A few months ago, I said on this forum that I wished for Wraiths that would go through obstacles and come in small formations only. Hmmm... maybe I should work for FFG?

So can they end their movement partially on terrain? I would assume no, they are only ignoring it during the move.

3 minutes ago, Xargonaut said:

A few months ago, I said on this forum that I wished for Wraiths that would go through obstacles and come in small formations only. Hmmm... maybe I should work for FFG?

Quick! Wish for something else cool!

Just now, Hepitude said:

Quick! Wish for something else cool!

Haha, ok: Ironbounds for Daqan: very strong elite melee units, but can get out of control (compulsory move, or choice of dial action modified by opponent, something like that), to reflect the unpredictable nature of their "magically possessed" status (hinted at in the Lore Guide).

Now that I'm certain the support is there I finally bought into the game. Just ordered 2 core sets and each Daqan and Waiqar expansion with an additional copy of the Cavalry and Archers as they seem useful. Can't wait for the Death Knights and the Wraiths look great for flanking and objective grabbing.

i think they forgot to say "However you may not end your maneuver on a unit" because how the frack would you ignore 3D models?
Ignoring terrain is insane but ignoring units either imposes that problem or pretty much just lets you not get clipped by an enemy unit when you are turning

Also i think this does indeed mark the asymmetrical releases. Uthuk might have something that could behave like Wraiths but for sure Daqans/elves dont.

I'd love to see more rune golem stuff for daqans (since...thats kinda the reason i play daqan lol).

3 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

i think they forgot to say "However you may not end your maneuver on a unit" because how the frack would you ignore 3D models?
Ignoring terrain is insane but ignoring units either imposes that problem or pretty much just lets you not get clipped by an enemy unit when you are turning

I think the rule about not overlapping units after you finish your move still applies.

10 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

i think they forgot to say "However you may not end your maneuver on a unit" because how the frack would you ignore 3D models?
Ignoring terrain is insane but ignoring units either imposes that problem or pretty much just lets you not get clipped by an enemy unit when you are turning

Also i think this does indeed mark the asymmetrical releases. Uthuk might have something that could behave like Wraiths but for sure Daqans/elves dont.

I'd love to see more rune golem stuff for daqans (since...thats kinda the reason i play daqan lol).

In contrast other units can only ignore a single Friendly tray, a overlapping rules still apply.

7 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

i think they forgot to say "However you may not end your maneuver on a unit" because how the frack would you ignore 3D models?
Ignoring terrain is insane but ignoring units either imposes that problem or pretty much just lets you not get clipped by an enemy unit when you are turning

Also i think this does indeed mark the asymmetrical releases. Uthuk might have something that could behave like Wraiths but for sure Daqans/elves dont.

I'd love to see more rune golem stuff for daqans (since...thats kinda the reason i play daqan lol).

I think you can only ignore terrain and units while moving through them, so if your move couldn't take you all the way past another unit, you still can't end your move overlapping them. Still super cool for phazing through an enemy you don't want to attack.

I think it will change up tactics pretty significantly, as the first time i played elves, I shifted Aliana around and past the charge arc of their Ardus, and then surprise charged a unit of battlecats behind that to wipe him out.

That would make sense and im certain thats how it was meant to be.
But the way they worded it is still really ambiguous.

2 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

That would make sense and im certain thats how it was meant to be.
But the way they worded it is still really ambiguous.

"During" is the key word. They still can't end their move overlapping an obstacle.

1 hour ago, Click5 said:

4 tray unit with Raven Tabards, Trumpets, and Undying Hate is is only 37 points. Seems like an awesome flanker and objective grabber that Waiqar has needed.

I really like the idea of using these for objectives. Valuable for passing through so-called "tar pits," simply ignoring those units.

I haven't put it all together in my mind, but I think there's something here to give Waiqar a leg-up when facing Lord Hawthorne and his 4x1 Oathsworn Cavalry units. I'm staring at the initiatives of the maneuvers, and it's not quite coming together in my head. They share initiative for speed 1 (init 3), 2 (init 4), and 4 (init 7) march, but the cavalry beat out the wraiths on the speed 3 (init 5 vs. init 6 respectively). If you could survive a hit (that's a BIG 'if'), then you can pass right through them next round, giving yourself a turn without cavalry as they turn around. If you have initiative, you could even pass through them before they attack if you have the Raven Tabards (EDIT: speed 2 march at initiative 3). Then, get your free reform, and charge them in the back next round. Oh, the mind games!

They probably did that on purpose.
You cant just send the wraiths to bypass the cavalry, you need to time it right. If you have the initiative odds are you can slip right by them, otherwise they'll charge you. Making it a very powerful trick but not a 100% reliable counter. If you get behind the cavalry they might as well not exist since they are going to take at LEAST 3 turns to catch you now (1 to turn around, you moved further away. 2 to chase since now you are too far to charge. 3 to actually charge assuming you didnt phase right by another unit)

Absolutely. The balance is real! I'd hate to see core factions get outpaced so early in the game, and it looks like things are staying the course as far as balance pretty nicely.

5 minutes ago, Parakitor said:

I really like the idea of using these for objectives. Valuable for passing through so-called "tar pits," simply ignoring those units.

I haven't put it all together in my mind, but I think there's something here to give Waiqar a leg-up when facing Lord Hawthorne and his 4x1 Oathsworn Cavalry units. I'm staring at the initiatives of the maneuvers, and it's not quite coming together in my head. They share initiative for speed 1 (init 3), 2 (init 4), and 4 (init 7) march, but the cavalry beat out the wraiths on the speed 3 (init 5 vs. init 6 respectively). If you could survive a hit (that's a BIG 'if'), then you can pass right through them, giving yourself a turn without cavalry as they turn around. If you have initiative, you could even pass through them before they attack if you have the Raven Tabards (EDIT: speed 2 march at initiative 3). Then, get your free reform, and charge them in the back next round. Oh, the mind games!

Wait survive a hit? March actions are cancelled if engaged.

I have a feeling that the majority of the time, you'll be using Wraiths to move through small terrain pieces and shift through small units while in combat.

Just now, TallGiraffe said:

Wait survive a hit? March actions are cancelled if engaged.

Yes, that's correct. I meant to say "the following round." Sorry for not being clear. i'm just not very confident that Wraiths could survive the 4x1 onslaught. Vineheart is right that you need to time the march so they miss you completely, so you avoid getting attacked at all.

Oh yeah the 4x1 cavalry would desecrate the wraiths without even trying. You can reroll 1-2 of his dice before he applies his Rank Disc reroll but with threat4 if even 1 hit goes through thats a dead tray. Between 3 dice, your inability to reroll ALL dice, and his counter reroll he'll still put a lot of damage on you (nevermind surge effects)

If they catch them.

For this reason alone i think taking Wraiths with any depth is a bad idea. Once you add a rank they suddenly will more than likely never be able to slip right by another unit, only not get clipped when turning.

Also, it looks like all those upgrade cards except the one 'rune' are Waiqar-only, so that's cool!

1 hour ago, Wraithist said:

I play the wraithists (Elfs and Daqan Mans) who plan on undead genocide.

I feel like Undead Genocide is an oxymoron.

1 hour ago, Xargonaut said:

A few months ago, I said on this forum that I wished for Wraiths that would go through obstacles and come in small formations only. Hmmm... maybe I should work for FFG?

Maybe you do...

11 minutes ago, Willange said:

Also, it looks like all those upgrade cards except the one 'rune' are Waiqar-only, so that's cool!

Hmmm... speaking of which...

It seems logical to assume that the other "feather" upgrade allows them to take Equipment upgrades... hello shenanigans!

Anyone able to squint better than me at the rune upgrade in the spread? (the text does seem different to Wind or Fire rune) - oh wait ... it'll be corruption rune I bet.

11 minutes ago, maxam said:

Anyone able to squint better than me at the rune upgrade in the spread? (the text does seem different to Wind or Fire rune) - oh wait ... it'll be corruption rune I bet.

I think you nailed it.

30 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

For this reason alone i think taking Wraiths with any depth is a bad idea. Once you add a rank they suddenly will more than likely never be able to slip right by another unit, only not get clipped when turning.

Truth. In fact, if you run them with Ardus, you never have a reason to run more than a 3x1. Perhaps I should pick up 3 boxes so I could run two such units. Wait, I'm not even sure you need Ardus, since there aren't any heraldry upgrades that jump out at me. Raven Tabards is nice, and cheap, too. What heraldry upgrades are you going to put on wraiths, if any?

Ok this is comical....
They come with Equipments even though they cant take one. We can assume they get access to it through another card otherwise why would they come with equipment at all.

Wind runes. They have a white Skill mod. If you get atleast a 2 speed out of that you can actually bolt across the terrain pretty fast, and if done right you can dive right into the face of the Cavalry (not touching them) and then Wind Rune right over them. Their ability makes no mention where the March or Shift comes from so it works there too.

Whats even more funny, is their ability to Reform after moving right into your face enables them to do it even easier. Say they approach you at a wonky angle, the 2fwd shift wouldnt clear you because of it. Reform for free to line up, now it does clear. Cya cavalry!