnel needlessly), yet here I am haha.

30 minutes ago, wannabepudge said:

Is that written somewhere that I missed?

IF ( :P ) that's the case, it seems like an oversight to me to make the "fix" so contingent on the CC, and you more or less being punished for not including it.

In essence, it could well be argued that those 3pts that Debts Repaid handcuffs, could be better spent on other cards, and is potentially not worth that if you are drawing 1 less during setup.

Now I highly doubt that they will "fix" a "fix" so I'm quite obviously wasting my breath (well getting carpal tunnel needlessly), yet here I am haha.

There could be a clarification in the FAQ that explains that a Chewie player does not get punished if they choose not to have Debts Repaid in their deck.

But until then it's Rules as Written...

35 minutes ago, wannabepudge said:

Is that written somewhere that I missed?

IF ( :P ) that's the case, it seems like an oversight to me to make the "fix" so contingent on the CC, and you more or less being punished for not including it.

In essence, it could well be argued that those 3pts that Debts Repaid handcuffs, could be better spent on other cards, and is potentially not worth that if you are drawing 1 less during setup.

Now I highly doubt that they will "fix" a "fix" so I'm quite obviously wasting my breath (well getting carpal tunnel needlessly), yet here I am haha.

A good example is on the skirmish upgrade card "Black Market".

Quote

At the end of each round, a friendly Smuggler may suffer 1 . If it does, reveal the top Command card of your deck. Then , you may either:

Notice that the If:Then is explicitly written out.

I am hoping they FAQ Wookiee Avenger to make the Debt Repaid part optional. It's stupid that they allowed something like that to become a drawback to the card.

Edited by Tvboy

Actually, the "Then" in Black Market is not part of an if-then as used for programming language. "Then" is just to indicate sequence there too.

If it does -> reveal....

Then (afterwards), you may either:

2 hours ago, a1bert said:

When abilities are resolved you perform as much as you can.

Actually I couldn't find that in the rules, can you tell me where that rule comes from? It's been common knowledge for me but now I can't find it. Is it just being inferred?

By the absence of a rule.

Because rules don't say that you could not perform any part if you can't perform some part, then it follows that you perform as much as you can.

I just received the official reply from Todd:

Regardless of whether Debts Repaid is drawn, the second part of the effect (drawing 1 fewer card) still happens afterward.