Hi there! First off my name is Brian and I've been a Gamemaster for a few years now. I'd like to think I have gotten quite good at it but I'm running into some issues and questions that I'm having issues answering. 40K is a favorite of mine as I play Tyranids in the tabletop and have played every FF RPG in the setting. Typically we end up running Rogue Trader or Deathwatch, but my group has been on a 'evil campaign' spree and wanted to go for Black Crusade. For this particular session I only have two players who decided during character creation to be close friends and followers of Tzeentch, so that they could scheme together and not against each other. My idea was I wanted them to conquer this planet then slowly spread out, gaining more infamy as they conquer until they can finally start a real Black Crusade. I started them off with a ton more XP than normal just because this is meant to be casual and we've never experienced high level Black Crusade play (Usually the games fall apart before then.)

My main problem is finding fun ways to challenge them when taking this planet. As servants of Tzeentch they obviously didn't barge down the nearest door and start blasting people, instead opting for looking around the city they arrived in and assessing the situation. For this to make sense I have to explain the planet a little bit: The planet is owned by a Rogue Trader by the name of Lord Tidus. The planet has very little farmable soil but a lot of valuable minerals and thus it is primarily an industrial planet which manufactures arms, armor, and other misc goods. The players decided the best way to start was by disrupting the manufactorum in the port city and convincing the workers (Who obviously are underpaid and under threat of death should they try to leave) to side with them, using deception and other methods to slowly convert them to Tzeentch along the way.

I really just need suggestions and ideas on how to properly challenge them with the idea of conquering a planet. What would be good points of interest for the players to take over? What kind of conflict would be fun to encounter when doing this?

7 hours ago, Zamorak789 said:

Hi there! First off my name is Brian and I've been a Gamemaster for a few years now

Hello Brian

To challenge the players, one needs obstacles. To put proper obstacles, one needs to know the goals. Exactly -how- may they take over the planet? What are the key pillars that uphold the status quo? These are things that need to be overcome, which in turn is a thing that the players have suggestions for (once the targets are clarified). When they have their way, you may start to build obstacles. Do you already have some ideas about the pillars of order? Or are those needed as well?

I hope this helps to bring your gears into motion

With kind regards: Gregorius21778
My blog

P.S: Hey, Asmodee! We want our signatures back!

15 hours ago, Gregorius21778 said:

Hello Brian

To challenge the players, one needs obstacles. To put proper obstacles, one needs to know the goals. Exactly -how- may they take over the planet? What are the key pillars that uphold the status quo? These are things that need to be overcome, which in turn is a thing that the players have suggestions for (once the targets are clarified). When they have their way, you may start to build obstacles. Do you already have some ideas about the pillars of order? Or are those needed as well?

I hope this helps to bring your gears into motion

With kind regards: Gregorius21778
My blog

P.S: Hey, Asmodee! We want our signatures back!

I'm having issues thinking of key targets for them to take over as well as what kind of obstacles to challenge them with. It's really difficult to actually challenge chaos space marines.

On ‎23‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 10:21 AM, Zamorak789 said:

It's really difficult to actually challenge chaos space marines.

It is in a fair fight! The trick is not to give them one...

On ‎22‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 11:24 AM, Zamorak789 said:

.I started them off with a ton more XP than normal just because this is meant to be casual and we've never experienced high level Black Crusade play

They are good fun. One of our longest running campaigns (and the source of a lot of the "You know you're playing Black Crusade when..." thread posts) was a black crusade campaign starting everyone with an advanced archetype and running them up to ascension.

On ‎22‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 11:24 AM, Zamorak789 said:

My main problem is finding fun ways to challenge them when taking this planet. As servants of Tzeentch they obviously didn't barge down the nearest door and start blasting people, instead opting for looking around the city they arrived in and assessing the situation.

Key note: 'looking around' should be difficult - one of the lesser-appreciated talents and traits that Disciples of Chaos get compared to Chaos Space Marines is the ability to walk down a street and interact with people without everyone going "holy god-emperor it's a space marine!". Human minions are a good investment for marine characters for precisely this reason.

Still, not blindly rushing in is a good start.

On ‎22‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 11:24 AM, Zamorak789 said:

The planet is owned by a Rogue Trader by the name of Lord Tidus. The planet has very little farmable soil but a lot of valuable minerals and thus it is primarily an industrial planet which manufactures arms, armor, and other misc goods.

For whom? An armoury world is a nice, obvious prize for a group of nefarious heretics....but Lord Tidus (probably Lord-Captain Tidus to be technically correct, see later) will have established an armoury world with an aim to supply...someone. The nearest sector's astra militarum? His own household guard? Other colonies? Distant warzones (via the departmento munitorium)? A gunsmith must have customers to justify its existence, and said customers have a vested interest in maintaining its security.

Figure out the whom and you have a good idea what might be in your way, and who might be turning up after the next delivery doesn't turn up to "un-conquer" the world.

On ‎22‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 11:24 AM, Zamorak789 said:

The players decided the best way to start was by disrupting the manufactorum in the port city and convincing the workers (Who obviously are underpaid and under threat of death should they try to leave) to side with them, using deception and other methods to slowly convert them to Tzeentch along the way.

Hmm..... not an ideal plan. Industrial disruption is nice, but unless they're ready to move on it immediately, could just give Tidus' regent a 'heads up' to start locking the place down. If they're planning on that and have a means to take advantage, great. If they go "mwahahaha! we have caused a twenty percent drop in production and riots amongst the slave workers" then an appropriate response is "...aaand Tidus has brought in twenty-thousand off-world mercenary enforcers and quelled the riots" or even "and he's agreed a pact with the Mechanicus replacing slave labour in critical areas with forge-wrought servitors due to security concerns".

On ‎22‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 11:24 AM, Zamorak789 said:

I really just need suggestions and ideas on how to properly challenge them with the idea of conquering a planet. What would be good points of interest for the players to take over? What kind of conflict would be fun to encounter when doing this?

• Governor's Palace - combined palace, fortress, planetary defence force command centre, you name it - you're not going to be able to control the place without it. Expect Company or Battalion-sized forces of Household Guard, which are likely to be incredibly well armed - this is a Rogue Trader's personal guard (one of the few million richest people in the Imperium), protecting a planetary regent (probably a close family member) and they are, after all, on a bloody armoury world so weaponry is literally there for the taking. Medium-sized hordes of stormtrooper analogues (BS40 with hotshot lasguns and fire drill) can ventilate marines very quickly.
• Warehouse complexes - Building weapons and armour is one thing, but storing them quite another. If Tidus' regent has any brains at all, the warehouses are secure, guarded, and a long way from the manufacturing complexes; an essentially slave workforce is controllable - one with access to military-grade weapons is not. Busting into one of these (or more accurately two - because you need guns and ammunition!) gives you the means to arm your hopefully thousands-strong angry lynch mob. Manned guards, automated guns.
• Starport - It's not a free world; it's essentially a slave-state building dangerous weapons. Getting on and off the world should be moderately difficult, and more importantly getting meaningful quantities of 'stuff' (enough troops to matter on a battlefield, for example) through the security net without tripping it should take some doing. Bear in mind that the world needs constant off-world supplies if it can't feed its populace, so disrupting the off-world food sources gives you a means to cause dissatisfaction and anger without putting a solution within easy reach of the planetary regent. Expect emplaced weapons designed to stop orbital craft - stuff equivalent to an autocannon at least (the hades autocannon is a chaos version which is essentially an autocannon with storm - a good idea for this as it provides a terrifying weapon to face but is also emphatically not man-portable, even for marines, once they've taken the place).
• Secure areas - one of the best ways to disconcert marines is to take away their toys. Think airport security; the 'noble' bits of the colony will still have their servants and deliveries of food but will want to make sure no weapons get smuggled in. It's not hard to imagine a security grid that they'll only realistically get through without weapons and power armour!
• Tidus' ship(s) - Remember the comment about 'Lord-Captain' - he's a Rogue Trader. Most likely he has at least a frigate, maybe even a cruiser. Such a ship - if he's prepared to - can stop a rebellion in minutes by glassing a twenty-kilometre-square area from orbit with macrobattery fire. If they don't think of this in advance, it's a good way to remind them that Tidus may be an Imperial, but he's no less ruthless than they are. Being in an area under saturation macrobombardment should be a good cure for 'marines-are-invincible-syndrome' as they watch their 'army' vapourised and take get caught on the edges of what are essentially kilometre-across legion krak missile explosions.
• Opposition characters on a par with the marines - they don't need to be marines to be scary. Depending on how close this is to an imperial sector or how interested the administratum is in the world's products, you may have an arbites presence (touched by the fates, shotguns, amputator rounds, mighty shot, decent inquiry/common lore underworld skills and counter-investigating whenever the heretics make a 'splash'), and if the world produces any more 'high-tech' weapons, then a mechanicus presence (Essentially a high-XP Heretek without corruption effects plus heavy weapon toting servitors) is not unreasonable. If the heretics were tracked to the world you could even have it rumoured than an Inquisitor has turned up.

Challenges: Get onto the planet undetected
Unless the planet has -no- orbital sensors/satellites/patrol ships/listening posts up in the orbit and/or the wider system, your players may need to get stealthy. This means that they either need to smuggle themselves in or that the ship that brings them in enter real-space far away from such sensors, which in turn means they will have fly a guncutter for a -long- period of time. I had some inquisitorial agents spend DAYS inside an Aquilla for such an operation, they hated it. Aside from that, it means "sensor works" and this means tech-stuff.

Once that is done, they will have to enter civilized area WITHOUT being spotted. Do you want to make this tuff for them? Do not give them local support. Spacemarines stick out like a sour thumb. Chaos Marines even more so.

Challenges: supplies, supplies
How much supplies do they have been able to bring along, and how (see above)? When will they run out of it? They will need a base of operation and will need supplies. Not only ammo, but food and drink as well. Chat with them before so that you know their general plans, this will help you to generate targets for such. Next, thing about disturbances and bring some up now and then. How do they deal with people that stroll into their lair? What if they will be missed...?

Challenges: demon deals
A daemon of tzeentch may offer support. For defined support , the creature will demand things like "raise a building I am going to show you" or "slaughter the first imperial priest you meet from now on, and leave him on display with his eyes in his mouth, right where you killed him". One succh thing will include "do me a favor when I ask for it". Make them really on it, then have it turn things into pure trouble for them. The daemon tests them, or it maybe follows its very own agenda.

Target: the files of the enforcer and the church
They will need support and followers. Those who are suspected to be evildoers may help. But how to get those WITHOUT tipping everybody off?

Target: the astrophatic choir
If they cannot call for help from off-world, it evens the odds...

Target: the governour´s wife
The planet will have somebody who is in charge when the RT is away. This person has a well-loved wife who is charitable, diplomatic and loved by the populace. Give them a prophecy about having foothold when the gov kills his wife and the populace learns it. Especially when he REALLY did it!

On ‎30‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 5:24 PM, Gregorius21778 said:

One succh thing will include "do me a favor when I ask for it".

We had this in an early mission of our last black crusade campaign. A player who got badly injured asked the daemon they'd just freed if he could help. The response was essentially "sure, if you'll owe me a favour" and the player said "yes" before anyone else in the party got a word in edgeways. His expression as he looked back down the table at the gaping stares of horror from the rest of the party and blithely asked "what's wrong?" was priceless.

Needless to say, this cost them big-time in the long run, and ultimately ended with noodly-appendage-blargle time for the player.