Since the new Chimaera pack will allow us to do this combo...

+

Tarkin works for that, right, as they both have the same trigger? So the owning player decides on order - deals out all squadron tokens, and then triggers AFFM?

I'm assuming this works, but just checking. (And it does give Tarkin some slight edge over Thrawn in that case, no? As Thrawn is always treated as a dial, and AFFM requires a token)

Yep.

Tarkin and Garm are token generation that shares the timing.

You just have to make sure you declare you are resolving Tarkin before AFFM, since you can resolve in any order you'd like.

And this is why Fleet Commands are Unique, people...

Tarkin and, y'know, three Cymoons with "Shields to Maximum!" each resolving each turn would be something else.

1 minute ago, Drasnighta said:

And this is why Fleet Commands are Unique, people...

Tarkin and, y'know, three Cymoons with "Shields to Maximum!" each resolving each turn would be something else.

Would it? 3 shields hardly seems like a big deal.

2 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

And this is why Fleet Commands are Unique, people...

Tarkin and, y'know, three Cymoons with "Shields to Maximum!" each resolving each turn would be something else.

Lol.

Fleet 630 (398/400)
==================
Cymoon 1 Refit (112 + 44)
+ Grand Moff Tarkin (38)
+ Shields to Maximum! (6)
Kuat Refit (112 + 9)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Reinforced Blast Doors (5)
Kuat Refit (112 + 9)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Reinforced Blast Doors (5)

Just now, Ginkapo said:

Would it? 3 shields hardly seems like a big deal.

Three Shields per Ship per turn. On top of your regular engineering if you dial it in (for 2 more).

It is significant. Considering the investment people put in to get, effectively two shields a turn with STM! and either Leia, or STM! and say, Redundant Shields... Two is generally considered good. Three is better.

Especially on the long-range platform of the Cymoon. It doesn't have to dive in, and can outwin a standoff fight, forcing rebels into the fray where they probably don't want to be.

1 minute ago, Ardaedhel said:

Lol.

Fleet 630 (398/400)
==================
Cymoon 1 Refit (112 + 44)
+ Grand Moff Tarkin (38)
+ Shields to Maximum! (6)
Kuat Refit (112 + 9)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Reinforced Blast Doors (5)
Kuat Refit (112 + 9)
+ Ordnance Experts (4)
+ Reinforced Blast Doors (5)

Yeah, those aint much better at the same time, are they?

This is what we Rebels must look forward to.

Just now, Drasnighta said:

Yeah, those aint much better at the same time, are they?

This is what we Rebels must look forward to.

Speak for yourself, you filthy traitor.

Just now, Drasnighta said:

Especially on the long-range platform of the Cymoon. It doesn't have to dive in, and can outwin a standoff fight, forcing rebels into the fray where they probably don't want to be.

It wins at range anyway with or without shield regen.

Who exactly thinks that Shield to max is good? Or in fact that any engineering based build is good?

See that fleet you just posted is much better.

1 hour ago, xanderf said:

And it does give Tarkin some slight edge over Thrawn in that case, no?

Only if the ships have squadron dial or you won't activate any squadron at all and get this:

You know, I had a whole piece written here about Engineering Builds and, instead, why we should be supportive of playstyles rather than deriding people for their choices.

But its hardly relevant in the end.

48 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

You know, I had a whole piece written here about Engineering Builds and, instead, why we should be supportive of playstyles rather than deriding people for their choices.

But its hardly relevant in the end.

I get that. However, if people want to take engineering builds and it was legal to stack shields to max then I would have no problems with them doing so as it still wouldnt be overpowered.

I hope someone proves me wrong at some point.

1 hour ago, Ginkapo said:

I get that. However, if people want to take engineering builds and it was legal to stack shields to max then I would have no problems with them doing so as it still wouldnt be overpowered.

I hope someone proves me wrong at some point.

I advise people how to play the game correctly .

That's all I'm good for.

Whereas people like you are seemingly able to advise people how to play the game well .

That's not something I can do from any legitimate standpoint, since my one call for success doesn't physically work anymore.

4 hours ago, ovinomanc3r said:

Only if the ships have squadron dial or you won't activate any squadron at all and get this:

Well if Tarkin is dealing out squad tokens, then it really doesn't matter what the ships dial in, no? They all get a token, anyway, so can each activate at least one squadron. (Not saying this is a great plan - about the only real uses I'm coming up with for this are turn 1 AFFM for striking from advanced positions as a result of using the Fighter Ambush objective + relay shuttles. Or lists that want to run at their max fighter compliment the whole game - handing out squadron tokens to everyone is kinda like a free Expanded Hangar.)

I sort of think Thrawn is better overall than Tarkin, most the time, but in kicking around some of the new builds that Chimaera is making possible - notably AFFM with a large number of support ships and massive squadron count - it seemed to be we may have a spot where Tarkin provides some better value.

18 hours ago, Ginkapo said:

I get that. However, if people want to take engineering builds and it was legal to stack shields to max then I would have no problems with them doing so as it still wouldnt be overpowered.

I hope someone proves me wrong at some point.

I think the ships you would have to take to get stacking STM would effectively kill itself. 2-3 Cymoons or 2-3 Peltas. The Cymoon is effectively stronger because they are larger, but you seriously cut into the rest of your build since that is nearly 300 points with a commander. So you get stuck with 2 ships and squads, or 2 ISDs and Riaders or Gozantis.

And the Rebels have 2 Peltas... Which I think speaks for itself.

The best way to counter STM is to focus on one ship, which you should already be doing anyway.

So I agree. STM is hardly over powered, even if it could stack. Fleet builds just can't support it. Ultimately you are building a reactive fleet which tend to be weaker, which is also the weakness of Eng fleet builds. 8 Eng Interdictors can be hard to kill, but those fleets really can't do much else except stay alive.

4 minutes ago, Undeadguy said:

And the Rebels have 2 Peltas... Which I think speaks for itself.

Stop making me feel sorry for the Rebels

4 minutes ago, Undeadguy said:

I think the ships you would have to take to get stacking STM would effectively kill itself. 2-3 Cymoons or 2-3 Peltas. The Cymoon is effectively stronger because they are larger, but you seriously cut into the rest of your build since that is nearly 300 points with a commander. So you get stuck with 2 ships and squads, or 2 ISDs and Riaders or Gozantis.

And the Rebels have 2 Peltas... Which I think speaks for itself.

The best way to counter STM is to focus on one ship, which you should already be doing anyway.

So I agree. STM is hardly over powered, even if it could stack. Fleet builds just can't support it. Ultimately you are building a reactive fleet which tend to be weaker, which is also the weakness of Eng fleet builds. 8 Eng Interdictors can be hard to kill, but those fleets really can't do much else except stay alive.

STM is actually quite strong, but also niche.

Use it with 4 Hammerheads with TFA and suddenly it makes a bit more sense.

Now throw in Proj Experts.

1 minute ago, Green Knight said:

STM is actually quite strong, but also niche.

Use it with 4 Hammerheads with TFA and suddenly it makes a bit more sense.

Now throw in Proj Experts.

Right, this would be the only exception. I almost went into it but decided not to. TFA gets around the weakness of Eng builds because you can force your own shields down. Otherwise your build relies on tanking damage rather than dealing it out. Win via attrition.

5 minutes ago, Megatronrex said:

Stop making me feel sorry for the Rebels

Don't pity them. Just vaporize them. Peace at least.

Just now, Undeadguy said:

Don't pity them. Just vaporize them. Peace at least.

If their running two Peltas I'll consider it a mercy kill.

5 minutes ago, Undeadguy said:

Right, this would be the only exception. I almost went into it but decided not to. TFA gets around the weakness of Eng builds because you can force your own shields down. Otherwise your build relies on tanking damage rather than dealing it out. Win via attrition.

Also, the Pelta itself with Raymus and STM! can regenerate a respectable 4 shields if targeted.

10 minutes ago, Green Knight said:

Also, the Pelta itself with Raymus and STM! can regenerate a respectable 4 shields if targeted.

Annoying if it survives, but it's still a Pelta haha

Fleet 1540 (400/400)
===================
Cymoon 1 Refit (112 + 51)
+ Grand Moff Tarkin (38)
+ Gunnery Team (7)
+ Shields to Maximum! (6)
Cymoon 1 Refit (112 + 13)
+ Gunnery Team (7)
+ Shields to Maximum! (6)
Interdictor Combat Refit (93 + 19)
+ Captain Needa (2)
+ Disposable Capacitors (3)
+ Targeting Scrambler (5)
+ Projection Experts (6)
+ Interdictor (3)

Tarkin could go on the Interdoctor. No squadrons but those have good AA fire!

It means 2 shields + 4 engineering points + 2 shields from Doc. Looks fun at least.

2 minutes ago, Undeadguy said:

Annoying if it survives, but it's still a Pelta haha

Hey, I'm trying to be positive here!