Okay: Let's share some things now...

"mercenary" faction - cards by me, @cynanbloodbane, @DiabloAzul and @Wes Janson

read more here: http://kdyards.com/expansions.view.php?id=1856

Undecided for now if Mercenary can be used by everyone, or is a self-contained faction, as yet.

15 minutes ago, GiledPallaeon said:

So would the theory then be that your TIE Fighter stands could still be TIE Fighters or TIE/sf fighters, and your Interceptors Silencers (bit more of a stretch), but telling them apart is a matter of knowing that your opponent is the First Order rather than the Empire?

In theory yes. However, I have no idea how to distinguish TIE/FOs and TIE/SFs model-wise within the faction. From a rules perspective it's easy. The TIE/SF has a turret and a significant payload. Add counter 2 and bomber. Silencers appear different enough to be distinct models from Interceptors.

7 minutes ago, Truthiness said:

In theory yes. However, I have no idea how to distinguish TIE/FOs and TIE/SFs model-wise within the faction. From a rules perspective it's easy. The TIE/SF has a turret and a significant payload. Add counter 2 and bomber. Silencers appear different enough to be distinct models from Interceptors.

That may need to be a case of only being able to field one or the other, or perhaps that one is the traditional three stand and the other is a one-stand. Either way, it's FFG's problem. And I agree, Silencers should probably get their own model, but I figured the point would be made.

Shoot, here's everything I've brainstormed so far for rules:

T-70/85 (pick one) X-Wing

Hull: 5

Speed: 4

Anti-Squadron: 3 blue, 1 black

Battery: 1 black

Escort, Bomber

Points: 15

Resistance B/SF-17 Bomber

Hull: 8

Speed: 2

Anti-Squadron: 2 blue

Battery: 3 black

Bomber, Heavy, Counter 1, Rogue

Points: 23

Poe Dameron

Hull: 5

Speed: 4

Anti-Squadron: 2 black, 2 blue

Battery: 1 black

Escort, Bomber

Points: 26

Brace, Scatter

Ability: Enemy squadrons within distance 1 may not spend defense tokens

TIE/FO

Hull: 4

Speed: 5

Anti-Squadron: 3 black

Battery: 1 black

Swarm

Points: 11

TIE/SF

Hull: 4

Speed: 5

Anti-Squadron: 3 black

Battery: 1 black

Counter 2, Bomber

Points: 14

12 minutes ago, Truthiness said:

Resistance B/SF-17 Bomber

Hull: 8

Speed: 2

Anti-Squadron: 2 blue

Battery: 3 black

Bomber, Heavy, Counter 1, Rogue

Points: 23

Good God, I thought the Decimator was terrifying. I like the rest of them, though Poe is vicious. I'd have done an ace ability along the lines of "When you destroy an enemy squadron, you may deal 1 damage to 1/all enemy squadrons at distance 1."

EDIT: This is the sequence I had in mind for that ability

well I would prefer to wait until episode IX for the FO era. there is still allot of GCW out there, along with CW era. FO needs a little more fleshing out. then there's the rumors of episode's X-XII. there are plenty of factions in GCW ( Hutts, CSA, Zann consortium, Black Sun, etc..) that can be fleshed out if Disney would stop Retconing everything.

It would make zero sense to have a disneyverse squadron pack without disney's "duh we're only bigger" starships.

Plus TFA was horrible and I don't want its filth to be seen in Armada

Take a look at WWII carriers vs the Nimitz class designed in the 70s. 30 years, twice as big. We military types like big things. Apparently.

Also, you're probably a dirty prequel lover who's opinion is invalid anyway

1 hour ago, Truthiness said:

Take a look at WWII carriers vs the Nimitz class designed in the 70s. 30 years, twice as big. We military types like big things. Apparently.

Also, you're probably a dirty prequel lover who's opinion is invalid anyway

Exactly. While I don't approve of the First Order having larger ships (they're supposed to be a remnant of the Empire, not better) technology does advance, things, like reactors, get bigger, which means more power. A bigger reactor needs more space, therefore bigger ships.

11 hours ago, melminiatures said:

13 hours ago, TallGiraffe said:

First off. The large ships would be very big. Plus the Finalizer looks dumb.

Squadrons would mostly be reskins.

it would feel out of place in general except for the Raddus.

It thought so too at first, but now I can except the Resurgent-class design, and its much more interesting and pretty than the new vehicles we got to see from Ep. VIII.

Still a bad decision to just reskin the classic fighters.

2 hours ago, Truthiness said:

Take a look at WWII carriers vs the Nimitz class designed in the 70s. 30 years, twice as big. We military types like big things. Apparently.

Also, you're probably a dirty prequel lover who's opinion is invalid anyway

Hoever the Nimitz class was not build by the US-Remnat faction that only holds Alaska.

Be serious: If we only look at the design, the prequels added a good and interesting design to Star Wars where the sequels added a lot of reskins and/or "bigger is better" solutions.

I've got a few issues with going into TFA-era stuff over more GCW or late CW ones:

- Ships like Resurgent and Raddus are just massive, and I'd prefer to have more models that can be used in non-epic games.

- Even MOAR SQUADRONS. C'mon, do we really need more slightly-different TIEs and X-Wings?

- Most importantly, the Venator hasn't been released yet!

39 minutes ago, DScipio said:

Hoever the Nimitz class was not build by the US-Remnat faction that only holds Alaska.

Be serious: If we only look at the design, the prequels added a good and interesting design to Star Wars where the sequels added a lot of reskins and/or "bigger is better" solutions.

I don't equate Unknown Regions to poor regions. After all, the Chiss have a good sized fleet sitting out there too. Unexplored doesn't mean undeveloped. I can buy that a facist organization can take 30 years to build a good size fleet in hiding. It's like if the continent of Africa was controlled by Nazi Germany after WWII and nobody knew Africa existed. Keep in mind the new canon still has the FO fleet as significantly smaller than Imperial Fleet at its height. There were something around a dozen or SSDs. The Supremacy is only the equivalent of 3.

And while the Clone Wars stuff looks OK, it always looks more developed than the GCW ships. It made it look like technology had somehow regressed in the GCW. Either way, you are never getting a Venator. So sayeth the mouse.

Here's my hot takes...

They won't do separate resistance/FO factions. It's not really feasible. We have a 6 waves of ships (almost 7). That's 10 rebel ships, 9 imperial ships, and 12 different types of fighters per faction. The Armada waves roll too slow to really get 2 new factions. Even if you did a wave 1 like start for the new factions and gave them both 3 or 4 ships, they likely wouldn't be very powerful. Beyond that, there is likely a lot of carryover from old fleets to the new fleets. It makes much more sense to just roll the new factions into the existing. If someone eventually wants to run FO only, then let them, but making separate factions like that probably isn't a good idea.

The fighters are problematic. The new X and TIE are basically identical. That's fine in X-Wing due to paint jobs, but in Armada, they are much smaller, and the details are much less defined, and they have no default paint to define them. Beyond that, I'm not sure if those units would be different enough to warrant all new models. There are other fighters that could be released though.

I'd guess we won't see much from the new trilogy until after Ep8 though. Start dropping new movie related waves between 8 and leading up to 9.

The designs of stuff from the new movies that would fit in this game look fine.

One way or the other, FFG is going to need to move past the original trilogy soon. They are already including stuff from Rogue One and the Rebels cartoon. You KNOW they are going to move somewhere. OT stuff is running thin.

1 hour ago, Truthiness said:

I don't equate Unknown Regions to poor regions. After all, the Chiss have a good sized fleet sitting out there too. Unexplored doesn't mean undeveloped. I can buy that a facist organization can take 30 years to build a good size fleet in hiding. It's like if the continent of Africa was controlled by Nazi Germany after WWII and nobody knew Africa existed. Keep in mind the new canon still has the FO fleet as significantly smaller than Imperial Fleet at its height. There were something around a dozen or SSDs. The Supremacy is only the equivalent of 3.

And while the Clone Wars stuff looks OK, it always looks more developed than the GCW ships. It made it look like technology had somehow regressed in the GCW. Either way, you are never getting a Venator. So sayeth the mouse.

Its not about poor, its about undeveloped.

How should a facist organisation build up a fleet larger than a power that controlls a established goverment spanning the whole galaxy.

Even your argument is invalid. Of Course the Nazis could NOT have build any notable fleet in 30 years in unkown africa, because there was no industrial base.

You can say: But there could be industry in the unkown....yes but no notable trade. And trade is what makes you build things.

I am not keen on the Venator in Armada, but it gave the setting a nice and fitting ship-class, unlike the Dreadnought and the Super Super Star Destroyer.

16 hours ago, Drasnighta said:

That's not addressing his statement.

His statement is, basically, the models don't exceptionally differ (especially in the scale available). And if Unpainted models don't differ, then potentially, recognition between the two types is muddled when used next to each other. Which is a game design problem.

Thats not exactly a valid complaint. This already happens in heroes and the CC unique squadrons. Thats why the cardboard base has its statistic on it. Therefore if the Tie FO has different stats on there, you know its them and not regular ties. Just like you know whos a hero and whos a CC unique, simply because the cardboard differ.

18 minutes ago, DScipio said:

Its not about poor, its about undeveloped.

How should a facist organisation build up a fleet larger than a power that controlls a established goverment spanning the whole galaxy.

Even your argument is invalid. Of Course the Nazis could NOT have build any notable fleet in 30 years in unkown africa, because there was no industrial base.

You can say: But there could be industry in the unkown....yes but no notable trade. And trade is what makes you build things.

I am not keen on the Venator in Armada, but it gave the setting a nice and fitting ship-class, unlike the Dreadnought and the Super Super Star Destroyer.

Most of my information about the Unknown Regions comes from the old EU but there were advanced societies with industry and trade there. Advanced systems in the unknown regions traded with each other as well as systems in Wild Space and isolated or independent outer rim worlds even if they didn't trade directly with the Republic or the Empire. I completely disagree with your assessment that the Nazis couldn't have built a viable fleet with 30 years and the resources of an entire continent as rich in raw materials as Africa, especially if Africa was a hypothetically secret continent. The Nazis built their military up in 21 years in a country whose industry and economy were devastated by WW1 and they did it with the limited resources available to Germany, not the vast resources of the entire African continent, and not in secrecy but openly and with the whole world watching. H*** most of the world was praising Hitler's accomplishments instead of opposing him. He was "Man of the year" in 1938 but started WW2 in 39. I don't have any problem with the idea that the Imperial Remnant managed to build a fleet and a super weapon in 30 years when their only opposition would have come from a dysfunctional new Republic that had apparently adopted a policy of appeasement before the First Order even began their advance.

I think I'd rather see separate Clone Wars factions over putting out the Force Awakens stuff and before Clone Wars stuff, I'd rather they just say, "This is the end of the Armada line. Enjoy the game." I'd play the game all I want, build massive fleets, and turn my money toward Legion.

8 minutes ago, ricefrisbeetreats said:

I think I'd rather see separate Clone Wars factions over putting out the Force Awakens stuff and before Clone Wars stuff, I'd rather they just say, "This is the end of the Armada line. Enjoy the game." I'd play the game all I want, build massive fleets, and turn my money toward Legion.

It is highly unlikely they will stop making ships for armada. They need to maintain the game to maintain the license for it so I think we'd see ffg make their own ships first after exhausting all other film ships first before they even head down the path of ending the game

17 hours ago, GiledPallaeon said:

Good God, I thought the Decimator was terrifying. I like the rest of them, though Poe is vicious. I'd have done an ace ability along the lines of "When you destroy an enemy squadron, you may deal 1 damage to 1/all enemy squadrons at distance 1."

EDIT: This is the sequence I had in mind for that ability

How about if you defeat an enemy squadron, perform another attack. Also change the scatter to a brace.

Also only 2 blacks for the Resistance bomber. Or blue blue black. 3 black and bomber is insane.

I wonder if Disney continues on its current course of ship designs FFG will throw its hands up in the air in rage and yell"SCREW IT, JUST PUT THEM ALL ON LARGE BASES!" If they go down that road then I suggest First Order as its own faction to avoid possibly unkilliable bricks with Motti at command.

The more I think about it, the more I feel most of the problems with adding First Order and Resistance would be solved with keeping them as seprate factions from Rebels and Empire (still have Tie-SF problem though). The main issue right now is Resistance have few ships to create a fleet faction themes. Worst issue is if they are indeed just rebels with a new name, rehashing the same themes minus B & Y-wings.

3 hours ago, TallGiraffe said:

How about if you defeat an enemy squadron, perform another attack. Also change the scatter to a brace.

Also only 2 blacks for the Resistance bomber. Or blue blue black. 3 black and bomber is insane.

It is, but it also can't fight its way out of a wet paper bag. Where as the Decimator can cut through generic squadrons with relative ease, which the Resistance bomber did not look equipped to do. I like the black, blue, blue idea though. Caps the max damage at 4 while also being consistently higher than B-Wings. I have another idea for Poe as well.

1 hour ago, Hyperspace Ninja said:

The more I think about it, the more I feel most of the problems with adding First Order and Resistance would be solved with keeping them as seprate factions from Rebels and Empire (still have Tie-SF problem though). The main issue right now is Resistance have few ships to create a fleet faction themes. Worst issue is if they are indeed just rebels with a new name, rehashing the same themes minus B & Y-wings.

With TFA, absolutely. TLJ looks like they're starting to diverge a bit. We're obviously getting the Raddus and I also dig the Resistance bomber. Still, if we got the Resurgent, the Raddus, squadrons, and two ship reskins per faction, that's a pretty good start.

8 minutes ago, Truthiness said:

It is, but it also can't fight its way out of a wet paper bag. Where as the Decimator can cut through generic squadrons with relative ease, which the Resistance bomber did not look equipped to do. I like the black, blue, blue idea though. Caps the max damage at 4 while also being consistently higher than B-Wings. I have another idea for Poe as well.

Plus intel. (Yavaris if cross faction.)

Not being weighed down by Yavaris is the #1 reason to have separate factions to me. It has made making new and interesting Rebel squadrons considerably more difficult.