Is there going to be an Errata on Poe?

Maybe have to roll the dice into the Dicepool? Vehicles only.... Poe Maz is kinda taking the chance out of the game.

Killing our local groups with this deck...

It's already losing potency and started to when Fast Hands was errataed. Plus the proper approach against it is:

a) Kill Maz

b) Mill tactics. My experience is Poe-Maz falls hard to a good Mill deck.

2 hours ago, Maudus979 said:

Is there going to be an Errata on Poe?

Maybe have to roll the dice into the Dicepool? Vehicles only.... Poe Maz is kinda taking the chance out of the game.

Killing our local groups with this deck...

You know that both both and maz need to roll something? And since FH errata you can mitigate that. Plus Maz is ultra squishy. Plus he is very card dependant. Come on its not even remotely cancerous as it used to. Now its very high risk, very high reward deck.

Thank you guys. I'm just trying to figure it out.

Well there is about to be a bunch of new cards that will boost this deck to new hights. Maz may be the one getting the change though.

I would expect Maz to be the target of the errata.

Changed to her own dice or yellow dice.

Poe/Maz is still a strong deck and with a few of the cards I have seen spoiled I can only think it will get stronger without some change.

I believe we need to see errata on FN more than on Poe. I hope we will see both characters nerfed.

FN needs it more than Poe/Maz.

I'd say:

Maz ability to her own dice only.

FN ability limited to the first weapon you play on him each turn.

That's my opinion anyway.

I don't think Maz needs anything anymore. She dies first turn all the time. Sure, nerfing FN means his deck may not kill Maz first turn, but most other Aggro styles can.

I'd rather them just fix FN and Rey.

20 hours ago, Joelist said:

It's already losing potency and started to when Fast Hands was errataed. Plus the proper approach against it is:

a) Kill Maz

b) Mill tactics. My experience is Poe-Maz falls hard to a good Mill deck.

I disagree with both of these assessments. Whether you kill Maz or Poe first is probably dependent on your team. Secondly, the deck is so quick that the only way you are going to mill them is if you are controlling all their dice.

FN should get hit before Poe. IF FN gets hit, then we can talk Poe.

Always remove Poe's dice if you have a chance, even if they are blanks. If you are ready Villain Best Defense ruins Poe's day if he doesn't have hit and run.

Obviously remove Poe's dice but Maz dies first. Without Maz to focus Poe the deck is way less consistent and hence a lot slower.

3 hours ago, Traxlenak said:

I disagree with both of these assessments. Whether you kill Maz or Poe first is probably dependent on your team. Secondly, the deck is so quick that the only way you are going to mill them is if you are controlling all their dice.

Sorry but I'll take my actual experience and that of the two local groups I play with on Poe-Maz falling to Mill decks. They do and the deck is not as fast as it was post FH errata.

I think have been running an eJyn-Maz Mill deck for a couple of months now and repeatedly have beaten Poe-Maz with it because it is a Fast Mill. And my deck is not totally optimal as there are cards I just have not gotten in packs yet.

There is a lot of variability in both dice rolls and player skill. The fact that people are talking about Poe Maz and even FN means they have a problem. FN is stupidly under cost and will get better with the new set as well. The real question is, will there be other tier 1 decks poping up with the new set that will dilute those two and make them less relevant or will they just become super charged and need addressing?

I don't think people talking about a deck means there is a problem. The decks get discussed and over time reacted to. FN is the new craze in town but it likewise has limitations, namely that you have to get a good roll on the weapon in order to gain the benefit and of course like Poe it is vulnerable to milling. When FN rolls up a non-damaging result on that weapon it's wide open to mitigation.

If anything can become an issue it is groupthink in a meta. Netrunner had that occurring early on and the "meta" looked foolish when a faction they had deemed inferior in one year both won GenCon and several Regionals. It's a natural thing that can happen and one of the challenges in any game meta is to temper the groupthink with actual play line exploration and looking in different directions for edges.

People who play competitively play test many decks and send a lot of time optimizing them. I wouldn't dismiss the hive mind even if it can miss a few things every once in a while. There is of course a huge advantage to being that guy that finds what everyone else misses, for basically one event before the hive mind eats it up. However it is rare for something like that to happen. Certain cards are always way better than most others.

Right now Poe/Maz and rainbow 9s is dominating for a reason. With a new set coming out and the meta getting reshaken, I don't think anything needs to be done until we see what the hive mind gravitates toward. If after this new set it is still all Poe/Maz and rainbow 9s we have a problem that needs addressing.

There is hive mind and there is Hive Mind, I won't comment on the 9's decks but I have seen many a Poe/Maz make the cut and make pretty basic misplays such as rolling Maz in before Poe for no good reason.

I think it is normal to get a new rulebook and FAQ the Friday of the release, so it is but a matter of days to see if there is some correction of cards to be made or not.

7 hours ago, Joelist said:

namely that you have to get a good roll on the weapon in order to gain the benefit

Yes... and also no.

Get a side you don't want like a +2? Roll Unkar or sister and use Unkars ability to generate resources.

Blank? Overwrite and go again.

Not getting the roll you want with FNs ability doesnt necessarily hurt your turn as you have options available to fix it.

18 hours ago, Joelist said:

Sorry but I'll take my actual experience and that of the two local groups I play with on Poe-Maz falling to Mill decks. They do and the deck is not as fast as it was post FH errata.

I think have been running an eJyn-Maz Mill deck for a couple of months now and repeatedly have beaten Poe-Maz with it because it is a Fast Mill. And my deck is not totally optimal as there are cards I just have not gotten in packs yet.

So you'll take anecdotal local evidence, but not tournament data from dozens of different sources even large national and continental championships?

You're claiming Poe/Maz is vulnerable to mill yet it is able to consistently put up results across a wide spectrum of players, while any given mill deck has been unable to do more then be a blip on that sane radar. With Jyn/Maz not even registering.

"Well locally" can't be a retort after so many events across a wide spectrum have shown consistent results.

Given that the meta's gonna see a huge shakeup with all the new cards, I think nerfing Poe or Maz is just another errata to have to keep track of, because it's highly likely there's some new overpowered nonsense deck that we just haven't seen yet. If Poe/Maz dominates the post-EaW meta, maybe then they'll change it. But we most likely won't have an official ruling until the post-EaW rules reference, probably sometime in November (haha, November Update... Destiny is now Windows 10... )

15 hours ago, Mep said:

People who play competitively play test many decks and send a lot of time optimizing them. I wouldn't dismiss the hive mind even if it can miss a few things every once in a while. There is of course a huge advantage to being that guy that finds what everyone else misses, for basically one event before the hive mind eats it up. However it is rare for something like that to happen. Certain cards are always way better than most others.

Right now Poe/Maz and rainbow 9s is dominating for a reason. With a new set coming out and the meta getting reshaken, I don't think anything needs to be done until we see what the hive mind gravitates toward. If after this new set it is still all Poe/Maz and rainbow 9s we have a problem that needs addressing.

Well both those decks are getting new toys (new weaps for 9s, and Drop Zone and new Vehicles for Moe) so unless there is THAT one combo we all missed i dont see meta getting a huge shake.

1 hour ago, Vitalis said:

Well both those decks are getting new toys (new weaps for 9s, and Drop Zone and new Vehicles for Moe) so unless there is THAT one combo we all missed i dont see meta getting a huge shake.

I think we'll see a lot of decks with rend, at the start of this meta.

In my opinion the same groupthink which just leads people to blindly play Poe-Maz also has led people to blindly assume Mill decks in Destiny don't work. And groupthink is why I do not trust the proverbial Hive Mind - I have seen all too often in too many different games where once the Hive decides a deck is killer they just run with it and all experimentation stops. I go on what I physically see in playthroughs because that is where I can see the decks in operation. And what I have seen is that given average luck Poe-Maz stalls out against a fast Mill deck for the exact same reason 9s does not like Mill - it takes their toys away.

If you look at those tournaments you'll see that by and large everyone is playing fast aggro courtesy of the Hive saying fast aggro is the way to go. Which is what I thought too until experimentation showed me another way to go.

4 hours ago, Vitalis said:

Well both those decks are getting new toys (new weaps for 9s, and Drop Zone and new Vehicles for Moe) so unless there is THAT one combo we all missed i dont see meta getting a huge shake.

While we have to wait and see to be sure I feel you may be right unfortunately, but hey, you never know, maybe mill will take off in a huge way and dominate from here on out. To be fair there was one mill that made top 16 at gencon. The real problem is these aggro decks have just too much potential to get perfect rolls and destroy a mill deck in a hurry while the mill deck is much more consistent and has that lower ceiling. Once that mill deck hits that perfect roll, and given enough rounds it will, it is done for the day. The best that mill deck is ever going to do is empty out a hand, which should happen every turn. So yeah, I can see how someone can get a winning record against some of these decks with a mill deck but luck is still a huge factor in this game, so there you go.

Until mill decks get the ability to knock out half a deck in a turn I don't see them hitting the same high ceiling potential as aggro decks.