20 minutes ago, Jadotch said:

To 0?

Yup.

It would make sense to in a way. You can spend 0 points to get a +1 PS for all phases after deployment or spend 0 points for +2 only during the combat phase.

6 hours ago, HolySorcerer said:

Just a quick nerf idea for Veteran Instincts, change the text of the card to the below.

Would this change have a positive effect on the meta? It would certainly curtail a bit of the PS race, but would this lead to a better game, or just a different one?

Why does VI need a nerf?? Serious question.

1 hour ago, Rat of Vengence said:

Why does VI need a nerf?? Serious question.

Because it's the most used EPT by a WIDE margin, eclipsing all the other EPTs and lessening the diversity of builds we see in game.

1 hour ago, Rat of Vengence said:

Why does VI need a nerf?? Serious question.

Because every few waves it's existence causes the whole meta-game to devolve into these ridiculous PS wars. It's never been quite this bad, because we weren't coupling it with such huge damage potential before, but it does keep on happening. You can't just take it out of the picture, of course, as some ships (ie. Phantoms) have been built around having access to it, but some sort of limitation to put an end to these meta-stifling "get to double digits or GTFO" situations is long overdue.

24 minutes ago, Favoritism Flight Games said:

Because it's the most used EPT by a WIDE margin, eclipsing all the other EPTs and lessening the diversity of builds we see in game.

It's common, but I think that's going a bit far.

3 minutes ago, DR4CO said:

Because every few waves it's existence causes the whole meta-game to devolve into these ridiculous PS wars. It's never been quite this bad, because we weren't coupling it with such huge damage potential before, but it does keep on happening. You can't just take it out of the picture, of course, as some ships (ie. Phantoms) have been built around having access to it, but some sort of limitation to put an end to these meta-stifling "get to double digits or GTFO" situations is long overdue.

There's plenty of builds that are competitive right now that don't really care about PS. Besides, Han still needs to shoot first

RoV

8 hours ago, HolySorcerer said:

Just a quick nerf idea for Veteran Instincts, change the text of the card to the below.

Would this change have a positive effect on the meta? It would certainly curtail a bit of the PS race, but would this lead to a better game, or just a different one?

Yes, we would see 96 and 95 point bids. Sounds good.

11 minutes ago, Rat of Vengence said:

There's plenty of builds that are competitive right now that don't really care about PS. Besides, Han still needs to shoot first

It's more like the only builds that are competitive right now don't care about PS. Everyone who does care is losing to PS10 Nym.

11 minutes ago, spacelion said:

Yes, we would see 96 and 95 point bids. Sounds good.

Aside from Scum lists that are riding on a host of other balance problems, which lists would even be capable of bidding like that without throwing the game on the compromises they'd be making?

Just FAQ that the highest a PS can ever be is 9. If you Adaptability on Nym, he is still placed with the PS 8 kids. VI on him allows him to be placed with the PS 9 kids. I do like Clanofwolves initiative idea. knowing you have initiative every round is a powerful thing.

58 minutes ago, Rat of Vengence said:

It's common, but I think that's going a bit far.

I'll site you proof:

Upgrade Frequency since the release of Wave 11

You can see that VI is far and away the most used EPT with 1398 instances of it's use. The next closest are Push the Limit and Expertise with 760 and 742 uses respectively. It's basically twice as popular as the next used EPT. That's WAY WAY WAY WAY over-represented.

12 minutes ago, Favoritism Flight Games said:

I'll site you proof:

Upgrade Frequency since the release of Wave 11

You can see that VI is far and away the most used EPT with 1398 instances of it's use. The next closest are Push the Limit and Expertise with 760 and 742 uses respectively. It's basically twice as popular as the next used EPT. That's WAY WAY WAY WAY over-represented.

Yeeeah. But look at what's at the top of that list. Everything Nym--650 Havoc titles. If something like a third (conservatively!) of your instances are on one ship, maybe the problem is with the ship and not the EPT?

23 minutes ago, Favoritism Flight Games said:

I'll site you proof:

Upgrade Frequency since the release of Wave 11

You can see that VI is far and away the most used EPT with 1398 instances of it's use. The next closest are Push the Limit and Expertise with 760 and 742 uses respectively. It's basically twice as popular as the next used EPT. That's WAY WAY WAY WAY over-represented.

You also have to take into account price. At one point, it kind of makes sense it's seen more than Push the Limit at 3 points and Expertise at 4.

So what I'm reading here is that arc dodging super aces are only a problem when they're Imperial.

13 minutes ago, Naechtweard said:

Yeeeah. But look at what's at the top of that list. Everything Nym--650 Havoc titles. If something like a third (conservatively!) of your instances are on one ship, maybe the problem is with the ship and not the EPT?

Oh yeah, don't get me wrong. Nym is RUINING the game. He's perp #1, FBI Most Wanted, the Pablo Escobar of X-Wing. If not for that bloated, under-costed, anal-tumor of a ship the game would be in MUCH better shape. He's single-handedly driving the PS war, and surprise he's the best ship in the game because he does EVERYTHING better than all other ships.

I like that rule change, make it in the rules that you can't increase your pilot skill to more than 9, and then change how initiative is assigned (in tournaments you should give it to whoever is losing the most haha). But make it a coin flip/dice roll always

It's not the PS itself that is the problem, it's nym and his ability to react with perfect information.

If you lower nym's PS to 8, yes, it allows ps 9+ aces to be be used, but it leaves PS 8 or lower aces in the dumpster, since nym has a fat initiative bid and the underlying problem has not been solved.

Some suggested solutions that if implemented, would fix this issue, and Nym in general.

1. Prohibit Advanced Sensors from allowing repositioning, to stop Nym from being a problem, and this problem from getting worse with Kylo.

2. Make dropping a bomblet stress you, and not work while stressed to introduce actual times when you don't drop a bomblet to stop it from being spammed each turn.

3. Make bomblet not capable of doing critical hits (possibly nothing on crit results either) to not have them powercreep all other (already strong) bombs.

It's the exact same problem with pre-nerf whisper, who also had perfect repositioning that couldn't be feasibly blocked. If she was PS 8 the issue would still have existed, albeit for a different bracket of PS.

Currently, Nym is a pre-nerf whisper at PS 10, 250% the health amount, autodamage and a turret, in exhange for not having as many green and red dice. He needs to be addressed, not VI. If you want to be heavy handed and simple about it, strip the EPT from all Scurrgs. It's shaping up to be Jumpmaster 2.0.

Treat the actual disease, not the symptoms.

20 minutes ago, GILLIES291 said:

I like that rule change, make it in the rules that you can't increase your pilot skill to more than 9, and then change how initiative is assigned (in tournaments you should give it to whoever is losing the most haha). But make it a coin flip/dice roll always

Initiative is a big factor in some matches- it can decide entire games fairly often. Making it random would be worse for the game. Without players being able to influence who gets it, it effectively leaves the game up to a coin flip.

You could potentially have it go round-by-round akin to Imperial Assault, but that would get confusing fast.

1 hour ago, Kaptin Krunch said:

You could potentially have it go round-by-round akin to Imperial Assault, but that would get confusing fast.

There is an initiative token included in TFA core set for such purposes...

19 minutes ago, Archangelspiv said:

There is an initiative token included in TFA core set for such purposes...

It would be a great idea to implement it, as having such a potentially important factor in the game be only decided once is terrible.

Alongside a change to the PS 0 crit so that if multiple people got it would make initiative not affect their order (eg, in cases where 2 people get it, whomever gets it later is lower PS) to stop the confusion that may arise if 2 people forget about initiative until the damage deck decrees it to be relevant.

My concern was about potential 'community' backlash. While I don't think that it would be too complex for anyone I know, there are 'people'(or gophers in trench coats) on this forum that find dividing by 2 for MoV too complex.

I completely agree KK that initiative only being decided once is terrible, it is so important that lists are built around this one mechanic. Adding some randomness would add a lot of flavour IMO.

11 hours ago, Boom Owl said:

The more I think about this, the more it seems like a bad idea.

The bigger problem I see right now is that they and the players are obsessed with wanting so many good upgrades or mechanics on so many ships.

It should surprise no one that there are super broken combos on ships that have access to many multiples of the best upgrade cards or abilities.

Pretending like there is only 1 specific reason why they are so powerful is sort of a waste of time since they will just evolve and adjust wave to wave.

1. Nym
   1. High PS
   2. Pre-Movement BR/Boost
   3. Turrets
   4. Bombs
   5. High HP
   6. Missiles
   7. Torp
   8. Crew
   9. Illicit
   10. Astromech
   11. Barrel Roll
   12. Talon Roll
2. Miranda
   1. Turret
   2. Missile
   3. Torp
   4. Crew
   5. Bomb 2x
   6. Slam
   7. Regen
3. JM5K
   1. EPT
   2. Torp
   3. Crew
   4. Astromech
   5. Illicit
   6. PWT
   7. Barrel Roll
   8. White Sloops
   9. Green/White 1 Hard Turns

Anytime they release such flexible ships they should be afraid of the possible consequences.

It happened with Miranda and the JM5K.....and again with Nym.

Point Cost so rarely seems like a consistent way of keeping single ship platforms like these in check unless they cross the 60 pt threshold, especially over time as new Upgrades get released.

Ships with "fewer" tricks seems like something we should all be asking for.

Captain Hindsight signing off.

This. No one element of almost any ship is broken (with the illogical mechanic of the 'quantum phantom')

It's always a combination of things that makes a ship far too good.

As an example, K4 security droid is something I see intermittently being called for nerfs on. Which - on the face of it, is ridiculous.

• It's the same price as Dengar (crew) , and does almost everything worse - it restricts your dial, only works once per turn, it telegraphs your intended target.....the only thing you better can do is fire ordnance with it.
• It came out with Most Wanted and did next to nothing. For a long time.
• It became a thing on the jumpmaster because you had the ability to pack the crew slot and a stupidly good dial and multiple torpedo slots and an elite slot for expertise (or originally deadeye). No one bit of those is broken, but together you get a ship which gets double-modified attacks on over half its dial despite getting blocked.

No one bit of Nym's abilities is 'broken'. But in combination he's incredibly powerful.

If I had to pick at a 'problem', I'd go for two:

• Bomblet Generators are fine rules-wise but could have done with being more expensive. I don't mind the idea of 'unlimited weak bombs' but they're not weak - Cad Bane and Sabine aside (let's leave that issue out of the debate), 2 damage dice = 1 automatic hit more or less, making them equivalent to a seismic charge. But, to make matters worse, they can cause criticals, and statistical variance results in 'lumpy' damage (0 to him, 2 to him) which is better at killing ships than 1 to everyone.
• I wish he was PS7. Not specifically out of any balance concerns (I play a squad of generics, so 'more than PS3' is enough that I don't care about the details), but Nym is 'you' in a star wars dogfighting game, making him the same as Keyan Farlander, Maarek Stele and Dash Rendar. All of these are PS7 with an elite slot; it bugs me that Nym isn't.

16 hours ago, Jadotch said:

I say increase Snap Shots range to 2. Or the dice to 3. Or both.

ahem,

4 hours ago, Marinealver said:

ahem,

And if he were 3 points cheaper he might even be usable!

7 hours ago, Archangelspiv said:

I completely agree KK that initiative only being decided once is terrible, it is so important that lists are built around this one mechanic. Adding some randomness would add a lot of flavour IMO.

I saw someone mention in the past to keep initiative based on points for the whole game based on start of round. You have initiative of 98-100, but blow up your opponents Academy TIE in the second round, start of 3rd they have initiative since they are now 88-98. It would cause some math during a match, but it shouldn't cause too many issues during play. I really like the way FFG handles this in Runewars, it is all based on the dial and it varies by unit each time.

36 minutes ago, Cusm said:

I saw someone mention in the past to keep initiative based on points for the whole game based on start of round. You have initiative of 98-100, but blow up your opponents Academy TIE in the second round, start of 3rd they have initiative since they are now 88-98. It would cause some math during a match, but it shouldn't cause too many issues during play. I really like the way FFG handles this in Runewars, it is all based on the dial and it varies by unit each time.

I really enjoy the Rune wars model, the only issue I see with the points style thing is that it supports 2 ship big base builds.

1 hour ago, HolySorcerer said:

And if he were 3 points cheaper he might even be usable!

If it is of any consolation in Armada he was so OP he had to be nerfed.