Aha! Check scum!
We can win I think. Studying permutations but I think this is gonna work!
[Mafia] CorSec Training - DAY 3
And this is exactly why ImpCap's fake claim makes sense. We have a great chance of nailing scum with our lynch today, and with his fake claim, he forced the attention to him and me, since the scum would have to know the cop would counterclaim. All it takes is them swaying two townies to end the game. The list of suspects are Ovi, Cal, Pod, ImpCap (scum), and Toad.
Sadly the idea was not so good but opened interesting ways of thought.
@CaribbeanNinja I need a piece of help here.
We both are in a similar situation. Both have a cop who defends us. However I mist say that it doesn't mean too much. As long as there is to claims any of us is 100% town (from a 3rd point of view) but the opposite is also true. It would be a good move for a scum claiming cop who point to townies to support his claim at least in the heat of the investigated guys. Considering that if we decide to vote between JJ and Norell where would be your vote and why?
You mean between JJ and ImpCap?
1 minute ago, CaribbeanNinja said:You mean between JJ and ImpCap?
Yeah lol!
I won but I ended exhausted
No idea! (meta: It is pretty awesome actually. This has been the most fun game in a while I think. Cheers Nips)
I'm going to have to go back and check it all. I was totally convinced ImpCap was our cop.
With JJ throwing that at us Ive gotta go back and re read it all tonight.
(I am giddily awaiting ImpCaps response though
)
@ImperialCaptain2017 why did you investigate me N1?
@JJs Juggernaut what are your thoughts about Cal and Toad?
9 minutes ago, CaribbeanNinja said:No idea!
There is a correct answer! Help me help you!!
1 hour ago, JJs Juggernaut said:And this is exactly why ImpCap's fake claim makes sense. We have a great chance of nailing scum with our lynch today, and with his fake claim, he forced the attention to him and me, since the scum would have to know the cop would counterclaim. All it takes is them swaying two townies to end the game. The list of suspects are Ovi, Cal, Pod, ImpCap (scum), and Toad.
That's your list what I am sure you understand is far from being trustworthy.
Please, could you suggest and alternative to you-Imp? Empathy from your part could be helpful.
My initial thoughts about Cal and Toad, I'm pretty sure one of them is scum, but I'm not sure which one. I'll try and look back a little later tonight, since I'm almost certainly not going to make it through the night.
I'm not sure why you would consider asking for an alternative though...I know for a fact ImpCap is scum, there is no reason not to kill him, when there is a chance we could be wrong about anyone else. The infuriating point comes from the fact that the scum have it set up enough to where my claim isn't instantly believable.
8 minutes ago, JJs Juggernaut said:My initial thoughts about Cal and Toad, I'm pretty sure one of them is scum, but I'm not sure which one. I'll try and look back a little later tonight, since I'm almost certainly not going to make it through the night.
I'm not sure why you would consider asking for an alternative though...I know for a fact ImpCap is scum, there is no reason not to kill him, when there is a chance we could be wrong about anyone else. The infuriating point comes from the fact that the scum have it set up enough to where my claim isn't instantly believable.
I know three things 100%.sure. I am town. Norell is town. You and Imp won't die tonight.
An alternative is the best way you could help us cause, as you said your claim means just that you or imp is scum. You "bought" Cninja's support as Imp "bought" mine. But from the point of view of any player but you and Imp your claims don't help at all. I have some opinions about several options. What do you think about a no-lynch for example?
Meta: I need to sleep and I blame I was not able to choose right under the time pressure.
@TheToad why did you vote Cal when your reason was that Pod defended him?
Your argument was that Pod was being scumly incoherent so Cal was scum also and Pod tried to protect him. With that logic I have to say that as long as it could be a scummy trick (to defend a town) the only sure thing in your logic was that Pod must be scum but you voted Cal. Again: why?
On 27/9/2017 at 3:32 AM, JJs Juggernaut said:Just back now after a very busy day of exams and work.
I'm not sure how I feel about the whole Cal situation. I'm not convinced either way. Potentially some opportunistic scum jumping on him, or Cal was cleverly backpedaling.
As for Ebon's suspicion of me, well that just rather reinforces my suspicions. It's day one, and with an open setup there isn't much to go on. Ninja's move was the most potentially scummy thing I saw, so it's were my vote went. I actually am more convinced by Ninja's response that he is town and it was well intentioned, however your response to me is now what feels scummy.
##unvote
##vote EbonHawk
So you voted Ebon and changed on Mad without conviction but investigated CNinja at night instead of your top1 Ebon?
I won't be here to help more than that. I agree with CNinja it was fun. I think I could end with something better but it is late so briefly those are my thoughts:
JJ is lying. The counterclaim just mud the waters and came at the perfect time with the perfect excuse. From the "cop" on the wrong side both times. From those who changed the wagon without any other reason that the "we need the lynch" at d1 is the only one not proved yet.
I am not sure about CNinja but I think he is town used as a cover by JJ. He was quite diplomatic after JJ's claim. Being too agressive against Imp or me wouldn't have been clever but he had room to push and decided to wait. Actually it has sense. JJ already has 2 supports so better to get another one and if he counter is backfired CNinja could be hanged helping the remaining scum.
The ToadvsCal thing was started by Pod. Those three names are shady. Cal AND Toad cannot be town. Otherwise we would have just 2 scum and we know they are three. One or both are scum. I have hard time thinking on both as scum it means that a townie Pod choose wisely and the scum put the things between 2 scum? That's help the town! It has more sense a scum (Pod) pointing a scum (Toad) who brings a town (Cal) into a 50% fight.
Tl;dr JJ, Pod and Toad are the scum.
It has no sense to wait. If we lynch and fail we lose. If we don't lynch, Norell will die and we get nothing new. The cop will be counterclaimed again.
## vote JJ
The rest is up to you. Please don't blame me. I am tired and for some reason I feel the only one really thinking at all. I did my best. Good night and good luck.
Aw **** I thought we had another day. 7 hours.
Noop, 7 hours and ovi has just told me voting for my top two suspects is scummy, and insisted I blindly follow him on JJ because it suits his theories better.
I hope he's meme machine again next time...
4 hours ago, JJs Juggernaut said:Whoaah! A lot of interesting developments going on here! I have been gone all weekend, just like I told you all I would, yet I've still had shade thrown my way...The only time I was able to check back in, it was night.
However, now that I'm back, I know what I have to do.
##vote ImperialCaptain2017
He is lying about being the cop. I am the cop!!!
I'm not entirely certain about the logic of fake claiming, especially without a fake "scum" read to try and force a quick hammer. Perhaps he thinks that everyone will believe him because he claimed first?
I investigated Ninja night one (due to my suspicions of him day 1), he is Town. I investigated Norell night two since we needed to check him after Vis flipped town. He is Town. Those are the only two people I trust right now.
.........Well that was unexpected....
Not quite sure where to start.
JJ, why would I fake claim that I know nothing about the scum? It would make absolutely no sense, especially since I'm going to get nightkilled for claiming. Also, if I was trying to force a quick hammer, why did I wait as long as I did to claim?
You said you don't understand the logic of fake claiming...it seems that you're right, except it's your claim that is illogical. Why would a real cop throw accusations like crazy at a person who is hypothetically fake claiming when the claimer has shown no threat to them or, in fact, anyone at all?
I've said my piece for now on this subject. Meanwhile:
2 hours ago, ovinomanc3r said:@ImperialCaptain2017 why did you investigate me N1?
@JJs Juggernaut what are your thoughts about Cal and Toad?
In answer to your question, Ovi, I investigated you because of your seemingly scummy lack of memes and jokes. Turns out, it wasn't scummy after all.
I get your logic Ovi. However it is flawed. I jumped too eagerly on the counterclaim because to me it makes perfect sense to out the scum. I see now that it's not so clear cut from your perspective. Your arguments make me think you are town, but you have the wrong person!!! Seriously, look back on ImpCap's play! He's adding nothing of really use to the game, and as even casually muddied the waters on several occasions. If you lynch me the game ends. We have to hit a scum now, and that is ImpCap.
Yeah, sure...you can keep that argument up all you like, but ovi following you makes perfect sense now. By not claiming to have found a scum, you setup the perfect excuse to lynch the real cop on the counter claim...It was really well done, and I didn't see it until now. The town needs to trust me on this one!
2 minutes ago, JJs Juggernaut said:Yeah, sure...you can keep that argument up all you like, but ovi following you makes perfect sense now. By not claiming to have found a scum, you setup the perfect excuse to lynch the real cop on the counter claim...It was really well done, and I didn't see it until now. The town needs to trust me on this one!
You flatter me too much, JJ- I'm not that good at Mafia. Take it or leave it, my claim stands.
On 9/25/2017 at 5:31 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Welcome @EbonHawk ! I hope you enjoy the game.
Meanwhile...good to know there won't be a roleblocker to deal with. I'll check back later as things develop.
On 9/25/2017 at 5:33 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:@Onidsen , you've been a bit quiet. Your thoughts on this setup and where we should go from here?
On 9/25/2017 at 10:17 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:I'll go to bed and check back in the morning...I'll worry about this later.
On 9/26/2017 at 6:17 AM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Ok then. I'm sure they do have night chat, though. Since they don't have day chat, it's possible that CNinja is right about JJ's "helpfulness". However, there's no real proof yet and we're just shooting in the dark. That being said, I think if we see any more noob advice thrown around we might have reason to be suspicious.
On 9/26/2017 at 4:26 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Sorry @JJs Juggernaut ...my mistake.
To your question, Toad, that is called "me at 6:15 in the morning".
On 9/26/2017 at 4:28 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:BTW, I don't see enough claim/breadcrumb/whatever you want to call it from Cal to vote on him. I don't feel like making a Cal lynch train unless we really have no other options.
On 9/26/2017 at 4:44 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:I want to hear from a few more people first. Personally I think it's always hard to tell D1, so I will wait a bit longer before deciding on a vote. Probably (for once) agreeing with Pod that it's a quiet person, but not sure who.
On 9/26/2017 at 8:48 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Well, Cal seemed to explain himself rather reasonably. It didn't sound like a rock solid claim in the first place. That's not to say that he couldn't be just a really clever goon, but he seems clear for now. Meanwhile, I found this somewhat interesting:
When I made that mistake, it was just that- a mistake, and I apologised & explained. However, Vis doing the same thing after I was called out for it still seems weird. I don't see reason to lynch him, but my scum detector is starting to beep.
On 9/26/2017 at 8:56 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Also realizing that Ovi, Toad, Mads, and Onidsen have been somewhat quiet. Unless any last-minute scumminess arrives in the next hour or so, I'm going to turn in for the night and:
##vote Madaghmire
Because voting for a quieter, semi-suspicious person is the best thing I can come up with right now. I'll check back either late tonight or tomorrow.
On 9/28/2017 at 6:18 AM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:WELL then, this is getting interesting fast.
First things first, about Mads...sorry for starting a lynch train on a townie. I screwed up, plain and simple. Personally, I was hoping that a vote or two would get his attention/force him to be a bit more involved, but that wasn't what happened. Meanwhile:
Not sure why the goons went for EbonHawk yet. Perhaps because he was suspecting JJ and Cal? That's all I can think of for why they'd knock off the new guy.
On 9/28/2017 at 4:38 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Catching up now...
After reading through the alibis given by Onidsen, Vis, and Norell, Norell's at the top of my list. His reasoning doesn't seem very thorough, and would make a classic cover for a scumvote ("I just had to make sure we got a lynch in, guys").
That being said, I'm not sure I believe any of them, so no certain vote yet.
On 9/28/2017 at 4:43 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Just noticed the irony in this post. CNinja was the first vote on Madaghmire within 5 minutes after I suggested it. Hmm. I know that being first on the lynch train is less suspicious than going last, but this eagerness still rings a few alarm bells to me.
Ideas? It would be good to hear some more from @JJs Juggernaut ...
On 9/28/2017 at 4:50 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Gah...I really need to pay more attention. Excuse me while I eat my words.
On 9/28/2017 at 9:10 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Well, to clarify, I started the Mads vote (on a crazy hypothesis right before I went to bed).
As for you, JJ, I was curious about the EbonHawk thing that you brought up in your post, and you answered my question. You said that scum were throwing shade on you by killing him. However, from our perspective (or at least from mine) it could look like you or an ally of yours killed him to keep us off your trail. Just saying that it can seem that way...
On 9/29/2017 at 4:46 AM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Just so y'all know, I'll be away for a bit today...be back ASAP
On 9/29/2017 at 4:18 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Hi all,
So...as for Ovi, I see what he's doing as just out of character, not scum. I like Onidsen's idea to lynch one of Norell or Vis and have the cop investigate the other. However, it is possible that one of them could be hiding a power role, in which case we would be thoroughly screwed. We'll have to take the risk, though, so I'll put my vote where my suspicion is:
##vote Norell
On 9/29/2017 at 4:50 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:I should have clarified-I meant a town power role, i.e. Doc or Cop.
On 9/29/2017 at 10:17 PM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Since flipflopping/last-minute bandwagoning is what got Vis and Norell in the hot seat, I'm sticking by my vote.
On 10/1/2017 at 7:55 AM, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Well then...won't this be a fun day cycle.
So here's where we stand- out of the 8 of us that are left, we have 3 goons and 1 cop. The other 4 are vanilla town. LYLO it is, then.
I have no read on Pod (as usual), and no clear scumminess from Norell other than the mess during the Mads lynch. CNinja confuses me, but doesn't ring scum. JJ and Toad have been kinda quiet, but the last time we lynched someone for being quiet was Mads, so I'm holding off there. Ovi took a while to act like his normal self, but now seems ok. RL distractions maybe? Cal was accused earlier and seemed clean then, but now I need to look back at everything.
Gah...so hard to decide.
@TheToad , @JJs Juggernaut , haven't heard from you in a while. We need your input...
22 hours ago, ImperialCaptain2017 said:Well...I guess a 3/5 chance is the best we're going to get, and I'm tired of hiding and shooting in the dark. May as well be helpful.
I'm the cop. Surprise!
I investigated Ovi and Norell, and they are both (vanilla) town. That means that our goons are somewhere in this group: CNinja, Cal, Pod, JJ, Toad.
Ideas? I tend to suspect Toad because of the novote call, but I'm open to other suggestions...
(BTW, I know that I have just signed my own death warrant, but I've been killed in every Mafia game I've ever played, so it's nothing new to me
14 hours ago, ImperialCaptain2017 said:He was probably going to be my next investigation after N1, but then the whole Norell-Vis thing happened...
Meanwhile, the longer JJ stays out of the conversation, the more I suspect him. Pod's sudden vote is probably just Pod being Pod, CNinja doesn't seem suspicious (but then, he almost never seems suspicious), Cal I'm not sure about, and Toad is still high on my radar after the Novote call. Be back with a vote later...
10 minutes ago, ImperialCaptain2017 said:.........Well that was unexpected....
Not quite sure where to start.
JJ, why would I fake claim that I know nothing about the scum? It would make absolutely no sense, especially since I'm going to get nightkilled for claiming. Also, if I was trying to force a quick hammer, why did I wait as long as I did to claim?
You said you don't understand the logic of fake claiming...it seems that you're right, except it's your claim that is illogical. Why would a real cop throw accusations like crazy at a person who is hypothetically fake claiming when the claimer has shown no threat to them or, in fact, anyone at all?
I've said my piece for now on this subject. Meanwhile:
In answer to your question, Ovi, I investigated you because of your seemingly scummy lack of memes and jokes. Turns out, it wasn't scummy after all.
3 minutes ago, ImperialCaptain2017 said:You flatter me too much, JJ- I'm not that good at Mafia. Take it or leave it, my claim stands.
Every post by ImpCap. Rereading them, he seems to have posted more that I remember. However since I doubt people will listen to what I have to say (they never seem to at least), I'll let you make your own conclusions from it. I found his accusations towards me suspicious earlier, especially trying to bring suspicion on me for being gone WHEN I SAID I WOULD BE GONE. Sorry, guess my turbo lynch PTSD is kicking in a bit. I was just about to take a closer look at him when the fake claim happened.
Right, whilst the cops compare posts im going to ## unvote
Sorry Toad, Ovis last post makes me think I have been too eager to judge you on previous days, but even I cant let Cal be cleared as town whilst you me and JJ take the votes.
The fact that Oni and impcap had been my strongest townreads with ninja coming in to today is out the window now. I have been a fool in this one right through, im putting it down to mafia burnout if thats a thing.
im leaning no vote, because my votes just seem to cause more problems than they solve and I cant actually see a spot that will get 5 votes in 6 hours if ovi sticks to his guns. Not even Cal.
I'm actually struggling with the whole thing.
If ImpCap is scum: Why pull a fakeclaim? We were/are getting totally destroyed by the three goons, and had no clue which direction to go. (**** we were headed to a no-vote)
If JJ is scum: Why pull a counterclaim? Wouldn't it be better to take his chances? (I know I'd have done a counterclaim right away for ****'s and giggles, but that isn't JJs style at all.)