My brother-in-law and I touched on this in one of our latest videos. We don't plan on stopping playing Imperial Assault, but I think there will be a drop in attendance when it comes to Skirmish events.

I have one of everything Hoth-related for Imperial Assault. I meant, I won't bother buying anything for a new, scale-creeped game until Hoth armies are released for it. I have a b(^%h of a time painting anything larger than true 25mm. And for me playing with unpainted miniatures defeats the purpose. But it's Hoth, so, yeah. Sigh.

I would like it the rebels got more stuff in IA for Hoth. Non-unique tauntaun riders, in particular.

7 hours ago, Tvboy said:

I was just using Armada as a filler example, replace with Destiny, X-Wing, Magic, Rebellion, Pokemon, whatever, my point is that Legion and IA are going to feel similar enough to someone that owns both that if they also play a 3rd game, that 3rd game will probably be more attractive than IA after playing Legion.

But I think you're post is similar to many others I've seen since the announcement, which is that IA players might not be the target audience for Legion. I'm hopeful that Legion will be a Warhammer killer instead and IA players will just stick with IA.

And I was just using Armada as a filler example too. Replace it with any game that is 2 hours+ of game length. My point was that game length is a factor to take into consideration when comparing the two games. Not everybody is looking for a game that takes too many time to finish, especially gamers with a wife or children. What good is a game if you don't have the time to play a full game ibn the first place. Legion will turn off a lot of gamer just because of that aspect. Add to that all the time needed to paint the miniatures...

And yes, I don't think that IA players is the target audiance for Legion, that's why I don't get all the panic from some players that Legion is spelling the doom of IA. I think Imperial Assault will be just fine. Legion is aiming at the Warhammer players. FFG is not canibalizing its own games, it is trying to get gamers that they still can't get yet. Will some IA players stop playing to play Legion? Of course, but I think that is only because IA was not entirely the game they were looking for in the first place.

For my part, I'm always glad to see a new Star wars game, wether I want to play it or not. It is a very good time to be a Star Wars fan.

On 8/31/2017 at 11:47 AM, Guardsman75 said:

My brother-in-law and I touched on this in one of our latest videos. We don't plan on stopping playing Imperial Assault, but I think there will be a drop in attendance when it comes to Skirmish events.

Can't get any worse out in northern CA.

On 8/31/2017 at 5:54 PM, TauntaunScout said:

I have one of everything Hoth-related for Imperial Assault. I meant, I won't bother buying anything for a new, scale-creeped game until Hoth armies are released for it. I have a b(^%h of a time painting anything larger than true 25mm. And for me playing with unpainted miniatures defeats the purpose. But it's Hoth, so, yeah. Sigh.

I would like it the rebels got more stuff in IA for Hoth. Non-unique tauntaun riders, in particular.

Yeah, disappointed as well -- I wanted a true Battle of Hoth opportunity (like the old WEG Assault on Hoth game, but with modern design, more flexible, and applicable to a range of battles). We'll see; Legion doesn't appear to do that and is redundant to IA in my mind. Were I to pick it up, I'd drop IA. I'm expecting to see a drop in IA skirmish players in my area (already a small number); a number of our IA players are prior WH40k pplayers.

Anyway, I've decided to do what FFG didn't, and write my own Star Wars minis game for air/ground battles aiming for the 6-10mm scale, using Micro Machines as my pre-painted miniatures.

Oh boy, I would just recommend, that the unsubstantiated claims should have some basis in fact rather then just guessing IA is just going to have resources reallocated to legion and that will slow down etc. Imperial Assault has Paul and Todd, and they have no plans of stopping and are very dedicated to growing the game from the last podcasts and talks. Skirmish is growing a bit around here and Legion wont even be released till April-May of next year given FFG history with only a few units available initially? I think the other games such as Xwing and Destiny take the player base more then Legion would. Legion has more of the miniature 'hobby' aspect and truly has a different player base then the 'get out and play' crowd especially for competitive play. Did Armada even touch Xwing's crowd? With 2 hour rounds, 800 point armies, Legion is probably competing with 40K and even Runewars more then IA. Costs is also going to be a huge factor in the cross over.

Todd and two others, actually. Paul Winchester has been making music as a career for quite a while now.

http://www.paulwinchester.com/about

On 9/2/2017 at 3:03 PM, caseycheesecake said:

Can't get any worse out in northern CA.

or in New Zealand. 4 players... hey at least i always get top 8

I have my gaming group of like 8 people. We play whatever, once a week. No game will ever be "more" or "less" well attended than that in my "area". It's alien to me to focus on having a large community of strangers instead of plain old friends.

Honestly this game might get me to drop IA. We'll see. I am getting bored by the lack of Hoth models for IA. I'll finish painting my large collection for fun but I might sell it all shortly after. Also, something that is not Fantasy Flight's fault in the least, I find that fictional game settings just aren't holding their own against historical any more, for me. It is really hard for a fictional game setting to strike the right balance. Too much background and detail and I feel straight-jacketed by it. This is why I never could get into any of the Warmahordes stuff for example. Not enough detail, and, well, why play it as opposed to one of the many generic systems available?

Legion looks so far, like it uses a general approach to games that I find boring. Bonuses and penalties are not my idea of a tactical game but of a math puzzle and I find games like that boring. If there's too many unintuitive variables and stuff to keep track of in a game in order to make intelligent command decisions, I don't feel like it's worth the brain power. I could go learn French or the geography of Switzerland or something real instead.

On September 2, 2017 at 7:19 AM, Hawkstrike said:

Yeah, disappointed as well -- I wanted a true Battle of Hoth opportunity (like the old WEG Assault on Hoth game, but with modern design, more flexible, and applicable to a range of battles).

Good call on the old WEG game. That's one of those games that would be amazing to update in the modern gaming world of over-produced components. I can see it now;

Plastic miniatures for all the walkers, speeders, and soldiers. A big neoprene playmat for the board. It would be a thing of beauty.

Unfortunately, strictly speaking with "classic" Star Wars, these epic ground battles the Legion marketing hype wants to evoke are exactly that; these very specific moments in two of the movies that themselves only had a very narrow number of "unit types" to be seen and made into game components.

It would definitely be a game worth picking up if it was made, but Assault on Hoth would be a self contained box set, and that's generally not Fantasy Flight's style, as they're all about getting those expansions out.

5 hours ago, TauntaunScout said:

Legion looks so far, like it uses a general approach to games that I find boring. Bonuses and penalties are not my idea of a tactical game but of a math puzzle and I find games like that boring. If there's too many unintuitive variables and stuff to keep track of in a game in order to make intelligent command decisions, I don't feel like it's worth the brain power.

Have you ever played anything from the "Commands and Colors" family of board games? Fantasy Flight themselves have a couple of games from the group with Battles of Westeros and Battlelore 2nd Edition. Though not historical themselves, the original series of games that started the genre are all historical based, from ancient battles, to Napoleon, World War I, etc.

The basic premise if you don't know, or really to anyone reading this that doesn't know, is that the board is a hex grid, divided into 3 sections, left/centre/right, and you and your opponent execute movement and attacks by playing cards from your hand that order X-Number of units from across the different sections.

For example the order card you play for you turn could require you to move 2 units on the left flank, and one in the middle, and that's your turn. The game becomes more of a tactical play at that point, as you can't just algorithmically min-max a list and play it out in an automaton-like trance of optimal moves. The combat is super light, generally, and the game is scenario-based. It generally plays quickly, and isn't super hung up on a lot of simulation rules, bonuses and penalties. It really comes down to trying to make the most out of the literal hand you've been dealt, and if that's not a life lesson in gaming, I don't know what is.

For me when it comes to all these SW games and trying to NOT go broke keeping up, it's a matter of what I need for which games:

-Rebellion (and to an extent, IA) are probably the easiest for me to keep up with. Those, I can fit in between other things, or just grab them last. I think Legion will fall into this category. I'll get a Core Set of course, and then I'll see what (or if) I want to get anything else (I LOVE the map/playmats for IA!).
-X-Wing is the game I probably play the most, BUT it's also the game I need the least of. There are only a couple ships I need to get, and then this will get bumped behind Rebellion/IA while waiting for the Blastboat.
-Armada is the game that I not only have the least of, but need the most of. So, right now, Armada has my wallet priority.

See, I'm (thank God) NOT a "one of everything" player when it comes to these games. I have set goals to where I want to get to in order to play the game, and once I get there, I'm on cruise control from then on:
-Armada: enough to do at least 2 different 400-point builds for each side. That way it's not basically the same 400-point Empire vs the same 400-point Rebels every dang time.
-X-Wing: multiple 100-point builds for Rebel and Empire. I'm ALREADY at this point, just need one more ship (maybe two) to get to cruise control status, and even that one or two ships I'll have soon anyway.
-IA: I'm really already on cruise control here, but I could always get a map playmat here and there.
-Rebellion: I'll pick up the expansion at some point.

I DO feel for anyone that wants to try getting into multiple games all at once. Shelling out the cash for two (or more) Core Sets at once.....yikes!

On 9/4/2017 at 9:37 AM, Spidey NZ said:

or in New Zealand. 4 players... hey at least i always get top 8

Hey, we've been getting 6 for actual tournaments. At least you have to earn those top 4 prizes

Cleardave,

That sounds like it is influenced by circa 1970 historical boardgames alright. But I really like model battlefields to push my man-dolls around on. The game is second to the pieces for me.

To this end I am in the midst of painting up a huge collection of WEG Hoth stuff. I am not interested in repeatedly recreating Hoth per se, but in generally setting my Star Wars games in arctic settings with forces to match. So I am collecting "hoth" rebels but they are really just rebels in winter uniforms if that makes sense.

On September 5, 2017 at 1:48 PM, TauntaunScout said:

To this end I am in the midst of painting up a huge collection of WEG Hoth stuff. I am not interested in repeatedly recreating Hoth per se, but in generally setting my Star Wars games in arctic settings with forces to match. So I am collecting "hoth" rebels but they are really just rebels in winter uniforms if that makes sense.

That's really the problem with doing a "classic" Star Wars ground battle game. There were only two in the movies, so you'd have to venture into some expanded territory to fill out the game, but it won't have the same mass appeal as "Battle of Hoth" for instance.

As gamers, our tastes our all different of course, so some people would be fine with transplanting it into any setting, but some hardcore wargamers would also want that ability AND the game itself to reach detailed simulation levels of mechanics, while others want something they can wrap up in a couple of hours.

Enjoy the collecting journey and painting all those Snowtroopers. It's the worst part of the IA hobby for me; each release puts more Stormtrooper variants in my painting queue and I want to throw up a little at the thought of grinding out more white armour.

I am not looking forward to painting more 50 more Storm Troopers...

On 8/31/2017 at 10:13 PM, Red Castle said:

And yes, I don't think that IA players is the target audiance for Legion, that's why I don't get all the panic from some players that Legion is spelling the doom of IA. I think Imperial Assault will be just fine. Legion is aiming at the Warhammer players. FFG is not canibalizing its own games, it is trying to get gamers that they still can't get yet. Will some IA players stop playing to play Legion? Of course, but I think that is only because IA was not entirely the game they were looking for in the first place.

For my part, I'm always glad to see a new Star wars game, wether I want to play it or not. It is a very good time to be a Star Wars fan.

After some thought, I think you're right. IA as a game itself will survive. Skirmish is another story. However, as long as they keep selling IA (ie. campaign and painting lovers keeping it alive), skirmish should survive too. It's not like it can get much worse. LOL

On 9/12/2017 at 2:54 PM, FreddieG said:

I am not looking forward to painting more 50 more Storm Troopers...

You and me both. I can't stand painting Stormies.

On 9/9/2017 at 9:10 AM, cleardave said:

That's really the problem with doing a "classic" Star Wars ground battle game. There were only two in the movies, so you'd have to venture into some expanded territory to fill out the game, but it won't have the same mass appeal as "Battle of Hoth" for instance.

As gamers, our tastes our all different of course, so some people would be fine with transplanting it into any setting, but some hardcore wargamers would also want that ability AND the game itself to reach detailed simulation levels of mechanics, while others want something they can wrap up in a couple of hours.

Enjoy the collecting journey and painting all those Snowtroopers. It's the worst part of the IA hobby for me; each release puts more Stormtrooper variants in my painting queue and I want to throw up a little at the thought of grinding out more white armour.

LOL! I think you hit the nail on the head for me. I don't want to paint the same things over and over. I like painting, but I want to play. I also like the objective aspect and map navigation of IA skirmish. It's also so portable and easy to play on any regular table.

On 8/31/2017 at 0:58 PM, Red Castle said:

It depends. An IA game is what? 60 minutes? A Legion game will probably be over 2 hours, like Armada.

I know that it is a factor for me. It's easier for me to fit an Imperial Assault, Destiny or X-Wing game than it is for Armada. That's why I hardly play Armada anymore and why I won't buy into Legion. I just don't have the time.

Agreed. I like the portability and quick game play. (not counting slow players who come with ANY gaming community). I also like how you can make any deployment group useful.

I'm not one to be negative, especially when it comes to people's preferences. However, I never imagined Luke and Darth Vader having a lightsaber duel in the middle of the battlefield! Yet, this is how they launch it. LOL

In saying that, to each his own. If you love games like Legion, enjoy!

On 9/9/2017 at 9:10 AM, cleardave said:

I want to throw up a little at the thought of grinding out more white armour.

Which is why I think they should have released Imperial navy or army troopers instead of expanded universe stormtroopers.

1 hour ago, TauntaunScout said:

Which is why I think they should have released Imperial navy or army troopers instead of expanded universe stormtroopers.

I would slightly disagree with you there.

For "our" purposes, Navy Troopers with their crazy black helmets would be a nice change for the sake of variety.

From a "sales" perspective, knowing that "hey, remember 'X' ?!" is what gets people to take a look at shiny box art when they're in a store, Stormtroopers are always going to be recognizable to masses over Navy Troopers. It makes sense for Legion to drop all those Stormtroopers for that reason. Not inspired to collect and paint more Stormtroopers if I don't have to, and after all, it's a tabletop hobby game launching in a sea of tabletop games and hobbies within them, so I most certainly don't.

There are no stormtroopers on the front cover of most of the boxes. But we have stormtroopers inside every box but one. C'mon, are ugnaughts and Bespin guards really a hot n' juicy marketing ploy? I doubt it. Who was pining away for them to release models of the droids that came in the Hoth box? It all seems kinda arbitrary. So jetpack stormtroopers, spy vs spy stormtroopers in black scout armor... c'mon just give us some naval guards to use with the star destroyer tiles already!

Or better yet, give us lots more Hoth stuff. Yeah that's the ticket! If they like glossy armored minions so much, give us AT-AT drivers! Or really quit wasting time and release a rebel scout. On a tauntaun...

Didn't the HK droids come in the Hoth box? I want more of them...and more snow troopers

1 hour ago, qwertyuiop said:

Didn't the HK droids come in the Hoth box? I want more of them...and more snow troopers

Then buy another RTH box.