5 minutes ago, CaribbeanNinja said:

This kind of put me over on him.

1. His whole force of going after me has been way too much for D2.

2. The scum really want me dead and wonder why I didn't die last night.

3. The wanting me to claim right here when only he was voting for me. Even if double.

4. I am personally totally done with anymore "will be gone for some time" excuses. Nothing personal, but scum have used those before and I am not falling for it anymore.

5. I am a self aligned Mad Doctor. I protected myself last night. Hence no kill. My win condition is to have all threats to town eliminated. I can attempt to poison during day, but only if I protected at night. I missed that about my role.

##vote JJs Juggernaut

Wait. If you protected whom?

You said you protected yourself. So thus why can you not poison? And Trigger wasn't followed by a name, so how was Pod to know whom to kill?

Just now, GhostofNobodyInParticular said:

Wait. If you protected whom?

You said you protected yourself. So thus why can you not poison? And Trigger wasn't followed by a name, so how was Pod to know whom to kill?

I would have had to poison myself since I protected myself.

7 minutes ago, CaribbeanNinja said:

I would have had to poison myself since I protected myself.

So you can only poison the person you protected? And you must target specifically that person?

How does Trigger work? When you posted it in the thread above you did not target JJ. Is it therefore to be assumed that it automatically targets the person you protect? I think not, else you would be dead. So how do you inform Pod who you wanted to poison, and why would you inform him, if there is such a restriction? I don't get it.

Also, the wiki holds no info on Mad Doctor. So it must be a custom role. Is all that it entails revealed to us? You can protect somebody at night, and poison that same person during the day?

Also also: are you informed that your protection was successful?

Oh it’s definitely custom. All Pod.

I ****** it all up. (except I kind of didn’t because Im still alive) I thought they were separate but they are not. My poison only works when I do Doctor+Poison at night and then trigger in the day. I thought I could just Poison separately.

So let me ask everyone this: Why wouldnt JJ steal MY vote? Why Gnips? Im pretty sure it is because the scum tried to kill me. No point in stealing the vote of a dead player.

Ninja, your whole argument is really flawed if your read on JJ isnt accurate. It looks like you viewing the circumstances to fit into your already existing view. Which is scummy.

Also self aligned doc/posioner with a trigger mildly concerns me, you say your win condition is to eliminate threats to town, but it sure looks a lot like Norells arsonist role. And his condition was to kill everyone.

Meanwhile, JJ's a vote thief, but an up front vote thief. Its a traditionally scum role, but we've seen town get saddled with it before and who had it then? Our erstwhile poderator. But also, if JJ were scum calling himself out like that is exactly the kind of bold play I could see him making, based on previous games and also how he flies in armada. I'm wavering. I sort of want to vote JJ cuz #justiceformadaghmire (its a thing now. We are accepting donations) but my read atm says ninja.

I'm unwilling to place a vote on ninja tho, as if this is a town v town kerfuffle, then voting ninja drops him into turbo range.

I'd like to know the answer to Nips question as well. If we know for certain scum targetted ninja, then that lends significant credability to his argument.

Btw, I think its a little dangerous for us to get locked into a binary choice here, although sadly thanks to a quiet d1 and the unique circumstances surrounding vis' hanging, im not sure where exactly to shine the light. I don't really think we can pull too much from the vote on vis, although since we have such a limited set of data available thats where im going to look next.

13 minutes ago, Madaghmire said:

Ninja, your whole argument is really flawed if your read on JJ isnt accurate. It looks like you viewing the circumstances to fit into your already existing view. Which is scummy.

Not sure how this is any different from anyone else. My truth is true from my point of view.

Also self aligned doc/posioner with a trigger mildly concerns me, you say your win condition is to eliminate threats to town, but it sure looks a lot like Norells arsonist role. And his condition was to kill everyone.

Meanwhile, JJ's a vote thief, but an up front vote thief. Its a traditionally scum role, but we've seen town get saddled with it before and who had it then? Our erstwhile poderator. But also, if JJ were scum calling himself out like that is exactly the kind of bold play I could see him making, based on previous games and also how he flies in armada. I'm wavering. I sort of want to vote JJ cuz #justiceformadaghmire (its a thing now. We are accepting donations) but my read atm says ninja.

Not true. I show that is is typically a town role. Not sure why JJ and you have written differently. Also not sure how you can say I'm not upfront.

I'm unwilling to place a vote on ninja tho, as if this is a town v town kerfuffle, then voting ninja drops him into turbo range.

I'd like to know the answer to Nips question as well. If we know for certain scum targetted ninja, then that lends significant credability to his argument.

Btw, I think its a little dangerous for us to get locked into a binary choice here, although sadly thanks to a quiet d1 and the unique circumstances surrounding vis' hanging, im not sure where exactly to shine the light. I don't really think we can pull too much from the vote on vis, although since we have such a limited set of data available thats where im going to look next.

Binary is always bad. And we've been down this road before. I will say that JJ started this when he reacted to the D1 normal stuff with real force.

I'm so confused right now. By the way, somebody stole my vote too, just saying...

It would make sense if the scum couldn't kill for some reason but they could steal the votes to force the town's hand.

Well the excrement has hit the whirling blades...

2 hours ago, CaribbeanNinja said:

Re: truth from a point of view- thats silly. Theres an objective truth regarding JJ's affiliation. We just dont know what it is. My issue is your argument is built on a conclusion, instead of arriving at a conclusion based on an argument.

Vote Thief- My understanding is its traditionally a scum role, but i didnt look it up. My understanding was based on the in game discussion we had last time vote thief came up, when we hung pod because it was traditionally a scum role. If its not traditionally a scum role, then thats a tally in JJ's favor. And I didnt say you werent upfront, I said JJ was. Which isnt necesarily indicative of town. It could just be the kernal of truth that makes the lie.

Speaking of, apparently Norell has had a vote stolen. GNips, I was assuming that anonymous vote was yours? Can you confirm you actually had a vote taken? I mean, contextually I'm like 99% sure thats true but if not I'd feel stupid if I didn't at least ask and then found out I should have when I see the lounge.

Wow. There is no possible way I'm backing off Ninja now. Even if he is town, he is just a liability. No explanation when he just tries to kill me. I think he was surprised when he failed, and now has come up with a way to try and prove his innocence.

He keeps trying to throw shade on my play, and on legitimate reasons people might need to be away from the game.

Also, interesting if we have another vote thief...I had to wait for Pod to confirm my theft last night, so there could be other role blockers/interactions out there.

Makes me wonder if both sides got one, also, ninja has been at L-2 for a good period now. Scum could have turbo'd him, but they haven't.

20 minutes ago, Madaghmire said:

Re: truth from a point of view- thats silly. Theres an objective truth regarding JJ's affiliation. We just dont know what it is. My issue is your argument is built on a conclusion, instead of arriving at a conclusion based on an argument.

I'm disagreeing. You don't think that JJ is coming at me from his point of view that I'm scum? It certainly seems that way.

Now I've claimed and I'm a "liability." But I guess a vote thief isn't.

Just got in from work and rolled myself a smoke, reading through now I can see that was a good call! In toads words s**t has hit the fan..

Cninja and JJ going full force at one another currently, need to read back properly before choosing which side of the fence to fall if any for that matter, mad doctor does seem like a very pod thing to do, but then we also all know that could be a very pod thing to do... which would be good cover

1 hour ago, Norell said:

It would make sense if the scum couldn't kill for some reason but they could steal the votes to force the town's hand.

I thought this as well, either survivor/traitor scum like I mentioned D1, which would also leave them without a night or day chat..

or like you say they could maybe just have no night kill and only votes.. both make sense imo

With Norell also claiming his vote stolen I'd like to hear back from Gnips over his vote which if it was tells you at least some of what JJs saying could well be the truth...

9 minutes ago, CaribbeanNinja said:

I'm disagreeing. You don't think that JJ is coming at me from his point of view that I'm scum? It certainly seems that way.

Now I've claimed and I'm a "liability." But I guess a vote thief isn't.

You are liability because of how you are playing, if you are town, you are royally messing it up.

Also, a Mad Doctor with a way to kill sounds rather threatening to the town to me...

5 minutes ago, JJs Juggernaut said:

You are liability because of how you are playing, if you are town, you are royally messing it up.

Also, a Mad Doctor with a way to kill sounds rather threatening to the town to me...

So if I'm town, what do your actions towards me say about you?

11 minutes ago, CaribbeanNinja said:

I'm disagreeing. You don't think that JJ is coming at me from his point of view that I'm scum? It certainly seems that way.

Now I've claimed and I'm a "liability." But I guess a vote thief isn't.

You're missing my point. I was addressing a specific argument you made regarding why JJ wouldn't have stolen your vote.

JJ clearly does believe you are scum, but his argument as I see it is based on your behavior with the givens we have, versus supplying a conclusion as a given and using it to support the argument for itself.

Meantimes, I'm waiting on Gnips in the unlikely event JJ competely goofed this.

Also, is anyone else amused that if we are to assume JJ is a town aligned vote thief, at least one person has to listen to him each day? Honestly, theres a part of me that may believe JJ just so that can be true.

Nice try. Let's not redirect this to me. Key word in your statement about yourself "If". I doubt that in itself.

3 minutes ago, CaribbeanNinja said:

So if I'm town, what do your actions towards me say about you?

I mean that's a mute point isnt it..? either one of you could say that about the other and make it look scummy

if you're town, JJs actions look scum

if JJ is town, you look scummy

This has made me reevaluate some things on Cninja, not in a town way

his raising yet more if's and his previous posts this day, has me leaning towards Cninja currently..

Seriously guys, just lynch me.

What I'm saying is totally true. If y'all don't see the collusion between Mads and JJ then so be it.

All this was blown up by JJ. Not me. All I did was question some of the things he did D1. He didn't even get lynched!

I stand by that.

I'm inclined to vote now just to get the truth either way, be it you or JJ, it seems you're taking the hit out of the both of you...

if you're scum, great for town

if you're town, we will know where a scum lays, plus if you're this mad doc you claim I can't say i'll miss someone who could poison town whenever they want

##vote Cninja

1 minute ago, EbonHawk said:

I'm inclined to vote now just to get the truth either way, be it you or JJ, it seems you're taking the hit out of the both of you...

if you're scum, great for town

if you're town, we will know where a scum lays, plus if you're this mad doc you claim I can't say i'll miss someone who could poison town whenever they want

##vote Cninja

Hold one here. If you think this is a "me or him" situation you are highly mistaken. Trying to push that is questionable in itself.

##unvote