These forums have really been hammering on the same question, over and over for weeks: Why no new FAQ? Tons of threads, tons of discussion, lots of passionate activity. I really wonder why nothing is being said, I feel like the silence is just deafening.

51 minutes ago, kris40k said:

Not sure what your point is here. I also said that its (it being infinite activation bombs with Genius) not an issue with anyone except Nym. Its only an issue because he is immune to damaging himself.

Take away his immunity and he has other tricks. That's fine.

Take away his immunity and he has more than enough tricks to still be dominant. Not least just boosting afterwards.

1 hour ago, clanofwolves said:

The fact that you've faced Deathfire is amazing, cheers to the lad that ran her!

That was my Deathfire getting shut down by stress.

Thanks.

As to taking away Nym immunity to friendly bombs... well, that'd only work on *scum* Nym. GenCon and NOVA open were both won by *rebel* Nym. A no-overlap restriction on Genius seems like a bit of a compromise, but with Advanced Sensors, that's almost never going to matter anyhow.

3 hours ago, The Inquisitor said:

Regarding the problem of small based ships in the 50 point range, why not simply "half points for everything"?

I don't see why it needs be more complicated than that. Why do any ships need to be protected from giving up half points?

The only reason is it makes the bookkeeping harder. The extreme example is a TIE swarm, where you'll have seven-ish ships to keep track of half-points on. Not that the suggestion of half-points on ships over 25 points but not half points on lower ships would be any easier. We may need such a rule, but the only real reason against it is the tedious nature of calculating the half-points.

40 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

The only reason is it makes the bookkeeping harder. The extreme example is a TIE swarm, where you'll have seven-ish ships to keep track of half-points on. Not that the suggestion of half-points on ships over 25 points but not half points on lower ships would be any easier. We may need such a rule, but the only real reason against it is the tedious nature of calculating the half-points.

Working it out for a two ship small base list isn't any more tedious than a two ship large base list and it's clearly more fair. And swarm lists aren't much harder, if not easier. Three TIEs dead and three under half takes less time to add 3x12+3x6 than it does to find my army list and even figure out how much my Dengar was again.

Any arbitrary cutoff you make for half points will become the new sweet spot. Make it 25 and suddenly 24 point ships that don't die are a good investment (hello Omega Leader).

On 9/5/2017 at 0:02 PM, Rustedborg said:

Watching the last two weeks of casual and tournament X-wing games both locally and at Nationals made me start two question if the dominance of the Auzituck gunship, Scurrg bomber and bomblet generator requires FFG to change a few rules for X-wing.

First, the whole idea that players get half points for large base ships came from the fact that these ships have a lot of hit points (hull + shields) to chew through. Now, we've got multiple small base ships with more than 8 hit points. In my humble opinion, we need a rule change that says players earn half points for any small base ship with more than 8 hits points . So, if your small base ship has 9 or 10 hit points and your opponent gets at least half damage onto your ship then your opponent gets half points on that ship.

Second, Bombs (the ones that drop on activation) need to be subject to ion and stress control . In other words, you cannot drop a bomb on activation if your ship is stressed or if it has an ion token. I'm fine with bombs, even the bomblet generator, as long as a stressed or ioned ship cannot drop its bombs. Players need some way to "reign-in" opponents who use the bomblet generator. This also gives players another reason to bring stress control or ion control to the table.

I'm sure many people will say I'm just a cry-baby asking for those two rule changes, but if cloaking, deadeye, Palp, and Zuckuss deserved changes/nerfs then the rule changes I suggest are pretty tame coming from my perspective.

Do you think these rule changes would be good or bad for X-wing?

Sounds like my idea from weeks ago. I wish you luck, because people will hate it and bash you for it..

Does Nym or genius even need to be hit, or is it bomblet?

Think about Nym as is without bomblet generator. I would be very interested to see him in play with a limit on his drops.

7 hours ago, Kdubb said:

Does Nym or genius even need to be hit, or is it bomblet?

Think about Nym as is without bomblet generator. I would be very interested to see him in play with a limit on his drops.

As I've said elsewhere, he's more than just the sum of his parts. Without Bomblet, he'd still have up to 4 bomb drops which is a lot, and still be dealing them after moving and ignoring them - and using Seismics, he'd get the same average damage, but more reliably. He'd cost 3 points more, which does imply that Bomblet is way too cheap, but that's another point entirely.

Take bomblet, he's still good. Take Genius, he's still good. Take the System slot he's still good. Take his ignore-bombs ability, he's still good (he just equips Engine (which he likely has already) and boosts away). Take the turret, he's still good. Take his PS and he's still pretty solid (I've used Sol Sixxa to good effect at PS8). You have to strip off two or three of the synergistic things to really hit his functionality.

I thought the problem with "Denim" was the "Den" as in Dengar.

Also isn't there any chance that the biggest issue with Nym is the fact that he's got infinite bombs? Shouldn't Bomblet generator always have been a bomb with 3-4 charges instead of infinite uses?

If you take away the Scurrg's EPT then every single Scurrg would be rendered absolute crap.

6 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

As I've said elsewhere, he's more than just the sum of his parts. Without Bomblet, he'd still have up to 4 bomb drops which is a lot, and still be dealing them after moving and ignoring them - and using Seismics, he'd get the same average damage, but more reliably. He'd cost 3 points more, which does imply that Bomblet is way too cheap, but that's another point entirely.

Take bomblet, he's still good. Take Genius, he's still good. Take the System slot he's still good. Take his ignore-bombs ability, he's still good (he just equips Engine (which he likely has already) and boosts away). Take the turret, he's still good. Take his PS and he's still pretty solid (I've used Sol Sixxa to good effect at PS8). You have to strip off two or three of the synergistic things to really hit his functionality.

Agreed. He's just got it all (Jumpmaster all over again). I really don't see how they can sit down and design ships like this. I imagine the meeting where Nym got pitched: "Hey I know! Lets give this ship every advantage possible, including an EPT unlike it's counterparts! I'm SURE that will be balanced! Great job guys, lets clock out at 2pm today!"

It just smacks of a Dev team who are not putting their full effort into the game. I mean, look at the TIE aggressor: "Well, lets just give Imperials a TLT carrier. No, No, don't make anything about it special, just make it the most bland and uninspired ship you can so we can spend more time cramming OP stuff into the Scurrg."

6 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

As I've said elsewhere, he's more than just the sum of his parts. Without Bomblet, he'd still have up to 4 bomb drops which is a lot, and still be dealing them after moving and ignoring them - and using Seismics, he'd get the same average damage, but more reliably. He'd cost 3 points more, which does imply that Bomblet is way too cheap, but that's another point entirely.

Take bomblet, he's still good. Take Genius, he's still good. Take the System slot he's still good. Take his ignore-bombs ability, he's still good (he just equips Engine (which he likely has already) and boosts away). Take the turret, he's still good. Take his PS and he's still pretty solid (I've used Sol Sixxa to good effect at PS8). You have to strip off two or three of the synergistic things to really hit his functionality.

5 minutes ago, Favoritism Flight Games said:

Agreed. He's just got it all (Jumpmaster all over again). I really don't see how they can sit down and design ships like this. I imagine the meeting where Nym got pitched: "Hey I know! Lets give this ship every advantage possible, including an EPT unlike it's counterparts! I'm SURE that will be balanced! Great job guys, lets clock out at 2pm today!"

It just smacks of a Dev team who are not putting their full effort into the game. I mean, look at the TIE aggressor: "Well, lets just give Imperials a TLT carrier. No, No, don't make anything about it special, just make it the most bland and uninspired ship you can so we can spend more time cramming OP stuff into the Scurrg."

Yup.
Though you guys missed the part where the Devs decided this thing should have the most hull/shield that small based ships currently have.

While Nym is beatable, anyone who says things are not made worse by the constant addition of these powerhouses isn't playing competitively.
BUUUUT there was a ton of diversity at Nova and that restored my faith, regardless of what actually won..

There's almost always a tonne of diversity in the mid-tables and below at big tournaments, even nationals. Plenty of people come who don't want to play meta.

(The one thing I really do think is that Bomblet Generator is too cheap. 5+ points would be more appropriate, given that you spend 4 points to get 2 Seismic CHarges in the same slots which do the same average damage, but... well, only twice.)

11 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

(The one thing I really do think is that Bomblet Generator is too cheap. 5+ points would be more appropriate, given that you spend 4 points to get 2 Seismic CHarges in the same slots which do the same average damage, but... well, only twice.)

It's like the Devs don't look at their own ships.
"Oh, it requires two bomb slots - that's a cost in and of itself!"
*forgets Sabine, Cad, Andrasta, and all of the ships with built-in dual bomb slots*
"Let's make it really cheap - there's not a lot of places this can go..."

To the original post, I actually think half points should just count for everything. If I do two damage to Omega Leader I think I should get half points for that!

You basically eliminate swarms if you do this. The only issue with Half Points for everything is ships like the tie and lower costed ships. It's easy to get half points and the MOV loss with a tie is already rough, but over six matches it's now even worse, because you will lose ties and now lose extra points.

That's why I say ships All large ships and ships with a 9 or more Hull + Shields should be half point ships.

This gives a boost to ties and b-wing and u-wing which you never see now. Not much of a boost, but a boost non the less. Plus when nym is below half and has to chase someone in the end game instead of running an dropping unlimited mines, it will make a difference.

I don't remember who said it but I like the idea of half-points being based on the ship point total (the magic number being 26).

That way no small ship can just run away and win because half the list's points are on a regen ship with double re positioning or SLAM.

On 9/5/2017 at 9:09 AM, gamblertuba said:

Scurgg pilot should not have EPT slot. VI Nym is major culprit.

Don't forget TLT as well. Bombs are great but rarely win games outright. TLT is strong but there is counterplay. Bombs and TLT together on Miranda and Nym? Good luck y'all.

Eh, I've beaten it, the difficulty is killing miranda first because nym does not concern me, but if I kill nym first, I can plink Miranda to death by continually doing at least two damage to her a round

2 hours ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

While Nym is beatable, anyone who says things are not made worse by the constant addition of these powerhouses isn't playing competitively.
BUUUUT there was a ton of diversity at Nova and that restored my faith, regardless of what actually won..

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

There was ton of imperials at the french nationals. And that's all thanks to Nym. I don't mind seeing Corran/Nym either.

And again, all people who claim that VI Nym is the offender need to keep in mind that an EPT slot usually is worth 1 point and one point pilot skill is considered by FFG to be worth one point. FFG obvious wanted Nym at PS10, so no EPT and him directly at PS10 would change nothing, outside that it would would be hated by people who like star wars lore, so people like me. ;-)
Furthermore, not having EPT slots is a direct way into obsolescence when the next great card combo arises. The issue is not that the new bombers have EPTs, the issue is that the TIE Interdictors and Y-Wings don't.

11 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

There was ton of imperials at the french nationals. And that's all thanks to Nym. I don't mind seeing Corran/Nym either.

And again, all people who claim that VI Nym is the offender need to keep in mind that an EPT slot usually is worth 1 point and one point pilot skill is considered by FFG to be worth one point. FFG obvious wanted Nym at PS10, so no EPT and him directly at PS10 would change nothing, outside that it would would be hated by people who like star wars lore, so people like me. ;-)
Furthermore, not having EPT slots is a direct way into obsolescence when the next great card combo arises. The issue is not that the new bombers have EPTs, the issue is that the TIE Interdictors and Y-Wings don't.

I should have better defined things as the health and longevity of the game..
Also, I'm not moving the goal posts...

I don't care if Nym becomes less powerful without an EPT - that's kinda the point. Regardless of how much an EPT slot is worth or whatever else you were going for, I stand by my points that he is fun, over powered, and a sign of continued poor decisions by the Dev team.

9 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

As I've said elsewhere, he's more than just the sum of his parts. Without Bomblet, he'd still have up to 4 bomb drops which is a lot, and still be dealing them after moving and ignoring them - and using Seismics, he'd get the same average damage, but more reliably. He'd cost 3 points more, which does imply that Bomblet is way too cheap, but that's another point entirely.

Take bomblet, he's still good. Take Genius , he's still good. Take the System slot he's still good. Take his ignore-bombs ability, he's still good (he just equips Engine (which he likely has already) and boosts away). Take the turret, he's still good. Take his PS and he's still pretty solid (I've used Sol Sixxa to good effect at PS8). You have to strip off two or three of the synergistic things to really hit his functionality.

Without bomblet, he's limited to two bombs, not four with the Havoc title (so no Cad Bane). The Scurrg does not have a Torp slot for EM and no illicit slot for Scavenger Crane. That is a significant change from his current, "Imma poop bombs errywhere" effect. Two bombs. Otherwise he loses his AdvSensors/AC option as well as Genius if he wants a third slot, which is just debatably a horrible choice. I do not think changing bomblets is the answer, as its fine on other ships that can use it. Derp.

Take away his immunity to bombs, and he has to use Engine to simply get out of range, which greatly reduces his ability to barrel roll in and out of arcs and his effectiveness is getting into range one to AC/ABT you to death. Blocking also matters again as he has to weigh killing himself as you block him. Stress also matters as you can try to prevent him from being able to boost. Right now, he simply does not care . This is a drastic change in the ship. This is what needs to change.

As far as him being effective with AC/ABT, or AC/TLT, or AdV Sensors repositioning and VI at 10, that's ok. I don't think anyone wants to nerf Nym into uselessness. Its good for the pilot to be used for something.

Off the top of my head, I would propose changing Scum Nym's pilot skill into a defensive bomb version of Old Han. Whenever he is hit by a bomb (friendly or enemy), after a dice roll he has the option of re-rolling all dice. Makes self bombing risky but not a sure thing, but makes him stronger against enemy mines and bomblets. He can still barrel roll around and turret stuff up at PS 10 with VI for all I care.

2 minutes ago, kris40k said:

Without bomblet, he's limited to two bombs, not four with the Havoc title (so no Cad Bane). The Scurrg does not have a Torp slot for EM. That is a significant change from his current, "Imma poop bombs errywhere" effect. Two bombs. Otherwise he loses his AdvSensors/AC option as well as Genius if he wants a third slot, which is just debatably a horrible choice. I do not think changing bomblets is the answer, as its fine on other ships that can use it.

Take away his immunity to bombs, and he has to use Engine to simply get out of range, which greatly reduces his ability to barrel roll in and out of arcs and his effectiveness is getting into range one to AC/ABT you to death. Blocking also matters again as he has to weigh killing himself as you block him. Stress also matters as you can try to prevent him from being able to boost. Right now, he simply does not care . This is a drastic change in the ship. This is what needs to change.

As far as him being effective with AC/ABT, or AC/TLT, and VI at 10, that's ok. I don't think anyone wants to nerf Nym into uselessness. Its good for the pilot to be used for something.

Off the top of my head, I would propose changing Scum Nym's pilot skill into a defensive bomb version of Old Han. Whenever he is hit by a bomb (friendly or enemy), after a dice roll he has the option of re-rolling all dice. Makes self bombing risky but not a sure thing, but makes him stronger against enemy mines and bomblets. He can still barrel roll around and turret stuff up at PS 10 with VI for all I care.

2 minutes ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

Well...poop.

Thanks.

Edit: For some reason I had it in my head that he had just the missile slot, not both.

2 minutes ago, kris40k said:

Well...poop.

Thanks.

This ship has a lot going for it lol I like using the EM and Guidance for my Cruise Missiles.
Adv. Sensor, Target Lock, (drop bomb?), 3-Talon Roll, (drop bomb?) dakka dakka dakka...

10 minutes ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

I don't care if Nym becomes less powerful without an EPT - that's kinda the point. Regardless of how much an EPT slot is worth or whatever else you were going for, I stand by my points that he is fun, over powered, and a sign of continued poor decisions by the Dev team.

Which is a fair point to make, but nailing it onto the EPT is silly. The overall package? Sure, a fair point to make. I do not necessarily agree with it, but I don't necessary disagree with it either and I certainly could not show that the argument about that is flawed, but the EPT? We have not only examples how the lack of EPT hurt the longevity of ships, but as shown, the points would check out the same way. Nymm is most certainly build around the idea of PS10. You don't build a ship around the idea of genius bomb dropping in similar style to the hated advanced slam k-wings and than accidently allow it to fly at PS10, you deliberately make this decision and you would keep the PS at 10 if you would remove the EPT. The ship would cost literally the same that way.

But as I said, I don't necessary disagree on your point that the whole package is to strong. You might be right, you might be wrong. I honestly don't care arguing about that.

1 minute ago, SEApocalypse said:

Which is a fair point to make, but nailing it onto the EPT is silly. The overall package? Sure, a fair point to make. I do not necessarily agree with it, but I don't necessary disagree with it either and I certainly could not show that the argument about that is flawed, but the EPT? We have not only examples how the lack of EPT hurt the longevity of ships, but as shown, the points would check out the same way. Nymm is most certainly build around the idea of PS10. You don't build a ship around the idea of genius bomb dropping in similar style to the hated advanced slam k-wings and than accidently allow it to fly at PS10, you deliberately make this decision and you would keep the PS at 10 if you would remove the EPT. The ship would cost literally the same that way.

But as I said, I don't necessary disagree on your point that the whole package is to strong. You might be right, you might be wrong. I honestly don't care arguing about that.

I just re-read all of my posts in this thread and don't see me saying the EPT is the main and most offensive reason for Nym being OP.
Citation needed.