11 minutes ago, TheItsyBitsySpider said:

Phoenix is especially hosed because being honored is how they win fights in the first place. Its a very brutal counter that a Phoenix deck needs to now build counters for.

No argument there. With most of our honoring effects requiring we win a conflict as a cost, it suddenly became a whole lot easier to be DIS-honored than honored, it seems. It also turns into a catch-22, we need honored status to win conflicts, but we need to win conflicts to gain honored status. And in the meanwhile being dishonored makes so many characters useless, including our clan champ.

Looking back over cards, I'd say this reveal just raised the value of Noble Sacrifice by a bit. Sacrifice an honored character on its way out the door, and then take your pick of dishonored Scorpions to discard? Yes, please.

1 minute ago, Zesu Shadaban said:

No argument there. With most of our honoring effects requiring we win a conflict as a cost, it suddenly became a whole lot easier to be DIS-honored than honored, it seems. It also turns into a catch-22, we need honored status to win conflicts, but we need to win conflicts to gain honored status. And in the meanwhile being dishonored makes so many characters useless, including our clan champ.

What we need to do is deny Scorpion the fire ring, get at least one guy honored and then Splash crane to counter the Way of Scorpion. Plus Assassination to remove the Soshi.

On another note, Scorpion feel like they have a couple more unique then average, which will mess with their personality bases more.

4 minutes ago, TheItsyBitsySpider said:

On another note, Scorpion feel like they have a couple more unique then average, which will mess with their personality bases more.

Looking at the card list google doc, they have 3 uniques + Clan Champ, which ties them with Crane. All other clans appear to have 2 uniques + Clan Champ (Dragon has 1 unique Dynasty + 1 unique Conflict, everyone else has both their uniques in the Dynasty deck).

10 minutes ago, TheItsyBitsySpider said:

What we need to do is deny Scorpion the fire ring

Good thing Way of the Phoenix lets you do that pretty much at will then.

I'm not quite getting all the doom and gloom. Honoring Phoenix should be somewhat hard, because it's almost a win condition unto itself. Honored Tsukune supported by the stronghold is 10/10. If Scorpion didn't have a way to dishonor they would probably just lose at that point.

The phoenix bandwagon has died. All hail the scorpion bandwagon.

3 minutes ago, Nickciufi said:

The phoenix bandwagon has died. All hail the scorpion bandwagon.

The bandwagon ain't dead, it just has a broken axle. And 2 of the oxen died. Someone has typhoid. And the river in front of us is really deep.
On the bright side, maybe the Naive Student or Meddling Mediator has a spare axle for repairs?

3 minutes ago, Nickciufi said:

The phoenix bandwagon has died. All hail the scorpion bandwagon.

Haha, I don't think it's that much... but...

Bayushi Yunako #1 waifu - no wonder Shoju was into her. If she swapped his MIL and POL he could go blow for blow with Kisada!

Also I love the art on Shosuko Miyako. Snowsuit ninja are the best since Storm Shadow

I am impressed.

They look sufficiently fun and different from the other clans to play. I will be glad to play them. From their read, I would think them harder than some of the others to play. Especially for long periods of time. Not a bad thing but it can matter in tournaments. I would think that most people who can assess board state quickly will be fine with them though...

Scorpion players better get used to being the person sitting in the corner checking their phone, cause playing them is not going to make you any friends. I predict the price of tables is going up, because many are going to be flipped.

Wait a minute... Yunako targets Moto Horde in combat and makes them (an Army) go home because they suddenly become politicians. XD

As a Phoenix fan who already feels like we are a bit behind the curve compared to some other clans, this preview is most unwelcome indeed.

On the other hand, the artwork on the Scorpion cards looks absolutely stunning, and they look like they'll be really fun to play.

Looks like that vacant slot in my 'Top 3 clans' list has now been filled...

1 minute ago, Wintersong said:

Wait a minute... Yunako targets Moto Horde in combat and makes them (an Army) go home because they suddenly become politicians. XD

They always were politicians though - they just didn't understand Rokugani culture. The word "Moto" in Rokugan MEANS to speak as loud as your sword can swing.. Or at least that is what Yunako said, and it sounded pretty convincing at the time.. so they went home because all they could do was fiercely swing their mighty swords, but it was all just talk in a fight with real weapons...

6 minutes ago, Wintersong said:

Wait a minute... Yunako targets Moto Horde in combat and makes them (an Army) go home because they suddenly become politicians. XD

It'd be a shame to have that switch flipped on them after using Captive Audience...

Should I worry that Sinister Soshi has dash in military and political?

Nice preview. One must love to hate these guys.

1 hour ago, Araenon said:

The thing is: Crane *depend* on them being honorable and having strong pol characters. Apart from that, they have no strengths whatsoever. Scorpion can outright deny them become honorable, can make them lose honorable, can change their strong suit (pol) to mean nothing with interchange mil/pol, prevent some characters from entering combat, gain more tools with higher honor bids, after which steal back lost honor, and at the end of the day Scorpion have pol characters who are strong enough to battle non-honored crane and their mil capabilities are on par, if not better. TLDR: they deny advantages of Crane while not losing anything themselves and having more tools in the form of cards on their hand. But poor Phoenix is even worse.

I get where you are coming from, but I stand by my hot take. From what I can see, Scorpion has 3 potential ways in clan to dishonor their opponent, Crane has 5 cards that can oppose it. Add on top of that cards like Art of Peace, Savvy Politician, and Artisan Academy (making it less necessary to pay honor to draw) and combine it with the Scorpion penchant of dishonoring their own characters/sacrificing honor and I really don't know if it is fair to say Scorpion can shut down the Crane's honor game...

20 minutes ago, shosuko said:

Haha, I don't think it's that much... but...

Bayushi Yunako #1 waifu - no wonder Shoju was into her. If she swapped his MIL and POL he could go blow for blow with Kisada!

Also I love the art on Shosuko Miyako. Snowsuit ninja are the best since Storm Shadow

They just didn't want to miss Matsu Hiroru.???

1 hour ago, Togashi Gao Shan said:

Well, I'd say that to make consistent use of the Edict, you'll need at least 3 different (9 total) Courtiers in your deck(s), and preferably 4 (12). Not all clans can really manage that out of the core set.

Ide Messenger (C), Giver of Gifts (D), Ide Trader (D) and Otomo Courtier (D, D'oh!).

Unicorn: Captive Audience!

Scorpion: Forged Edict!

Unicorn: Forged Edict!

Scorpion: Really?

Unicorn: *shrug*

1 hour ago, DarkArk said:

Holy crap, I've been undecided up till now, but the amount of "nope" that the Scorpion has looks hilarious. New to L5R, so no previous loyalty, but definitely decided to give them a go first.

Definitely. None of their characters outside Shoju has impressive stats, and they're going to have to hold on to fate to play all their tricks. Also their province seems rather weak compared to some of the others, and the stronghold only gives +1 versus most clans +2.

The province actually seems rather strong. 4 strength is pretty high, And the effect is very useful, especially if you get multiple uses. It lets you search the top 5 cards of your deck for what you want.

Edit: province not stronghold.

2 minutes ago, Wintersong said:

Ide Messenger (C), Giver of Gifts (D), Ide Trader (D) and Otomo Courtier (D, D'oh!).

Unicorn: Captive Audience!

Scorpion: Forged Edict!

Unicorn: Forged Edict!

Scorpion: Really?

Unicorn: *shrug*

Alternately...

""

Scorpion: Forged Edict!

Unicorn? (LBR, Crane, Lion, or Phoenix more likely): Voice of Honor!

23 minutes ago, Wintersong said:

Wait a minute... Yunako targets Moto Horde in combat and makes them (an Army) go home because they suddenly become politicians. XD

Ha! The joke is on you, for this is actually a dance battle!

Yogo Hirue combo versus moto horde. Declare political attack, call them in, they bow and leave, if you win the battle dishonor them also. Now if there were only a way to fight the unicorn as first player lol

My current quest is trying to figure out what the most compelling splashes are for Scorpion. Obviously I'm all about that InvertiBros/Pincer Pals but on face value very few other clans seem compelling to pair with them... Crane bring the usuals (Above Question, mostly... Height of Fashion, too), plus I have to imagine Noble Sacrifice will come in handy at some point for the Scorpion player. But like... is there any strong reason to pair them with another clan?

Just now, Zetsubou said:

My current quest is trying to figure out what the most compelling splashes are for Scorpion. Obviously I'm all about that InvertiBros/Pincer Pals but on face value very few other clans seem compelling to pair with them... Crane bring the usuals (Above Question, mostly... Height of Fashion, too), plus I have to imagine Noble Sacrifice will come in handy at some point for the Scorpion player. But like... is there any strong reason to pair them with another clan?

Dragon, as they bring bowing and attachment removal and covert out of hand, Lion for anti bowing and vengeful oath weirdos out of your hand, and unicorn for spy glass, hand characters, and mounts.

4 minutes ago, Taki said:

Yogo Hirue combo versus moto horde. Declare political attack, call them in, they bow and leave, if you win the battle dishonor them also. Now if there were only a way to fight the unicorn as first player lol

Would the horde be a legal target for Hirue? Can a character with a dash be moved into a conflict they're not eligible to participate in? The rules say "If a character has a dash (–) for a skill value, that character cannot participate in conflicts of that type", but I don't know if Hirue's ability supersedes that.