I'm more worried with them possibly becoming better bushi than... bushi.

Since you know, a Shugenja is pretty strong anyway, Right now the only thing they are losing compared to a Bushi(that im aware) is the speed that they will progress in ranks.

And then this is not a D&D game, where being at lvl 4 while your party is at lvl 7 is a problem. Challenge wont scale to you. Delaying ranks will be more an inconvenience than a deal breaker.(Which is why i like for other characters and at the same time is why i have mixed feelings about Shugenja with kata.)

2 hours ago, Norgrath said:

... that's the rule as it stands (well to determine the heritage, the rolls within the heritage are still only once).

...Huh. Well, I somehow glossed that over completely. Disregard what I said.

1 hour ago, Mobiusllls said:

Since you know, a Shugenja is pretty strong anyway, Right now the only thing they are losing compared to a Bushi(that im aware) is the speed that they will progress in ranks.

For starters they're down two skill ranks to start (they choose three, Monks choose four, other roles choose five). I also think that the delayed school ranks will be a significant hassle for an Kuni who gets a a large number of kata.

As a Bushi if could choose between starting with acess to buffs,debuffs, weapons that ignore armor, mystical armors that inflict conditions without chance to resist or 3 more skills(lvl1) at char gen. what would you choose?

I would pick the first one.

I'm understand what you saying, Compare a Shugenja that is playing Bushi (Not necessarily a bad thing or a bad character, he is Samurai after all...) to a "conventional" Shugenja, that is buying things of his advancement table. Sure one maybe is rank 5 and the other is still on 3. The Conventional Shugenja has more invocation,options and everything, It may be even better.

The problem is the comparison between Bushi and this particular Shugenja. what sets them apart? A Shugenja on lesser rank may become a better fighter, specially since you dont need to buy the whole kata list, you just need to buy what you want for your build. (to mix up with your invocations i suppose)

Edit:
On Bushi x Courtier differences, To me there is actually none, everyone can learn how to behave in court, everyone can learn how to fight. Its just a question of what they decided to focus on. Specially since there is a lot of characters in the setting that do both well. An Shugenja is a bit more supernatural than these two. So, yeah, i worry about it.

On 11/10/2017 at 7:55 AM, Prost said:

They've definitely made the Shosuro Actors a 'skill' technique class rather than any mysticism which seems fairly consistent.

Wait... i lost something in the book? relaly there are Shosuro Actors and they did a tecnhnique for their "faces"?
or are you talking about 4th ed?

Btw i like the idea of getting different "technique" choice for different school, that's what make school interesting; also, as a friend of mine pointed out, stating "i'm a 5th level ranger who cast animmal companion" in an ordinary setting (ie dnd-ish) is pretty weird, while stating "i'm an hiruma bushi mastering the veil of the spirits technique" is way more cool in game

However, artisan could get special shuji and ninja could get special kata, so no need of creating two more "classes" of special abilities
That if you like ninja getting plain kata too (and artisan getting plain shuji too) because if you whant create "ninja kata" and limiting that to take no "non-ninja kata", then creating ninjutsu technique is a more clear path...

The only thing I truly hope for is for Techniques to have requirements like:

- clan (already there)

- family

- role

- school

18 hours ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

Part of me wonders whether that's meant to be the Witchhunter rather than the vanilla Shugenja

Thought about that, but why don’t give the Kuni Shugenja: Invocations, Kiho, Rituals instead? It will make more sense to keep their monastic approach from previous editions.

1 hour ago, Nheko said:

Thought about that, but why don’t give the Kuni Shugenja: Invocations, Kiho, Rituals instead? It will make more sense to keep their monastic approach from previous editions.

Their monastic approach was only from 4th edition. Previously they were a bizarre Bushi/Shugenja cross.

39 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

Their monastic approach was only from 4th edition. Previously they were a bizarre Bushi/Shugenja cross.

I stand corrected, thanks man , however it’s a more elegant solution that could be used in this edition?

I could use the katas in an alternate class benefit for the Bishamon’s Chosen (Lion Shugenja) though...