What if FFG would use an FAQ to change the rules so that PS 9 is the highest possible PS? It could be a relative easy fix you could introduce with an FAQ with no need to print new cards etc. (though you also would need to change 'Epsilon Ace' to go along with this rule).
So with this rule you could use VI on a PS7 pilot to get him to the top but putting VI on a PS9 pilot would have no effect (so you wouldn't put VI on a Vader or Soontir).

The main benefit I see in this is that we would have more options whenever the meta calls for 'highest ps possible'

I'd be happy enough with a cap at PS9 on paper.

I'd be happy with a cap at 9. I don't think you'd need to clarify individual pilots like Epsilon Ace. Just clarify that the cap can be exceed by specific pilot abilities but if using VI or Adaptability, 9 is the limit.

Personally, I think it should have been like this from the start.

They'd need to change the initiative rules as well I think, or you'd just get spiralling bids at PS9.

Alternate initiative between players each turn, so there's no specific incentive to bid.

4 minutes ago, Stay On The Leader said:

They'd need to change the initiative rules as well I think, or you'd just get spiralling bids at PS9.

You would get that, but I am not so much afraid of this. If we get into a ini-bidding war meta some people will start creating 100P 'I-don't-care-so-much-about-ini' lists that take advantage of these who go too low.

Limiting ships to PS9 is not a solution. The lists will be made at 94-95-96 points and the war will be on another battlefield, but the same war.

13 minutes ago, Stay On The Leader said:

They'd need to change the initiative rules as well I think, or you'd just get spiralling bids at PS9.

Alternate initiative between players each turn, so there's no specific incentive to bid.

Eh, you might. But there are plenty of builds available that don't wildly care about init even at top PS, or can cope either way (or indeed actively WANT init like Phantoms), so I doubt an escalating bid-war would actually result, unless there was a genuinely broken mechanic on the table like pre-nerf phantoms.

There are already squads turning up with 4-5 point bids... I don't think it would change much.

I don't think a bidding war wouldn't be half as bad as the ps war

1st in a bidding war you have quite a lot options (everything that spares you some points is an option)

2nd It is always a gamble. Bidding to high might end in loosing to a 100p list which has just more bang.

It is fine the way it is. This is really just people wanting to put on an EPT but still have the highest PS on the board. Sorry, the price you pay for having the unqualified best pilot is the loss of another EPT. Limiting it to 9 also screws up other ships. Whisper is a 7 specifically because if she were a 9 than VI would all but ensure she got first shot in every game making her Advanced Cloaking device overpowered. If you make the cap 9 you put her right back in that place. Ahsoka as a 9 with that as a cap makes captured TIE that much more powerful.

PS wars come and go like the seasons with every new wave release. This one will end again once the meta shifts. Enjoy it while it lasts. No need to mess with the initiative system just because some lists are build around high PS pilots.

22 minutes ago, jamoreno said:

Limiting ships to PS9 is not a solution. The lists will be made at 94-95-96 points and the war will be on another battlefield, but the same war.

Yeah but in that case are points that you're not using in upgrades. You are basically playing without cards (or pilots).
It worth a try.

13 minutes ago, xbeaker said:

It is fine the way it is. This is really just people wanting to put on an EPT but still have the highest PS on the board.

It's really not even close to that. In fact, it's the opposite.

It's people wanting to put PS9 pilots on the board who cannot use VI without dying miserably, or who are already using VI just to GET to PS9.

21 minutes ago, xbeaker said:

It is fine the way it is. This is really just people wanting to put on an EPT but still have the highest PS on the board. Sorry, the price you pay for having the unqualified best pilot is the loss of another EPT. Limiting it to 9 also screws up other ships. Whisper is a 7 specifically because if she were a 9 than VI would all but ensure she got first shot in every game making her Advanced Cloaking device overpowered. If you make the cap 9 you put her right back in that place. Ahsoka as a 9 with that as a cap makes captured TIE that much more powerful.

Disagree. As it is ther are situations that call for a high ps. These situations limit the options for viable lists a lot and lead to a stale meta.
ATM we are in a meta where aces need to beat Nym so you need ps 10 (+good bid) or ps 11.
everything with ps 7 or less stops being an option and everything with ps 8 or 9 has no EPT option other then VI. I think builds like Bomblet-Autoturret-Nym wheren't half as opressive as they are if the amount of options to field against them wouldn't be so thin.

37 minutes ago, jamoreno said:

Limiting ships to PS9 is not a solution. The lists will be made at 94-95-96 points and the war will be on another battlefield, but the same war.

The difference there is that if you're giving up points for an initiative bid then you're giving up upgrades or abilities that could otherwise help you. A 6 point initiative bid is equivalent to Expertise and Fire Control System for instance, or Cluster Mines and Extra Munitions.

I am nowhere near as concerned be players taking increasing initiative bids as I am about PS escalation. There's only a couple of pilots which can attain PS11, there are dozens that can achieve PS9.

Let's not forget pilots such as Roark Garnet or similar who expressly use PS12 in various forms. The whole idea there is to offer counters to pilots that can achieve 9 and above.

Nym's ability to combine PS10 with Advanced Sensors, Barrel Roll, Engine Upgrade, Genius, Bomblets, and TLT/AB....directly caused the PS escalation.

If FFG gave more thought to the implications of releasing this specifc PS8 ship combo we wouldnt be here. They generally have done a good job with this, although Rey at PS8 is a hard one to understand since her entite dial is already green and she has built in off/def rerolls.

Other PS10 ships usually have sacrificed an EPT and limited themselves in important ways. Vader being the exception I can think of. That compromise is a really solid counter balance to the urge to putting VI on every Ace.

But with Nym, PS10 means sacrficies nothing, you get to dictate the field and play single player for several rounds....unless your opponent brings Kylo or multiple PS11s.

Other EPTs are not really that relevant for Nym since TLT/AB are hyper efficent for dmg and Bomblet requires and receives no modification from EPTs.

Nym's upgrade combos are Whisper levels dangerous and never should have been given a base PS higher than 7. Its why the Gunboat is capped at PS7 im sure of it.

Its why im scared of the new PS8 Kimogila with bullseye. PS10 will be auto include for that to to line up kill shots.

PS7 is a big thing that keeps Whisper from out right owning the entire Meta. And as much as I enjoy flying Whisper its a good thing they werent dumb enough to make her an 8 like Nym.

I had this same thought. Cap at PS9. Give all ships that pay for Pilot Skill a chance to make it worthwhile. I think the idea is worth exploring.

Might have to do a rotating initiative, though, as the whole player with initiative auto losing the PS9 vs PS9 end game because the enemy can always boost+roll out of your final position is already a pretty bad mechanic.

57 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Rey at PS8 is a hard one to understand since her entite dial is already green and she has built in off/def rerolls.

And yet Rey's made basically 0 impact on the top level meta.

Because almost all her stuff is arc-locked.

That's why I'm not too concerned about the Kimo - arc-locked stuff has to be AMAZING to contribute at the moment.

12 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

And yet Rey's made basically 0 impact on the top level meta.

Because almost all her stuff is arc-locked.

That's why I'm not too concerned about the Kimo - arc-locked stuff has to be AMAZING to contribute at the moment.

Agreed, although I think Rey is razor close to being incredibly broken given the 360 PWT, full green dial, high hp, and ability to chuck 4-5 dice in arc. One or two new crew cards and PS10 Rey might be the only way you ever see her played.

I guess all im saying is thats why FFG should be extremely frugal about handing out PS8 or above to ships. When in doubt if you havent tested all possible combos thoroughly make it PS7.

I just think ships that are packed to the gills with toys and tricks and red dice and hp, should suffer the consequences of some mix of low green dice and average pilot skill.

Its not like Nym or Dengar would suddenly be "terrible" at PS7 or PS9 with VI.

21 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

And yet Rey's made basically 0 impact on the top level meta. Because almost all her stuff is arc-locked.

And because she has no native repositioning actions.

TFA falcon title kind of counts but yeah.

Why stop there? Why not cap all ships at 8 instead? Or 7?

PS is a core mechanic of the game from the very beginning. It exists for a reason. If you want to limit it's impact, you'd need to convicingly explain why this would make the game better than it is right now. "Ending PS wars" is a catchphrase that sounds noble enough but is devoid of meaning. As it happens, some ships want to move last and need to do so in order to achieve their full efficiency. Capping PS at 9 would further weaken the few remaining options that imperials have in the current meta (namely, Vader, Quickdraw, RAC). It might also nerf Nym a bit, which WOULD be useful, but there's a much easier way of achieving that (just errata Havoc so that you lose the EPT slot - there, problem solved).

44 minutes ago, Lightrock said:

Why stop there? Why not cap all ships at 8 instead? Or 7?

PS is a core mechanic of the game from the very beginning. It exists for a reason. If you want to limit it's impact, you'd need to convicingly explain why this would make the game better than it is right now. "Ending PS wars" is a catchphrase that sounds noble enough but is devoid of meaning. As it happens, some ships want to move last and need to do so in order to achieve their full efficiency. Capping PS at 9 would further weaken the few remaining options that imperials have in the current meta (namely, Vader, Quickdraw, RAC). It might also nerf Nym a bit, which WOULD be useful, but there's a much easier way of achieving that (just errata Havoc so that you lose the EPT slot - there, problem solved).

No reason to be a troll we already elaborated quite a bit why capping at ps9 would be a good thing.

EDIT: Regarding imperials, why do you think Sontir Fel is dead? Cause ps9 isn't enough and SF without PTL is pretty meh. In Fact empire would provit from a ps9 cap cause they lack upgrades. Someone like Nym doesn't care much about slotting VI as EPT cause he still has halve a dozen other upgrades to take. For a lot of imperial ships EPT and Modification are the only meaningful upgrade options. Now if the meta dictates that you have to take VI to have any chance the amount of options imperial players have left goes towards zero.

3 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:

I'd be happy enough with a cap at PS9 on paper.

THIS!

Bidding is better than PS war. Why? BIDDING HAS A BIG DOWNSIDE- IE less points for your list. This would make a big impact on lists like Denym, and give solid PS 9 pilots a huge leg up as their EPTs would always be free for more interesting options. With PS capped at 9 Intensity Vader and Expertise Quickdraw become HUGE threats- which is what Imps need.