19 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

For sure. That’s definitely a best-case scenario. That’s why I far prefer four of these:

+ Extra Munitions

+ Ordnance Title

+ Guidance Chips

(sorry, too lazy to go find pictures again)

reload action makes EM mute, but you are forgetting one important thing.

7 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

reload action makes EM mute, but you are forgetting one important thing.

I was just thinking about it like a TIE Bomber. With the SLAM, you can basically sacrifice your action to turn around (a little better than doing a red k-turn), and you can keep the target lock theoretically if you roll well and use GC. The EM is there so that for just two points, you can go an extra round before having to reload. It’s, in my opinion, a little better than a Bomber because it has an extra hit point and reposition (with SLAM). Not that Bombers are good anyway - but it’s a thought.

For the 25-point GUNBOAT, I suppose you could trade out GC+EM for AdvSlam, but you’d still suffer from action economy, having to reload every round, and GC wouldn’t be there to help you.

All that being said (and this is now a little tangential to the topic), my favorite four-Gunboat list is likely going to be

Nu Squadron Pilot (18)

XG-1 Assault Configuration (1)

Mangler Cannon (4)

Linked Batteries (2)

I thought about four linked Mangler Nus, and I'm honestly not seeing them over

FIVE.

CARTEL.

MARAUDERS.

courtesy of el Gecko

the extra die, crackshot and pilot skill of the Rho has me favoring them over both other options

22 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

For sure. That’s definitely a best-case scenario. That’s why I far prefer four of these:

+ Ordnance Title

+ Guidance Chips

(sorry, too lazy to go find pictures again)

I think 4 of this is gonna be a nightmare to fly, they are not meant to be swarming but using SLAM in my opinion, I think that we will see 2 well equiped Star Wings with some support. I was thinking maybe something like this:

2x [38] Rho Squadron Veteran — Alpha-class Star Wing 21
- Deadeye 1
- Extra Munitions 2
- Concussion Missiles 4
- Ion Torpedoes 5
- Proton Rockets 3
- Guidance Chips 0
- Os-1 Arsenal Loadout 2

1x [23] Scimitar Squadron Pilot — TIE Bomber 16
- Fleet Officer 3
- Agent Kallus 2
- Lightweight Frame 2
- TIE Shuttle 0

Total: 99

The TIE shuttle provides focus for the star wings while beeing equiped to be "hard to deal with" and the 2 star wing with deadeye can forget about focusing/reloading/targeting, having the slam ready for everything and a versatile loadout to handle different ranges and exercise some control... maybe is happy thinking and arc dodges will tear it appart, what do you think?

EMs on these is a waste of two points. Just do the reload action and you get all your ordnance back. Those are really suboptimal builds. Just because the title gives you 4 ordnance slots, doesn't mean you need to fill them. Remember these are defensively an X-wing (w/ integrated) with 1 more shield. Also, I don't know how the Tie shuttle is going to keep up with two slamming Gunboats.

2 minutes ago, Andreu said:

I think 4 of this is gonna be a nightmare to fly, they are not meant to be swarming but using SLAM in my opinion, I think that we will see 2 well equiped Star Wings with some support. I was thinking maybe something like this:

2x [38] Rho Squadron Veteran — Alpha-class Star Wing 21
- Deadeye 1
- Extra Munitions 2
- Concussion Missiles 4
- Ion Torpedoes 5
- Proton Rockets 3
- Guidance Chips 0
- Os-1 Arsenal Loadout 2

1x [23] Scimitar Squadron Pilot — TIE Bomber 16
- Fleet Officer 3
- Agent Kallus 2
- Lightweight Frame 2
- TIE Shuttle 0

Total: 99

The TIE shuttle provides focus for the star wings while beeing equiped to be "hard to deal with" and the 2 star wing with deadeye can forget about focusing/reloading/targeting, having the slam ready for everything and a versatile loadout to handle different ranges and exercise some control... maybe is happy thinking and arc dodges will tear it appart, what do you think?

I like the idea, but I’m not sure about the Bomber. I think the GUNBOATS might have trouble staying in Fleet Officer range. Also as others have said, ditch the Extra Munitions, since you’ve got reload.

I think we might see a lot of Gunboat/Gunboat/Striker/Striker builds, though!

We did have to appreciate that the generics are really quite aggressively priced. 18 base for the PS2 and 21 for the PS4 EPT is less than I would have guessed. It gives you a little breathing room for the upgrades.

I'm probably more interested in 4x...

Nu Squadron - XG1, Linked Batteries, Flechette Cannon, Adv SLAM (25)

I was never a fan of the ship, but I really do not like that it has the slam action with more flexibility than a K Wing. The thing was a sluggish gun platform that has now been transformed into a speedy sleek slaloming gun platform.

I know the Imps need help, gameplaywise, but the X wings of the computer game could dance circles around this ship. Now this thing is going to dance circles around pretty much everyone. At least it doesn´ t drop bombs...

8 minutes ago, Larky Bobble said:

I was never a fan of the ship, but I really do not like that it has the slam action with more flexibility than a K Wing. The thing was a sluggish gun platform that has now been transformed into a speedy sleek slaloming gun platform.

I know the Imps need help, gameplaywise, but the X wings of the computer game could dance circles around this ship. Now this thing is going to dance circles around pretty much everyone. At least it doesn´ t drop bombs...

meh, this is another case of gameplay > fluff (even if the fluff is gameplay from another, completely different game)

unless the gunboat were an absolute horror of health and shields for its cost, it would simply never see play as a brick of a ship. I'm glad FFG did something to make the Alpha distinguishable and unique from every other ship in the game

9 minutes ago, Larky Bobble said:

I was never a fan of the ship, but I really do not like that it has the slam action with more flexibility than a K Wing. The thing was a sluggish gun platform that has now been transformed into a speedy sleek slaloming gun platform.

I know the Imps need help, gameplaywise, but the X wings of the computer game could dance circles around this ship. Now this thing is going to dance circles around pretty much everyone. At least it doesn´ t drop bombs...

Given that it has no K-turn or a turret, the ship would be absolutely unplayable without the SLAM action. And might I remind you that SLAM was originally an Imperial technology.

Is it really aggressively priced taking into account the 2 point titles? It's priced a little higher than a PS 2 TIE bomber, for an admittedly better chassis. It loses the barrel roll and has no K-Turn but gains SLAM and white 2 hard turns. It loses a lot of upgrade slots to the bomber, until you put a title on it. I don't know the math but it doesn't feel just incredibly cheap for the cost, except maybe comparing the PS 4 to PS 5 guy, Karsabi at first glance seems expensive at a 3 point premium over a Rho.

4 minutes ago, mdl0114 said:

Is it really aggressively priced taking into account the 2 point titles? It's priced a little higher than a PS 2 TIE bomber, for an admittedly better chassis. It loses the barrel roll and has no K-Turn but gains SLAM and white 2 hard turns. It loses a lot of upgrade slots to the bomber, until you put a title on it. I don't know the math but it doesn't feel just incredibly cheap for the cost, except maybe comparing the PS 4 to PS 5 guy, Karsabi at first glance seems expensive at a 3 point premium over a Rho.

I don't feel they are aggressively priced either, they're just not overpriced

if they were aggressively priced, they'd basically just replace the TIE bomber. Instead, they're overpriced at a base level so you basically have to leverage their titles and upgrade combos to make them worth taking.

thankfully, they're not overpriced so you can actually fit enough of them in a list after all the upgrades (was pleasantly surprised to find that the loaded Rho is cheaper than DEADEYE, extra munitions, homing SCURRGS). I do feel the named pilots do have a rather peculiar bump in price, however. I kind of get it for Karsabi because his ability really opens up the linked HLC build but neither boat has anything even remotely approaching Dash/Dengar/Miranda levels

1 hour ago, Biophysical said:

We did have to appreciate that the generics are really quite aggressively priced. 18 base for the PS2 and 21 for the PS4 EPT is less than I would have guessed. It gives you a little breathing room for the upgrades.

14 minutes ago, mdl0114 said:

Is it really aggressively priced taking into account the 2 point titles? It's priced a little higher than a PS 2 TIE bomber, for an admittedly better chassis. It loses the barrel roll and has no K-Turn but gains SLAM and white 2 hard turns. It loses a lot of upgrade slots to the bomber, until you put a title on it. I don't know the math but it doesn't feel just incredibly cheap for the cost, except maybe comparing the PS 4 to PS 5 guy, Karsabi at first glance seems expensive at a 3 point premium over a Rho.

Okay, fair enough. Not aggressively priced taking titles into account, but cheap enough that the titles don't suck up too many points. With the way the named ones were priced. I was hoping the PS2 would be 19, expecting 20, and fearing 21.

I'm very much looking forward to them as Ion Cannon carriers. Being able to stick one in with an Ion Cannon for 23 points is a handy tool. At that price, the one damage cap on Ion is not a big problem.

2 hours ago, mdl0114 said:

You don't want your plan to rely on luck, I think, unless your plan involved the new EPT that has an area effect on a miss. I think that EPT is a trap though, since swarms are going to remain dead for a while with Harpoon missiles. You could use extra munitions, I guess, instead of PtL so that you could attack, SLAM and TL, and still attack. But then you're spending 2 points for something you can already do with reload.

You could maybe get target locks another way, I'm pretty sure despite the article systems officer is a non-starter for a wingman of a SLAM-ing Gunboat with the range 1 restriction. I don't know a lot of crew carriers that are going to get within r1 of a gunboat with a green maneuver after the gunboat has performed a SLAM action.

Looks like a job for MAJOR STRIDAN!!!

or palp jendon... that works to.

To both, as my response addresses both...

1 hour ago, ficklegreendice said:

meh, this is another case of gameplay > fluff (even if the fluff is gameplay from another, completely different game)

unless the gunboat were an absolute horror of health and shields for its cost, it would simply never see play as a brick of a ship. I'm glad FFG did something to make the Alpha distinguishable and unique from every other ship in the game

1 hour ago, defkhan1 said:

Given that it has no K-turn or a turret, the ship would be absolutely unplayable without the SLAM action. And might I remind you that SLAM was originally an Imperial technology.

Anything is playable, given the right cost, and they could stil be a unique experience. Take away the slam (and still no k turn). Up Shields to 4 or 5. Give it an appropriate cost so that you can fit in 5 with a minor upgrade or two, personally I would have gone for a linked shot 2Red Ion cannon (with 0 damage, only effect) somehow with the 2 red primary. I´ d be happy to play either side in a scenario of 4 X wings vs 5 of these and it would feel like the XvT games again. (I´ m not into power combos much)

But... The creep´ s gotta creep! and them scumbos and plebels upped their game. No way they´ d make it faithful to the orignal now, wave 4 maybe. It´ s cool, don´ t get me wrong, perfect for the game as it stands, but I´ m a sentimental fool at times.

I WANNA GET ON THAT FAT GITS BACK SIDE AND GIVE IT ONE THAT IT CAN´ T GET AWAY FROM! (with my lasers from my X Wing, in case you were doubting.) Just like in the good ´ ol days!

2 hours ago, Kieransi said:

That would be my 32 point GUNBOAT...

I'd consider swapping Cruise + Proton into Cluster + Plasma. No range-1 gap.

19 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I'd consider swapping Cruise + Proton into Cluster + Plasma. No range-1 gap.

I dunno, I think to close the range gap, I'd prefer:

While it's true neither prockets nor cruise missiles will hit their max damage output, they can both reliably put out 4 dice attacks, and this build lets you reload and focus or TL every turn to keep up the fire rate out of them. (Or, more specifically, first turn you TL + focus to maul the enemy with cruise missiles, next turn tl+focus to maul them with prockets, and following turn reload + TL for more cruise missiles as you reposition) Also: cheaper.

The awkward thing about PRockets would be that they can fire with a focus, but you only fire when Weapons Disabled if you have a target lock, so you'd have to Focus+TL as your PTL action, which interferes with the Reload plan.

Edit: I'd really love if they eventually added some kind of 4-dice, range 1-2 torpedo option. 3 points, maybe some minor benefit of some kind. There ought to be more close-range ordnance options.

Just now, theBitterFig said:

The awkward thing about PRockets would be that they can fire with a focus, but you only fire when Weapons Disabled if you have a target lock, so you'd have to Focus+TL as your PTL action, which interferes with the Reload plan.

Only a problem if you need to fire the prockets twice in a row, and I don't see many enemies letting you have range-1, forward-arc, shots on them for two turns in a row. Odds are higher you won't have a shot the third time at all, really, as you reposition, and if you do...it'd be longer range.

Which...interesting question. How does the title work if you have TWO weapon disabled tokens? IE., you SLAM and reload on a turn? Does the 'a weapons disabled token' literally mean ONE? Or 'one or more'?

Pretty sure you can still shoot no matter how many you have.

If you have 2 weapon disabled tokens, you still have "a weapon disabled token".

6 minutes ago, BadMotivator said:

Pretty sure you can still shoot no matter how many you have.

If you have 2 weapon disabled tokens, you still have "a weapon disabled token".

yup, that's the interpretation you can rely on (the alternative would have been "even while you have one weapon disabled token")

you can stack the tokens (even get two in the box) with SLAM + reload, and then they all fall off at the end of the round. Titles don't care about how many you have so you can shoot regardless, letting you essentially maintain infinite ordnance shots round after round

which is neat, but mind this isn't g-chipped ordnance. It's basically HLC level damage but without the linked batteries re-roll (unless you somehow SLAM into 3 actions for reload + focus + TL). The real advantage is the SLAM maneuverability, which is balanced out by the TL requirement

Yeah, this is a ship you play a long game with. Unload ordinance, bug out to reload and reset, then come around for another pass. Its not continual fire each turn, but every other turn with maybe two turns of shooting in a row if the board state lets you.

Especially if you go for ordinance with range 2-3, you're gonna blow right past the opponent much of the time if they get close.

It really is a shame that Adv Slam and Chips are mutually exclusive.

24 minutes ago, BadMotivator said:

It really is a shame that Adv Slam and Chips are mutually exclusive.

Yeah I was kinda hoping the OS-1 title would give the ship a second mod slot. As it stands, you have to jump through some hoops to make the OS-1 config work since Advanced SLAM is practically necessary on this ship. I've seen people throwing around Expertise + Harpoons and ASLAM on the Rhos, but that gets expensive quick.