On 10/21/2017 at 0:24 AM, Innese said:

Black Sun Ace — Kihraxz Fighter	23
Saturation Salvo	1
Cruise Missiles	3
Inertial Dampeners	1
Guidance Chips	0
Munitions Failsafe	1
Vaksai	0
Ship Total: 25
Black Sun Ace — Kihraxz Fighter	23
Saturation Salvo	1
Cruise Missiles	3
Inertial Dampeners	1
Guidance Chips	0
Munitions Failsafe	1
Vaksai	0
Ship Total: 25
Black Sun Ace — Kihraxz Fighter	23
Saturation Salvo	1
Cruise Missiles	3
Inertial Dampeners	1
Guidance Chips	0
Munitions Failsafe	1
Vaksai	0
Ship Total: 25
Black Sun Ace — Kihraxz Fighter	23
Saturation Salvo	1
Cruise Missiles	3
Inertial Dampeners	1
Guidance Chips	0
Munitions Failsafe	1
Vaksai	0
Ship Total: 25

Cruise Missiles' ability to add dice based on your maneuver is a 'May' meaning you can choose to roll only 1 dice. This allows you to use them as splash damage against formation lists, and keep using them thanks to Munitions Failsafe, or go full-on with GC against non-formation lists.

My question here is:

Vaksai reduces the points cost of Cruise Missiles. Salvo references the points cost of the munitions. Does it go with the printed cost on the card or the modified cost thanks to Vaksai? are you gunning for those 1-ag swarms?

4 point range 1 missile (so, uh... clusters, I guess) against Fen Rahu with title.

He still gets title and extra die on defense, but he's technically just 3 defense dice, so when he dodges both cluster missile shots (and if he doesnt, well, SCORE!) then you still have a 50% chance of taking off a hull anyway. You're caught in your own blast, sure, but it it means taking down fen rahu....

1 hour ago, skotothalamos said:

My question here is:

Vaksai reduces the points cost of Cruise Missiles. Salvo references the points cost of the munitions. Does it go with the printed cost on the card or the modified cost thanks to Vaksai? are you gunning for those 1-ag swarms?

I'd say the printed cost of the card, due to the exact wording of Salvo.

As follows: "...the squad point cost of the (torpedo) or (missile) Upgrade card ." (Emphasis mine). Salvo is making direct reference to the printed point cost.

1 hour ago, Innese said:

I'd say the printed cost of the card, due to the exact wording of Salvo.

As follows: "...the squad point cost of the (torpedo) or (missile) Upgrade card ." (Emphasis mine). Salvo is making direct reference to the printed point cost.

Which Vaksai reduces. Read the cards, do what they all say. You can't just selectively ignore one of them because it doesn't suit you.

3 hours ago, Celestial Lizards said:

Double Edge-TLT-Unguided Rockets-Saturation Salvo: 28 points

Cheaper then most aces, fires with Rockets, if he misses, he could still do one damage and then another two.

Great against the current meta of Nym, Dengar, and Biggs, no one has three agility (except me who still flies Defenders, Interceptors, and Advanced in the same list).

Yup this is about the only use I can see for Sat Salvo and even then it's questionable. Very low PS.

14 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Which Vaksai reduces. Read the cards, do what they all say. You can't just selectively ignore one of them because it doesn't suit you.

Vaksai makes no reference to the card itself, it only references equipped upgrades. Salvo calls out the specific card as a separate entity.

The squad point cost of each of your equipped upgrades is reduced by 1 (to a minimum of 0).

You may equip up to 3 different Modification upgrades.

Is the missile an equipped upgrade?

6 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

The squad point cost of each of your equipped upgrades is reduced by 1 (to a minimum of 0).

You may equip up to 3 different Modification upgrades.

Is the missile an equipped upgrade?

I never once said the missile isn't an equipped upgrade, just that Salvo doesn't call it out as an Upgrade or equipped upgrade. It calls it out as an Upgrade Card. It refers to it in a separate context.

Lets just agree to disagree and hope for the FAQ that will never actually come.

SS

After you perform an attack with a [missile] or [torp] secondary weapon that does not hit, each ship at Range 1 of the defender with an agility value lower than the squad point cost of the [missile] or [torp] Upgrade card must roll 1 attack die and suffer any damage () or critical damage () rolled.

Vaksai

The squad point cost of each of your equipped upgrades is reduced by 1 (to a minimum of 0).

You may equip up to 3 different Modification upgrades.

The bolded phrases refer to the same thing - a specific card, on a specific ship. If that card is on a Vaksai, its cost is reduced by 1.

It doesn't refer to some platonic ideal card, it refers to the specific instance equipped to that Vaksai. And that specific instance doesn't cost x, it costs x-1.

Its seems.. eh. maybe with assault missiles and munitions failsafe?

Check this nonsense out:

PILOTS

Bossk (54)
YV-666 (35), Saturation Salvo (1), “Mangler” Cannon (4), Cruise Missiles (3), Gunner (5), IG-88D (1), Dengar (3), Inertial Dampeners (1), Munitions Failsafe (1)

IG88-B (46)
Aggressor (36), Wired (1), Fire-Control System (2), “Mangler” Cannon (4), Rigged Cargo Chute (1), IG-2000 (0), Autothrusters (2)

Shoot Cruise Missile at 1 die, use Dengar to reroll a hit. You missed, so you keep the missile, do the possible Saturation Salvo damage at all in range 1, then IGGY-D to pop shots with your Mango Cannon, then use Gunner to pop shots with your primary weapon.

Good? Nah.

Truly outrageous? Yass, Jem.

Oh god this is going to infuriate the people who think that combo is broken.

On 10/22/2017 at 1:57 PM, player2422845 said:

I think for the next FAQ the munition failsafe will be discarded if the attacker deal at least on damage with SS.

Unlikely - Flechette Torpedoes/Munitions Failsafe delivers stress even though the torpedo was theoretically 'not fired'.

On 10/21/2017 at 8:24 AM, Innese said:

Cruise Missiles' ability to add dice based on your maneuver is a 'May' meaning you can choose to roll only 1 dice. This allows you to use them as splash damage against formation lists, and keep using them thanks to Munitions Failsafe, or go full-on with GC against non-formation lists.

It's a nice idea. Being able to splash-spread instead of delivering a big punch is nice, but you hit the problem of only being able to hit agility 1 targets.

I might suggest, as noted, that it's probably something best 'dropped in' rather than spammed.

A single Vaksai with Harpoons and Saturation Salvo can do a fair amount of splash damage hit-or-miss, for example. You're not realistically going to kill people with single rolled dice, after all, but you should hit someone - and with Captain Jostero as an option, that becomes a rather nice trigger.

Personally, I'm going to run Saturation Salvo and Advanced homing missiles on Major Rhymer.

The idea is try to make the enemy choose between a crit under shields, or chance at damage on everything close.

1 hour ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Personally, I'm going to run Saturation Salvo and Advanced homing missiles on Major Rhymer.

The idea is try to make the enemy choose between a crit under shields, or chance at damage on everything close.

If only Rhymer were three points cheaper.

5 minutes ago, HolySorcerer said:

If only Rhymer were three points cheaper.

Trying to fit that in a list?

23 minutes ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Trying to fit that in a list?

No, he's just overpriced by three points, which hurts a lot on an already unimpressive chassis. Though if you want to double down on Rhymer, why not snap shot instead of Salvo?

4 minutes ago, HolySorcerer said:

No, he's just overpriced by three points, which hurts a lot on an already unimpressive chassis. Though if you want to double down on Ryhmer, why not snap shot instead of Salvo?

Primary reason, we are not talking about Snap Shot or Rhymer, but instead about what to put Saturation Salvo on.

Secondary reason, I do not currently own either expansions that offer Snap Shot, and when the gunboat is released, I will likely not have purchased either with the limited gaming funds, while I am budgeting for the gunboat, silencer and resistance bomber - expansions that offer more value to me. I must pick and choose what I can get, and play only what I own.

Does saturation salvo effect the ship you fired the missile at, or just the other ships at range 1 of it?

1 hour ago, kingofpain97 said:

Does saturation salvo effect the ship you fired the missile at, or just the other ships at range 1 of it?

Yes, it affects the ship you fired the missile or torp at as well as any ship within range one of it, as ships are considered to be at range 1 of themselves.

It is like Munition Failsafe which takes an undesired outcome and try to make a somewhat desired effect.

The only way I see it is with Assault Missiles where your intended effect is an AOE or with a secondary weapon like Flechette Torpedoes where it still provides an effect even if it doesn't hit.

1 hour ago, Marinealver said:

It is like Munition Failsafe which takes an undesired outcome and try to make a somewhat desired effect.

The only way I see it is with Assault Missiles where your intended effect is an AOE or with a secondary weapon like Flechette Torpedoes where it still provides an effect even if it doesn't hit.

Yeah that’s the way I see it. Even if it doesn’t hit, it’s guaranteed to do something.

37 minutes ago, kingofpain97 said:

Yeah that’s the way I see it. Even if it doesn’t hit, it’s guaranteed to do something.

Except that something only works if the ships have the right ability and then only 50% of the time.

So guaranteed is a little strong...

36 minutes ago, kingofpain97 said:

Yeah that’s the way I see it. Even if it doesn’t hit, it’s guaranteed to do something.

Yeah but insurance policies are not that good of a thing. When you make an attack with a secondary weapon odds are you want the effect of that weapon. Face it when attacking you don't really want it to miss. Again it is not optional too so you may not want it to trigger when it does.

It is a boost to say Ruthlessness or Assault Missile, or the new Harpoon, but I doubt you would be putting it on a homing missile in hopes that you get a miss and a splash effect.

Personally I see this being primarily used with Unguided rockets. Cant’t hit my target but I might get something?! Double Edge or even Kestal seem big proponents of it. I can also see higher end bombers using the combination. It would get most rebel ships while not endangering a large portion of TIE’s that might be in close. Otherwise I honestly don’t see them being used much otherwise.

It wouldn't get 'most' rebel ships.

It would get about half of them.

The ONLY reasonable use I've seen is on Double Edge, who can tolerate missing with his first attack.

And I suppose YV88 builds with Failsafe and Cruise Missile, but YV88 is dumb and bad even if you don't spend another 5 points to guarantee the miss.