RZ-2 A-wing length

By Agrivar, in X-Wing

The booklet which comes with the "A-wing Wood Model" from Episode VIII gives a bit of info about both the original A-wing and the newer model which will be see in "The Last Jedi".

https://imgur.com/a/S20wP

I noticed that the specs section from the booklet gives a lentgh of 7,6 meters for this new A-wing, which it is less than the 9,6 meters official length for the original A-wing, although visually both fighters seem very close in size (with the new RZ-2 seeming a bit longer than the older RZ-1).

1mPAAcj.jpg

I just wanted to let you know this info, because I am aware that the accuracy of the official length for the A-Wing (and the accuracy of the FFG A-wing model) has always been a topic of debate. Some people think that the 9,6 meters is a good measurement, and that the problem comes from ship models used in the movie being out of scale between them (or the pilot figurine for the A-Wing model being too big), and other people think there is no problem with the pilot figurine, and the official length for the RZ-1 A-Wing should be smaller (i.e. 6,9 meters).

The "Rebels" cartoon seemed to follow the 9,6 meters, as their A-wing seem bigger than those appearing in "Return of the Jedi" (the pilots look much smaller inside the cockpits), and there is a Bandai A-wing model which seems to be close to the 9,6 meters measurements. So I'm a bit curious about the possibility of the official A-wing length being oficially reassesed (as was done with the Millenium Falcon, which changed from the 26 meters given in the first Technical Sourcebook and RPG books to the current 33-34 meters, and the length for TIE Fighters, X-wings and Y-wings was slightly tweaked after "Rogue One").

Interesting.

I do think the RZ-2 should be longer than the original, this is good info.

The 9.6m figure does seem to have a certain amount of newcanon support. Poe Dameron's Flight Log, a newcanon book, uses it, and has an ROTJ A-wing as an illustration.

They do seem to be aware of the whole "pilot barely fits in" model issue - the photo they use has been photoshopped to remove the pilot).

Regarding the Rogue One X-wing tweak - it should be noted that theirs is the T-65C-A2, not the T-65B. Real fighters sometimes get larger in later versions (a late-model Supermarine Spitfire, for example, will be longer than an early-model one.

WEG (Legends) had the T-65B be 12.5m long, width unknown.

Incredibuilds: X-Wing (a newcanon card model + book), has it as 13.31m long and 11.46m wide.

Rogue One Visual Guide, has the C-A2 model as 13.4m long, 11.76m wide.

Nevermind the size. I’m interested in this:

Irillead “Blinder” 4B2 Jamming Array Broadcasts data bursts to disrupt enemy sensors.”

Tech upgrade anyone?

”Enemy ships beyond range 2 cannot acquire target locks on your ship.”

6 minutes ago, jmswood said:

Nevermind the size. I’m interested in this:

Irillead “Blinder” 4B2 Jamming Array Broadcasts data bursts to disrupt enemy sensors.”

Tech upgrade anyone?

”Enemy ships beyond range 2 cannot acquire target locks on your ship.”

Lots of tidbits with cool card potential in there.

Resilient Hullspace F2E "Energy Armor" Deflector Shield Generator: "...the generator uses excess energy from the engines to project a bubble around the craft."

Perhaps some form of shield regen based on movement speed?

Howbout those concussion missiles with a 6 missile magazine?

Or those 120 degree blasters?

Give me both of those on my A-Wings please!

14 minutes ago, AngryAlbatross said:

Howbout those concussion missiles with a 6 missile magazine?

Or those 120 degree blasters?

Give me both of those on my A-Wings please!

Hells no.

32 minutes ago, AngryAlbatross said:

Howbout those concussion missiles with a 6 missile magazine?

Or those 120 degree blasters?

Give me both of those on my A-Wings please!

Maybe a new title for both A-Wings that allows for a second missile slot? I would love some classic A-Wings with Unguided Rockets.

Its not even like A-Wings with improved firing arcs or extra missiles would be overpowered ;(

11 minutes ago, AngryAlbatross said:

Its not even like A-Wings with improved firing arcs or extra missiles would be overpowered ;(

Have you tried using snap shot on a ship with an auxillary firing arc?

Just now, FTS Gecko said:

Have you tried using snap shot on a ship with an auxillary firing arc?

SnapShotCrackShot. Always.

Where is @Odanan 's custom card interpretation of this?

We have Tallie Lintra as a potential pilot.

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Edited by AwesomeJedi
1 hour ago, AngryAlbatross said:

Howbout those concussion missiles with a 6 missile magazine?

Or those 120 degree blasters?

Give me both of those on my A-Wings please!

The original A-wing it is supposed to also have swilveling blaster cannons, two concussion missile launchers with a 6 missile magazine each, and a sensor jammer. The West End Games "Star Wars RPG" described those features, the "X-Wing" computer game manual also mentioned them (it was quite funny to read n Imperial pilot claiming that "the A-Wing fired backwards"), and at least the sensor jammer was added rules-wise in the second edition of the RPG.

"Rogue One", "Rebels" and the new canon novels have added a lot of info which FFG could use to give new options for the classic trilogy fighters. There are a lot of new named pilots for Red, Gold, Green and Blue Squadron, and you can add pilots from the Saw Gerrera partisan and the "Rogue One" Blue Squadron. You can add A-wings from Phoenix Squadron. The "Pivot Wing" card for the U-wing it is a good precedent for doing an "S-foil wing" for the X-wing. And if the "hidden features" described in the technical readouts are shown in the movies (i.e. in "The Force Awakens" we can see an A-wing using a sensor jammer, or with swiveling blaster cannons), surely FFG will try to add them to the miniatures game. I expect to eventually see a "Rebel Veterans" expansion pack with an X-wing and Y-wing in alternate paint schemes (Blue Squadron or Jedha Partisan markings for the X-wing, and Gray Squadron markings for the Y-wing), and a future RZ-2 A-wing expansion pack (which we will surely see) would be a good opportunity to add cards that can be also used to update the classic A-wing ("Swiveling Blasters", "Integrated Sensor Jammer", ¿"R-22 Spearhead" title?").

FFG faces now an interesting dilemma. If they model an RZ-2 A-wing using the given length, it will be smaller than the current A-wing.

PS. I like a lot the Joe Johnston quote from the "A-wing Wood Model" booklet: " Creating new ships comes to designing something you've newer seen before. It has to do with taking the character of the ship and taking the character who is using it and trying to tell a little bit of the story ".

Edited by Agrivar
1 hour ago, SabineKey said:

Lots of tidbits with cool card potential in there.

Resilient Hullspace F2E "Energy Armor" Deflector Shield Generator: "...the generator uses excess energy from the engines to project a bubble around the craft."

Perhaps some form of shield regen based on movement speed?

A tie interceptors dream come true. Would love this as a generic mod to apply to other ships, but at the same time would probably break the game. Unless it had AT restriction, then maybe...

53 minutes ago, Celestial Lizards said:

SnapShotCrackShot. Always.

snapshotJukeisbetter

6 minutes ago, FlyingAnchors said:

A tie interceptors dream come true. Would love this as a generic mod to apply to other ships, but at the same time would probably break the game. Unless it had AT restriction, then maybe...

It would be tricky to balance right if given to a wider audience, though theoretically not impossible. I fear it would still never see use on the Interceptor, as it would require a shield upgrade as well.

Now, if we look at this as more of a one off thing like getting an evade or evade like token rather than regen, we may have something that could be more easily used by a wider audience.

Snap shot is a secondary weapon and can not be used on rear arcs

2 hours ago, jmswood said:

Nevermind the size. I’m interested in this:

Irillead “Blinder” 4B2 Jamming Array Broadcasts data bursts to disrupt enemy sensors.”

The A-Wing should have had tech or system upgrades from the beginning. Sucks to be a Wave 2 ship. lol. But don't worry. There's no need for a second edition.

Loving the new a-wing. A modification that lets you recover a shield would be great. Perhaps if it requires the boost action. Like this:

When performing a green maneuver, you may treat this maneuver as white and regain a shield token. You may only equip this card only if you have the [boost] action icon.

Forcing the maneuver to be white prevents double dipping of recovering a shield and stress, or without limiting it to specific ships, getting two shield back, such as poe with R2-D2. The choice of recover a shield or lose a stress becomes important. Limiting it to ships with the boost icon makes it a choice between autothrusters and shield regen. The interceptor could take it with the royal guard title and a shield icon - pricey, but doable. The TIE Punisher would possible like if as well.

With a slight change of wording, rather than regain a shield token, you could say assign a shield token - makes it a sort of secondary shield generator, but doesn't require a shield upgrade for the interceptor.

Or, add in to the text, increase your shield value by one - giving it a built in shield upgrade, which with the other options, allows an interceptor to gain two shields.

5 minutes ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Loving the new a-wing. A modification that lets you recover a shield would be great. Perhaps if it requires the boost action. Like this:

When performing a green maneuver, you may treat this maneuver as white and regain a shield token. You may only equip this card only if you have the [boost] action icon.

Forcing the maneuver to be white prevents double dipping of recovering a shield and stress, or without limiting it to specific ships, getting two shield back, such as poe with R2-D2. The choice of recover a shield or lose a stress becomes important. Limiting it to ships with the boost icon makes it a choice between autothrusters and shield regen. The interceptor could take it with the royal guard title and a shield icon - pricey, but doable. The TIE Punisher would possible like if as well.

With a slight change of wording, rather than regain a shield token, you could say assign a shield token - makes it a sort of secondary shield generator, but doesn't require a shield upgrade for the interceptor.

Or, add in to the text, increase your shield value by one - giving it a built in shield upgrade, which with the other options, allows an interceptor to gain two shields.

From the wording, I get the impression that the Energy Armor gets its excess energy from engines going at approaching full burn, so maybe a 3 and up speed requirement, like x7 or Gyroscopic Targeting?

This does still have the double dipping problem with R2-D2 on some ships, so some additional restrictions would be needed.

4 minutes ago, VaeVictis said:

The A-Wing should have had tech or system upgrades from the beginning. Sucks to be a Wave 2 ship. lol. But don't worry. There's no need for a second edition.

The a-wing in current canon has never had any sensor spoofing, at least to my knowledge. I would be happy about a trainer upgrade that removes the boost action, but gives it a crew upgrade.

It seems the new a-wing lets us have our retcon cake and eat it too. The larger a-wing that Rebels confirms, and the newer smaller a-wing from the Last Jedi, which could, theoretically, have had a few prototypes thirty years before production runs started. This is, of course, just an option.

As to the a-wing being shafted, at least its hypothetical system can be explained away be virtue of being legends only, wheras the Missiles on the TIE Silencer, and bombs on the striker, were posted in official canon entries, and are non-existent because FFG is not important enough to merit getting any technical info from Lucasfilm. Just important enough to design canon corvette class ships - the Raider needs a Corvus title now.

7 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

From the wording, I get the impression that the Energy Armor gets its excess energy from engines going at approaching full burn, so maybe a 3 and up speed requirement, like x7 or Gyroscopic Targeting?

This does still have the double dipping problem with R2-D2 on some ships, so some additional restrictions would be needed.

No, perhaps my wording is not concise. The intent is that this hypothetical upgrade as I propose, is that the green maneuver becomes white instead, and earns you a shield upgrade. Whereas R2-D2 would not work as he requires a green to offer up his regen.

Now, a ship could have both R2-D2 and this hypothetical mod, but will never benefit from both at the same time. For the t-70 x-wing with r2-d2 and this hypothetical mod, the latter is more or less a waste of points as I word it you downgrade a green move to white to gain a shield. Artoo, conversly lets you keep the green to burn stress and gains you a shield. Artoo is superior to any benefit this hypothetical offers, due to restrictions.

7 minutes ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

No, perhaps my wording is not concise. The intent is that this hypothetical upgrade as I propose, is that the green maneuver becomes white instead, and earns you a shield upgrade. Whereas R2-D2 would not work as he requires a green to offer up his regen.

Now, a ship could have both R2-D2 and this hypothetical mod, but will never benefit from both at the same time. For the t-70 x-wing with r2-d2 and this hypothetical mod, the latter is more or less a waste of points as I word it you downgrade a green move to white to gain a shield. Artoo, conversly lets you keep the green to burn stress and gains you a shield. Artoo is superior to any benefit this hypothetical offers, due to restrictions.

Ah, I missed that. Gotcha. That could work.

2 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:

Have you tried using snap shot on a ship with an auxillary firing arc?

Unfortunately it only works in the primary arc