Out of the current powerhouses I’ve only ever played TLT. Neither my friend or have played with or against it before hand. And we quickly saw how powerful they were. If I remember correctly I wiped his U-wing (it was that kind of game) off the board in one round.

I agree it’s powerful. But for my experience it keeps ships otherwise not played on the board. Y-wing/ HWK

I do think that it is way more cool thing to actually do well in tournaments with my own squad. Not big fan of those "meta" squads that many are playing.

I find mindset is the single most determining factor in game enjoyment, and this applies to every game. If you have a winning mindset you are unlikely to really enjoy playing the game. You'll enjoy the outcome sometimes, but rarely the actual gameplay. If you have a I want to play the game the way I like mindset you're also likely to be dissatisfied as others may not share your perspective. If you approach things from the mindset of trying to enjoy flying your best and enjoying the little puzzles presented to you, you'll rarely be dissatisfied.

I've only been to one store tournament and it was a lot of fun. I had Dash and a BB8 Norra. I was pretty far down the pecking order, but was able to stay in all my games except one. I hope to go to a regional tournament next and expect to see a much more meta list of ships, and will tweak my list accordingly. I seem to enjoy same as you where I like to play in games that are close. I usually choose my lists against my friend and brother to match up so we are close.

I do wish they would stop releasing so many high level pilots with great abilities. A PS 5 Nym probably is much better for the game. They started to fill the mid level ranks with named 4, 5, and 6 and 7 level pilots. I think they should have kept the majority of named pilots here and left only a couple in the 8 and 9 slots

1 minute ago, wkf04a said:

I find mindset is the single most determining factor in game enjoyment, and this applies to every game. If you have a winning mindset you are unlikely to really enjoy playing the game. You'll enjoy the outcome sometimes, but rarely the actual gameplay. If you have a I want to play the game the way I like mindset you're also likely to be dissatisfied as others may not share your perspective. If you approach things from the mindset of trying to enjoy flying your best and enjoying the little puzzles presented to you, you'll rarely be dissatisfied.

I’m not sure it’s that simple.

For example, I have a ‘winning’ mindset, but focused on how *I* do. I actively want to get better, and winning Ian one component I used to determine that.

But that doesn’t mean I don’t have fun even when I lose (I do), but I always want to feel like I’m actively learning and getting better.

20 minutes ago, Zazaa said:

I do think that it is way more cool thing to actually do well in tournaments with my own squad. Not big fan of those "meta" squads that many are playing.

While I generally agree, you also have the cases of convergent list building. I have friends that came up with Palp Aces on their own, but others debuted it first, so they got "netlister" looks.

-slinks in from the shadows-

Hi! Rebel player here... and, I don't actually find meta builds fun. Yeah, I still use Sabine, but RARELY in anything that already has a bomb slot. I don't use K-Wings (I actually don't own any), I avoid TLTs (I prefer ion cannons turrets), and I'm still trying to figure out if I like Nym or not (to be fair, I mostly got the Scurrg to give my Punishers a bump). Basically, I don't like using tools/pilots/ships that will make the experience not fun for the person I'm playing or forces me to use a ship I don't particularly like or find fun to fly. I still use bombs and Sabine, but in ways they were (in my opinion) meant to be used. Maybe I'm odd, but I'd rather lose and have fun than win and be bored out of my mind.

41 minutes ago, Tlfj200 said:

I have a winning mindset, but focused on how *I* do. I actively want to get better

Right, I think we've just misunderstood each other somewhat. While that is the best approach for someone looking to win, the mindset you bring isn't about the outcome of winning, it's about the process of improving. Whatever motivates that process doesn't really impact enjoyment, imo, just that your approach (which is the best approach!) doesn't hinge on winning as the only desirable outcome (in fact, it sounds like you aren't focused on the outcome very much at all). When I say winning mindset, I'm really addressing the people whose only enjoyment of the game is in its outcome, namely victory, when their desired outcome isn't reached no enjoyment was had.

57 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

While I generally agree, you also have the cases of convergent list building. I have friends that came up with Palp Aces on their own, but others debuted it first, so they got "netlister" looks.

I have the feeling many people have run into this. Many netlists are variations of what are otherwise very good combinations. I've done it before, and I'm sure it'll happen again sometime.

Just now, ScummyRebel said:

I have the feeling many people have run into this. Many netlists are variations of what are otherwise very good combinations. I've done it before, and I'm sure it'll happen again sometime.

Exactly. There is a finite amount of card combinations and there will be superior combos. Multiple people can come to the same conclusion in list building without ever dealing with each other or seeing tournament results.

7 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

You are not forced into that meta. Imperial Aces work with Vader, QuickDraw and Kylo Ren in a OGP. And Corran Horn with Nymm has proven its worth as well is different from the rest of the meta in some ways too. In general there are options, heck even FSR is a break, even when it is imho a very boring list to fly.

Tried that list actually, but it feels one dimensional compared to the other t1 builds. Corran + Nym is still 2 ship Nym cheese. Is rebels, and I dont ahve the tie nor 2 wookiees, and its boring. There aren't any other Imperial builds, the rest are rebel and scum stuff, with NYm and Dengar and Miranda cheese.

3 hours ago, JJ48 said:

It all comes from listening to that no-good, cantina-style space jazz, I shouldn't wonder!

It's called jizz, Dad!

(Seriously)

1 minute ago, Sekac said:

It's called jizz, Dad!

(Seriously)

The Modal Nodes are the greatest jizz-wailers in the galaxy! They can sure put the jizz in your ears!

(George Lucas, sometimes I really wonder about you)

1 minute ago, GrimmyV said:

(George Lucas, sometimes I really wonder about you)

Just as I'm sure he wondered why everyone was snickering in the writers' room.

4 minutes ago, Sekac said:

Just as I'm sure he wondered why everyone was snickering in the writers' room.

Funny. I picture George Lucas giggling, barely able to restrain himself from fully belly-laughs while explaining it to his team, while everyone else in the room just sighs and rolls their eyes.

For me: The bomb meta is not fun period. It's not fun flying and outmaneuver your opponent and then having a ship can at PS-10 Advance sensors, to Barrel Roll, drop a bomb that it is immune to and Autoturret and AC you, so you have no chance to even avoid the damage. I have found myself missing X-wing nights quite frequently. Sometimes because of work and sometimes because I just don't feel like it. Which is amazing, because I have been here since the first starter and always had fun with the game. Honestly, I think the games downfall is the following:

1) The designers have lost touch with the game and the meta.

2) The designers let the new guy in (Not Mentioning Names) and since then almost everything he has put out has been broken. Which I blame on the Designers for not QC'd well enough.

3) They are not keeping old ships fresh any longer, with new upgrades or titles. You have to buy the new ships to compete.

4) These new meta's have really made the game boring. In the old days it was about out flying your opponent, bumping to take away their actions, blocking to stop their movements, etc. Now so many things give actions even if they bump it's just taken a lot of the strategy away from the game. You really in most cases with certain ships don't ever have to face your opponent and can spend the whole game running.

5) High Health Small Ships, which you don't get half points for. Small ships with 9+ shield and hull should give you half points. This would force them to fight after taking damage, instead of running the entire game.

Also, I spend hours working and go to the game store to play. I face fair ship rebels or something like Nymgar, three K-wings with TLT and bombs, and TLT Ghosts, etc. Which basically means unless I'm flying something close to the meta, it's near impossible to win. simply because of the interactions. Which I usually can do nothing about, believe me it's frustrating. Meta lists are beatable, but now at this time, not fun to play against..

I think they need to break Tournaments into waves of ships. Upgrades can be used on any ships.

They could have Wave 1 - Wave 4, Wave 5-8, and Wave 9 to Current, with an overall tournament including all waves. Or some other suitable breakdown.

If you don't have the money to keep buying the new stuff, then you sometimes just cannot compete. Which is driving a lot of players in my area out of the game. It's the 40k and Fantasy Syndrome all over again.

I like that tournament grouping system.

"Which division are you competing in? I signed up for Division 1 and 3 'cause I want to wreck face with my Luke list, AND Nym is pretty sweet too."

I play with scum and Nym seems to me very boring, maybe the rebel version see some tactic, but my favourite pilot from that is Sol Sixxa. It's reeeally funny.

In line with boring lists, Personally I think that flying any list with full Turrets (As Triple or Double Jumpmaster or Thug Life) is the most boring way of play in X Wing.

4 hours ago, Kdubb said:

I honestly don't mind playing against turrets and bombs, or against them, with one caveat- that I'm flying something with turrets as well. And that's where the issue lies. Not that turrets are utterly unfun. It's that they make something else utterly unfun against them.

Oh man. I feel so sad. I just went over all of my TIE striker games in my head (~13 games) and I realized that I lost against any squad with a primary weapon turret. I don't know how I didn't notice that until now. I guess I just got lucky, and was paired up with a bunch of arc-locked squads. I only have 4 losses out of those 13 games. How is it possible that I only faced 4 squads with primary weapon turrets? Easy - lose the first two games, get sent to the bottom tables, then dominate. Oh, but some of those games were so close! I still think they have it in them. I just need to practice more.

Strikers are so hilariously bad vs turrets. Imo, the only time I got them to work was using Stridan Hux for extra tokens.

4 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Strikers are so hilariously bad vs turrets. Imo, the only time I got them to work was using Stridan Hux for extra tokens.

well, that's the problem with non-autoturrets in a game about maneuvering

it completely shifts the focus off of maneuvering and onto the dice, since you simply cannot avoid the attacks through flying

it's literally the reason FFG had to introduce autothrusters.

Did nobody mention Tommy, Jimmy and Spike yet? The seem very relevant to the discussion

2 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Tried that list actually, but it feels one dimensional compared to the other t1 builds. Corran + Nym is still 2 ship Nym cheese. Is rebels, and I dont ahve the tie nor 2 wookiees, and its boring. There aren't any other Imperial builds, the rest are rebel and scum stuff, with NYm and Dengar and Miranda cheese.

Sorry to hear that.

So limited in your ship collection that all you could try ended up boring for you, while it covers jousting efficiency lists, ace lists, bomber lists, etc
But the "best" imperial list is two one dimensional for you when compared to the other T1 lists, while the other tier one lists are too ... I don't know, apparently they are fun lists with lots of facets into playing them, but are too greasy for you. Maybe try Miranda + Lowhhrick + Biggs instead triple small ships and flying matters! ;-)

13 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

Sorry to hear that.

So limited in your ship collection that all you could try ended up boring for you, while it covers jousting efficiency lists, ace lists, bomber lists, etc
But the "best" imperial list is two one dimensional for you when compared to the other T1 lists, while the other tier one lists are too ... I don't know, apparently they are fun lists with lots of facets into playing them, but are too greasy for you. Maybe try Miranda + Lowhhrick + Biggs instead triple small ships and flying matters! ;-)

I did say above i enjoyed the Fenn Dengar Inaldra Mindlink, at least for choices and brute power. I cannot say that bomb lists don't have a lot of repositioning factors that are fun to think about. But honestly any sort of 2 ship dominated meta turns me way off.

I'm also tired of seeing the same common over-expected ships show up: Biggs, Miranda, Nym (both of these high HP primary and TLT turrets), Dengar, Lowrrhick. Pretty much the whole meta simply surrounds variations of these.

I appreciate the gesture though.

51 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Did nobody mention Tommy, Jimmy and Spike yet? The seem very relevant to the discussion

I always thought it was Johnny, not Jimmy. Right? Not sure on Tommy, as I've always considered myself a Johnny.

Spike is memorable because I hate Spikes.

jk I don't hate Spikes. I just hate losing to them because they always fly proven lists that are better than my "creative" jank. Lol