Is that an accurate reading? I don't mean that to sound dismissive, in case it does. I'm just trying to wrap my head around this game and figure out how it scratches a different itch than IA.

Pros (as I see it, so far):
-larger figures like the AT-AT and more AT-STs
-larger space, so speeder bikes!
-larger skirmishes: more figures, more space, greater glory
-360 degree movement, so positioning could be more tactical
-sweet terrain, which might affect gameplay more

Cons (as I see it, so far):
-Without the command cards (assuming this is even true), I feel like I'll lose an interesting aspect of list building and tactics
-larger size means it'll be harder to get it to a table and will require more space at my FLGS for tourneys
-I personally like tiles and hex-based movement, so losing those is a con for me (maybe I'm in the minority)
-too similar to IA, which I already own and love
-no one will play this with me :-)
-$$$$ This seems like it will take a lot of money to keep up with.
-$$$$ (this warrants repeating)

Thoughts? Am I off base? Is it too early to tell? Anyone at Gen Con demo it yet care to share insights?

-ryanjamal

1 minute ago, ryanjamal said:

Is that an accurate reading?

Not at all.

Legion is a unit-based game. Movement is measured, not on a grid. If you are familiar with Warhammer 40k, does that strike you something like IA minus tiles?

2 minutes ago, Manchu said:

Not at all.

Legion is a unit-based game. Movement is measured, not on a grid. If you are familiar with Warhammer 40k, does that strike you something like IA minus tiles?

Ha ha, yes it does :-). But I'm not a minis gamer.

-ryanjamal

I can assure you, as a miniatures gamer and a board gamer, that IA skirmish is nothing like an actual miniatures wargame.

I see this more in line with West End Games Star Wars Miniatures Game where you had multiple custom squads of infantry battling each other instead of pre-made individual soldiers. My guess is that Star Wars Legion is more like the new Runewars Miniature game then Imperial Assault.

Imperial Assault is more like the Wizards of the Coast Star Wars Miniatures Game where you created a single squad of individual soldiers and heroes (mostly heroes).

I personally passed on both Wizards of the Coast's version and FFG's Imperial Assault because they were centered around the small scale, individual characters, because I enjoyed the West End Games version where you created squads with customized loadouts (choosing what weapons, gear, armor, training, and number of soldiers in each squad), where squad morale played a major factor (FFG mentioned suppression tokens), where smaller combat vehicles were a major investment (T-47s, AT-STs, Imperial Repulsor Tanks, AT-PTs) but could still be used as the battlefield was large enough to fit them in.

Maybe the problem is that FFG has been marketing IA as a miniatures game?

Think of it like this, AI is actually a lot more closely related to Descent (not marketed as a miniatures game by FFG) than any actual miniatures game.

Probably the problem is that I just don't play mini games. I can see the draw of the strategy of positioning various squads across a larger battle map. But I see there is less focus on unit abilities and surprise tactical opportunities like command cards, which makes me less interested. But I think I just need to play it to see what it's like.

-ryanjamal

Well TBH I don't remember IA well enough to get what you mean by command cards. I only played IA a few times and didn't care for it, so sold it all. But I can tell you that in Legion, you command your units by using cards. At the start of the turn, each player chooses a card. The cards let you place command tokens on a certain number of units. They also have special abilities. Finally, they each have a priority value that determines which player will be acting first on that turn. There are a lot of board game elements in Legion, from my perspective.

Tabletops tend to be less "accurate" (no squares). Because of this, there are disputes concerning range, line of sight, movement, positioning etc. At least that's my experience.

13 minutes ago, DerBaer said:

Tabletops tend to be less "accurate" (no squares). Because of this, there are disputes concerning range, line of sight, movement, positioning etc. At least that's my experience.

You're not wrong but from what I've seen of SW:L (only the play video tbh) is that a lot of this is removed but using only the unit leader for LOS, movement and positioning. Really clever way of simplfying things.

The range marker should help remove any movement inaccuracy if that's a concern also.

We'll know more in the coming months - plenty of time to get you up to full froth!

10 minutes ago, Dice lord said:

You're not wrong but from what I've seen of SW:L (only the play video tbh) is that a lot of this is removed but using only the unit leader for LOS, movement and positioning. Really clever way of simplfying things.

Isn't that the way, that Mantic Games' 40K clone called Warpath is played?

2 hours ago, DerBaer said:

Tabletops tend to be less "accurate" (no squares). Because of this, there are disputes concerning range, line of sight, movement, positioning etc. At least that's my experience.

If both players use common sense it's not really a problem, I never really had a problem with any of these in all the miniature wargames I played, but then I'm playing for fun and I don' play tournaments.

1 hour ago, DerBaer said:

Isn't that the way, that Mantic Games' 40K clone called Warpath is played?

Could be; passed me by that one.

This game is EXACTLY like Games Workshop Warhammer 40k(WH40k) with cheaper looking models. The rules, from what I saw on the demo at GEN CON, is almost exactly pulled from WH40K.

The only difference are marginal and cosmetic, the dice will be 8 sided instead of 6 sided normal dice used in WH40k. The scale may be 33mm or 35mm instead of WH 40k is 32mm base. Of course one is based on SW universe and the other is not. If you want to get an idea of how to play the game you can download the WH40k 8th edition rules for free, and the differences are just cosmetic ones. This game will need you to paint and create your own battle mats or table top diorama with cover, buildings, whatever your heart desires. This will be HARD CORE TABLE TOP WAR GAMING, so if that is not your thing, and you do not have the money(it can be far more expensive to create armies and battle fields then any thing else in FFG SW) this game is not for you.

On 8/18/2017 at 4:53 PM, ryanjamal said:

-$$$$ This seems like it will take a lot of money to keep up with.
-$$$$ (this warrants repeating)

Thoughts? Am I off base? Is it too early to tell? Anyone at Gen Con demo it yet care to share insights?

-ryanjamal

yep.. for example in WH40k a squad will cost about 40$ dollars or so, and you can have up to 10 squads in a 10,000 point game.. $$$ out the ying yang. Will this game be just as expensive, probably not, mostly because they only put out the game and not the pricing for expansion units as yet.. so hold on to your wallet folks, its about to go for a ride. But I could see the expansion units going for at least 25-30$ and larger units or vehicles more like 40$.

All that said above, this game looks like it will be a lots of fun, but it will be heavily depending on other factors that FFG may not appreciate yet. I hope they studied GW40k development over the last 20 years, it shows how these types of games can go down hill fast.

Most importantly is the community to play with, this is NOT A SOLO game. Support by the local game shop to host games, build diorama, and sell models(in war gaming we call them models not miniatures). There are lots of lessons to be learned from GW here on how these games are successful or flat out failures.

20 minutes ago, angrymike said:

This game is EXACTLY like Games Workshop Warhammer 40k(WH40k) with cheaper looking models. The rules, from what I saw on the demo at GEN CON, is almost exactly pulled from WH40K.

The only difference are marginal and cosmetic, the dice will be 8 sided instead of 6 sided normal dice used in WH40k. The scale may be 33mm or 35mm instead of WH 40k is 32mm base. Of course one is based on SW universe and the other is not. If you want to get an idea of how to play the game you can download the WH40k 8th edition rules for free, and the differences are just cosmetic ones. This game will need you to paint and create your own battle mats or table top diorama with cover, buildings, whatever your heart desires. This will be HARD CORE TABLE TOP WAR GAMING, so if that is not your thing, and you do not have the money(it can be far more expensive to create armies and battle fields then any thing else in FFG SW) this game is not for you.

From the limited play through of SW:L shown online, this first statement is straight up wrong.

GW minis are better looking tho, I cannot deny that.

2 minutes ago, Dice lord said:

From the limited play through of SW:L shown online, this first statement is straight up wrong.

GW minis are better looking tho, I cannot deny that.

I think your right technically, I will reword it to 'flavor' of the game is 'like'.. since I am trying to give people new to this type of gaming an idea.

34 minutes ago, angrymike said:

I think your right technically, I will reword it to 'flavor' of the game is 'like'.. since I am trying to give people new to this type of gaming an idea.

Compared to other FFG SW games, Yes, the flavour is more similar to 40K but rules wise it appears to be sufficiently different (again based on the one play through video).

The rules, as they appear, is what is most exciting about SW:L for me as 8th 40k is quicker/easier but still lacks the tactical decisions that the command cards and the I-go-u-go play style may offer. Plus unit cards are better than GW codex books that you need (at extra cost) and constantly refer back to.

Early doors still, early doors.