Right I think there is a trap of thought you can fall down by only considering the cost of the components and not consider all the other costs that go into the product. This was certainly not a cheap product to produce. Seven factions with a fairly large card pool to start needed to be design and developed (this was not a rehosting. It was a complete redesign of the game). The story team needed to coordinate and reboot the story, and have been giving us a really frequent stream of new fictions free of charge. In my opinion even the stories that are considered weaker by the online community are still great pieces of fiction so far. The organized play program they are proposing is the most ambitious program I've ever seen them propose, and that had to take a good deal of time and effort to work out. Lastly this game is gorgeous. I think that's a pretty widely held opinion. Art has to be one of the most expensive parts of game production and FFG has amassed a pretty great stable of card artists and graphic designers. Their services don't come cheap. That's all before we start talking about the company's operating costs and the product line turning a profit.

So it's not a matter of there is 300 cards and 5 sheets of counters. The components cost X, the retailer needs to make Z off the purchase to make it valuable to them and I want to make Y profit so I'll charge X+Y+Z. It's more like art costs A, game development costs B, writing costs C, buying the licensee from AEG cost D... I need to recoup A+B+C+D. My profit Y needs to cover that and make the game profitable for me in the core set since each expansion will reintroduce these costs again. My projected competitive audience for this game is V gamers. Does Y*V cover my costs? Does Y*V*2 cover my costs? Does Y*V*3 cover my costs? Also is X+Y+Z around 40 USD because that's what my market research tells me is an acceptable maximum price for an introductory product to attract the widest audience.

Something like that I would assume is the thought process, but of course what do I know. Only FFG knows it's business plan

1 hour ago, Teslacrashed said:

...where just putting those extra 45 cards into the core box would just break their bank, or that upping the cost by 5 or 10 bucks to cover it...

For precision's sake and in hope people don't re-use this made-up number, the count of cards they'd have to add in the core box to make a full playset is 352... Not quite the same as 45 it seems...

16 minutes ago, KerenRhys said:

For precision's sake and in hope people don't re-use this made-up number, the count of cards they'd have to add in the core box to make a full playset is 352... Not quite the same as 45 it seems...

Which, doing quick and dirty math is another core and a third? That would add roughly another 50 dollars onto the price point.

Nonetheless, without being able to actually see every cost they incur it's pointless to speculate on a better model for them to put forward, at best it's good natured back seat driving.

1 hour ago, Teslacrashed said:

Well yeah, I can see how it's great for the profit margins forcing competitive players to buy 3 boxes of your game instead of one. I have a really hard time imagining the world where just putting those extra 45 cards into the core box would just break their bank, or that upping the cost by 5 or 10 bucks to cover it would really stop people from getting into it. If you look at the history of any LCG message board, here or on Boardgamegeek or others, you'll find no end of people complaining about this practice, because it is terrible.

That is what people do. They surf the internet and they complain. Try doing what the masses can not and run a successful business.

57 minutes ago, phillos said:

Right I think there is a trap of thought you can fall down by only considering the cost of the components and not consider all the other costs that go into the product. This was certainly not a cheap product to produce. Seven factions with a fairly large card pool to start needed to be design and developed (this was not a rehosting. It was a complete redesign of the game). The story team needed to coordinate and reboot the story, and have been giving us a really frequent stream of new fictions free of charge. In my opinion even the stories that are considered weaker by the online community are still great pieces of fiction so far. The organized play program they are proposing is the most ambitious program I've ever seen them propose, and that had to take a good deal of time and effort to work out. Lastly this game is gorgeous. I think that's a pretty widely held opinion. Art has to be one of the most expensive parts of game production and FFG has amassed a pretty great stable of card artists and graphic designers. Their services don't come cheap. That's all before we start talking about the company's operating costs and the product line turning a profit.

So it's not a matter of there is 300 cards and 5 sheets of counters. The components cost X, the retailer needs to make Z off the purchase to make it valuable to them and I want to make Y profit so I'll charge X+Y+Z. It's more like art costs A, game development costs B, writing costs C, buying the licensee from AEG cost D... I need to recoup A+B+C+D. My profit Y needs to cover that and make the game profitable for me in the core set since each expansion will reintroduce these costs again. My projected competitive audience for this game is V gamers. Does Y*V cover my costs? Does Y*V*2 cover my costs? Does Y*V*3 cover my costs? Also is X+Y+Z around 40 USD because that's what my market research tells me is an acceptable maximum price for an introductory product to attract the widest audience.

Something like that I would assume is the thought process, but of course what do I know. Only FFG knows it's business plan

Don't forget cost of shipping. Even ground, it isn't cheap, and a box full of 500+ cards isn't the lightest thing in the world. shipping costs can stack up faster than most people can expect, even with business rates.

Let's not forget the cost of maintaining a forum for crybabies to whine on. That isn't free.

7 hours ago, Nickciufi said:

Let's not forget the cost of maintaining a forum for crybabies to whine on. That isn't free.

Best post I've seen all day

If you set $10 (2 beers out, a six-pack in, one lunch out, etc.) a week aside from now until October 5th, you have $70 and you know you're going to buy 1 anyway for $40. That almost adds up to $120 for 3 sets. I don't make a lot of money, but I have no problem buying 3 sets - and we've known this for how many months!?! I don't even know why I'm wasting time typing this. It's not a big deal - buy 3 sets and enjoy life!

22 minutes ago, The Laughing Monk said:

If you set $10 (2 beers out, a six-pack in, one lunch out, etc.) a week aside from now until October 5th, you have $70 and you know you're going to buy 1 anyway for $40. That almost adds up to $120 for 3 sets. I don't make a lot of money, but I have no problem buying 3 sets - and we've known this for how many months!?! I don't even know why I'm wasting time typing this. It's not a big deal - buy 3 sets and enjoy life!

Not to mention you'll be looking slimmer and trimmer for when you win those in-store tournaments!

6 hours ago, The Laughing Monk said:

If you set $10 (2 beers out, a six-pack in, one lunch out, etc.)

In my case would be 10 beers out... Don't get me wrong, I'm gonna buy three cores, but if you make this between two cores and 10 beers (out, so also with the incentive of enjoying them away from my wife and three daughters)... don't know man, you're putting up a though decision there...