Scale and Vehicles

By schuwa, in Star Wars: Legion

Having played WoTC Star Wars Miniatures for a long time, I want to share some great work out there:

https://momirfarooq.com/swcharacter/swcharacter3d.html has some fantastic 3D models that are scaled to WoTC, so they should be close to the correct size for the new game. I've used them often. Cardstock printing and washer-weighted bases make them work well.

http://papermau.blogspot.com.br/ - is a collection for all things papercraft. I use a lot of their designs for bot Star Wars and D&D battles. It is scale-searchable.

I think I'll buy one AT-AT from Revell . I'll only use it for 'terrain'. Scale is 1:53.

Revell has a Snowspeeder,too (1:52).

5 hours ago, tuco74 said:

It would be awkward but not impossible. It would also likely be impractical in terms of game mechanics...but it's also something most people want to see. ....

Some people. I believe most people don't care that much.

Please don't get me wrong, I love AT-AT's like everyone else, but this is not Hoth game. This is Endor game. 1 shuttle full of rebels raiding Imperial outpost. Legion is planetside X-wing. ISD's do not belong to X-wing and AT-AT's do not belong to Legion. 2-3 Years from now, we might see planetside Armada. AT-AT's, speeders, artillery, aerial support etc. In Legion it will not work. If You take cover and maneuver part of this game, the only thing that's left is throwing dice at each other and that would be boring.

I have 2 X-Wing Epic ship on my shelf and they have not been played once. But I had to buy it to get some super important cards. I'd prefer not to do it again.

So please, people, buy Yourself some AT-AT model and do not ask FFG to manufacture one. You can have it cheaper and on the shelf, it will look exactly the same. On the board, wait for the right game.

There was an AT-AT on Endor (it's what dropped Luke off to Vader) so it is not a Hoth Exclusive vehicle.

Also, while the vehicles need to be larger, they don't need to be at the exact same ratio as the human(oid!) figures.

The 40K vehicles certainly don't match their troop counter parts(Just try and fit 10 space marines in a Rhino model!) and it still works really well, as long as the vehicles are scaled the same with themselves it should work even if they are different from the troops.

17 minutes ago, Lusiphur05 said:

The 40K vehicles certainly don't match their troop counter parts(Just try and fit 10 space marines in a Rhino model!) and it still works really well, as long as the vehicles are scaled the same with themselves it should work even if they are different from the troops.

Totally off topic, but 10 do fit without bases actually! Imperial Armour 2 gave the description of how eh stack in.

3 sit down each side. 3 stand in the middle secured by magboots and hand straps, and the sergeant sits with the driver. You can do this with models, honest....but it's tons of converting work.

Now whether it's incredibly stupid or not is a sperate issue, but they really do fit :D

On 8/28/2017 at 2:12 PM, Thraug said:

I'm still flummoxed FFG would make a ground battle game that couldn't recreate the Battle of Hoth. even with its larger scale, I assume eventually Legion will have an AT-AT, but I don't see a 6x3 play area allowing for the 5-6 AT-AT's in the Battle of Hoth. Booooo. :(

I was really hoping for a scale that would have allowed very large battles but I guess it's just IA 2.0

4 minutes ago, MRCWING said:

but I guess it's just IA 2.0

If you think that you either haven't played IA or haven't seen any of the demo's for the game.

4 minutes ago, MRCWING said:

I was really hoping for a scale that would have allowed very large battles but I guess it's just IA 2.0

IA is Luke, Leia Han and Chewie.

Legion is that plus Commando platoon with some heavy support.

Patience. You will have Your Hoth game in 2-3 years..

On 8/28/2017 at 3:12 PM, Thraug said:

I'm still flummoxed FFG would make a ground battle game that couldn't recreate the Battle of Hoth. even with its larger scale, I assume eventually Legion will have an AT-AT, but I don't see a 6x3 play area allowing for the 5-6 AT-AT's in the Battle of Hoth. Booooo. :(

FFG's Armada game can't recreate the Battle of Endor.

Why? Because you can't have a game where CR90s, Star Destroyers, and Super Star Destroyers are all in scale; because commanding 3-7 ships is a faster and better game experience than commanding 30 ships; and because the larger sculpts are better looking and more popular.

If the game was scaled down to allow 5-6 AT-ATs, then the scale would be ridiculous for any engagement without six AT-ATs. The number of units on the table would be unmanageable (how many Stormtrooper squadrons equal one AT-AT?), and the size of models wouldn't make any sense - like a game of Epic 40k without any Titans.

You can have infantry heavy battles, and you can have battles between giant machines of war, but you can't really do both in the same scale.

Companies like GW and PP compromise by having a larger scale and offering a much smaller maximum number of very large models, but the ability to put a single Warhound on the table isn't the same as the ability to have 12 Warhounds squaring off against each other.

AT-ATs do really belong in game. They arent just a Hoth thing.. they are a Scarif thing as well. Granted the AT-ACT is technically different, but they can shrug off missile fire as well.

An AT-AT, if it were to come to the game is assuredly going to be half to 2/3rds of your army.

if WotC could do an AT-AT, I'm sure FFG could do it as well, especially if I have to build and paint it myself.

Expect an AT-AT to be a top speed of 1 and no double move - perhaps only one action per activation?

The Imperial Troop Transport would also be a great vehicle. But we know so little about vehicles.. can we land our characters on top? Will the squish ground troops?

Don't fret. You will get your AT-AT. It is too good an opportunity to make money, so never mind the scale of the model or the scale of the game.

31 minutes ago, Rumar said:

You will get your AT-AT. It is too good an opportunity to make money, so never mind the scale of the model or the scale of the game.

People have been saying the same thing about ISD's for X-Wing and SSD's for Armada since they came out.. Yet neither has actually happened.

FFG will make any product that both sells well, and fits in with their vision of how the game should work. So you will never see a ISD in X-Wing. You may see a SSD in Armada, but I doubt it.

The only way you'll see a AT-AT in Legion is if they think it fits in the game.

Is there a non-goofy way to have a Snow Speeder in a battle? I'd hate to see it moving in 6-12" increments when it should be moving at 600-1200" increments!

14 minutes ago, Thraug said:

Is there a non-goofy way to have a Snow Speeder in a battle?

Same way you have speeder bikes... You just assume they, like your car don't have to go at max speed.

17 minutes ago, Thraug said:

Is there a non-goofy way to have a Snow Speeder in a battle? I'd hate to see it moving in 6-12" increments when it should be moving at 600-1200" increments!

The only non-goofy way would be to have Snow Speeders makings passes over the battlefield like air support in Flames of War. I don't see that for Legion.

2 hours ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

AT-ATs do really belong in game. They arent just a Hoth thing.. they are a Scarif thing as well. Granted the AT-ACT is technically different, but they can shrug off missile fire as well.

An AT-AT, if it were to come to the game is assuredly going to be half to 2/3rds of your army.

2

So i have this model. It is half of my army. You cannot destroy it. I almost cannot move, so I will just stand and shoot You 6 times because I can. How cool is that.....

Remember the point totals for this game are 800 and 1600.

8 hours ago, Bohun242 said:

Some people. I believe most people don't care that much.

Please don't get me wrong, I love AT-AT's like everyone else, but this is not Hoth game. This is Endor game. 1 shuttle full of rebels raiding Imperial outpost. Legion is planetside X-wing. ISD's do not belong to X-wing and AT-AT's do not belong to Legion. 2-3 Years from now, we might see planetside Armada. AT-AT's, speeders, artillery, aerial support etc. In Legion it will not work. If You take cover and maneuver part of this game, the only thing that's left is throwing dice at each other and that would be boring.

I have 2 X-Wing Epic ship on my shelf and they have not been played once. But I had to buy it to get some super important cards. I'd prefer not to do it again.

So please, people, buy Yourself some AT-AT model and do not ask FFG to manufacture one. You can have it cheaper and on the shelf, it will look exactly the same. On the board, wait for the right game.

But Imperial Assault was supposed to be planetside X-Wing! The next FFG SW ground installment should have been larger in scope!

I know it's useless to complain about it now, and plenty of people want Legion. But I don't think I'm going to get over my disappointment that this game is in, more or less, the exact same scale as a game that already exists, covering pretty much the same subject (infantry and characters figthing infantry and characters).

I wouldn't want AT-ATs for legion either, the scale is inappropriate. What I would have wanted personally is a game where heavier Star Wars armor fit better. I wanted to snap up AT-STs like I snap up light ships in Armada. That's not going to happen here. The best I can hope for is crowds of stormtroopers... but... how much different would the experience be from doing the same in Imperial Assault... a game I already own, and does so much more for more players?

22 hours ago, Paperstraw said:

I've been looking into other scale model kits that could work as Legion stand-ins/terrain and I ended up buying one of the old AMT TIE Fighter kits for use in my planned Imperial Hangar table. During my travels I also found these other kits that may be in scale or a little under or over-sized (but fine for the scale otherwise).

Other scale kits are:

  • 1/48 AMT Vulture Droids
  • 1/58 Revell X-Wing
  • 1/51 AMT X-Wing
  • 1/48 Bandai X-Wing
  • 1/48 SMT Y-Wing
  • 1/48 MPC/AMT TIE Interceptor (inaccurate details)
  • 1/51 AMT TIE Fighter
  • 1/48 Bandai Snowspeeder
  • 1/48 SMT Snowspeeder
  • 1/48 SMT R-41 Starchaser
  • 1/48 AMT N-1 Starfighter
  • 1/48 Zarkus Model Kits KSE-12a Dagger Fighter
  • 1/48 SMT Cloakshape Fighter
  • 1/48 SMT B-Wing (huge kit)
  • 1/48 Bandai AT-ST
  • 1/53 SMT AT-AT (another huge kit)
  • 1/48 AMT A-Wing
  • 1/48 SMT A-Wing

Some of these kits are very old, or garage kits so might be very difficult to find or expensive. Good luck!

If you can still find it, the Hasbro Rogue One U-wing is pretty close to scale for these figures. I just picked one up for "terrain". Now it just needs some weathering. Luckily there are some great Tutorials online already.

11 hours ago, Norsehound said:

But Imperial Assault was supposed to be planetside X-Wing! The next FFG SW ground installment should have been larger in scope!

According to whom? Because that's nothing FFG has ever said. Also 15mm and smaller quite simply do not sell as well as 28mm and larger. Also IA is nothing like X-Wing on the ground. It's Decent with a Star Wars theme, it is not a way to play out small scale battles between troops.

9 hours ago, ID X T said:

If you can still find it, the Hasbro Rogue One U-wing is pretty close to scale for these figures. I just picked one up for "terrain". Now it just needs some weathering. Luckily there are some great Tutorials online already.

So is the Hasbro Jango Fett version of Slave I :)

41 minutes ago, VanorDM said:

...it is not a way to play out small scale battles between troops.

According to whom? There are trooper figurines, I activate them to roll dice and shoot at targets. Same subject matter. The only difference is IA is mostly indoors, and Legion is mostly outdoors.

I'm aware FFG didn't make any promises that this would be large scale, but I think many of us wanted a battle of Hoth game ever since Armada was announced. It's disappointing that Legion turned out to be gridless IA after all. I for one am more interested in armor battles than infantry ones, so Legion doesn't do it for me on that basis. But it could have... if FFG had gone forward to do this game on a new scope instead of more of the same.

26 minutes ago, Norsehound said:

I'm aware FFG didn't make any promises that this would be large scale, but I think many of us wanted a battle of Hoth game ever since Armada was announced. It's disappointing that Legion turned out to be gridless IA after all. I for one am more interested in armor battles than infantry ones, so Legion doesn't do it for me on that basis. But it could have... if FFG had gone forward to do this game on a new scope instead of more of the same.

I don't see what would stop you recreating Hoth at this point. You might need to homebrew AT AT rules but otherwise it looks like everything you need is achievable with Legion.

2 minutes ago, tuco74 said:

I don't see what would stop you recreating Hoth at this point.

Also I don't see why anyone would want to recreate Hoth anyway... It wasn't an actual battle or anything. It was the Rebel Alliance running away from a massively overwhelming force. The only thing they were trying to do was slow the Imperial troops down enough to get as much of their stuff off planet as possible.

The rebels never stood a chance and everyone knew it. It would be fun maybe once...